230 Grain Pin Loads

[gargoil66]

Guys:

 

First -- YES -- I did read the 2K8 posts about bowling pin loads using the 230 grain .38 wadcutters.  

 

One of the guys came upon a bunch of bowling pins and wants to have a stage during a SC match being a pin shoot.  

 

Last Pin Shoot I did was in the early 80's using a chopped Colt 1917.  Was fun but not to the point where I sought out pin matches.

 

Badman Bullets seems to be the only place I found any 230's for pins and they are out of stock.  Was going to beg for some here but might as well just buy a mold and cast what I need.  Who knows, I may take to pin shooting once I run through a few arrays again.

 

So I ordered a 4 cavity mold from Accurate Molds and will spend the time casting and powder coating the bullets.

 

Load data is sparce and I would prefer not to extrapolate on this one.  230 grain bullets out of a 627 is a leap in terms of bullet weights and consuming case volume.  

 

I have plenty of .38 Spl and .357 Mag brass.

 

The powders I have are Ramshot Comp, 231, Tite Group, and some Shooters World Ultimate Pistol.  Even some Winchester Auto Comp.

 

So, questions are as follows.

 

.38 Spl or .357 brass?

 

Recommended starting loads using one or more of the powders I listed above.

 

Things I need to pay attention to when loading and during load development.

 

Thankyou.

 

GG

 

 

[Squirrel45]

Accurate Powder no under Hodgdon has actual load data for this bullet. Youll want to use something moderate to slow. Auto comp would be the fastest powder I would go with that you have on hand. Accurate #7 or #9 would be better. I will say the 230 "Lincoln logs" take them out like nothing else even at a low velocity.  As where to get these bullets, Steve Miller at Bear Creek Supply has them bearcreeeksupplybullets.com . He actually makes a few runs of these each year for myself and friends. Not to many people shooting pins any longer   sad to say. Let me know if you have any question 

 

Squirrel

[mchapman]

I would suggest that you stick with 38 spl  cases, the 357 might be a bit long. I cast and powder coat my 230's and they work great. Projectile is .915, and the loaded round is 1.605 OAL. Pictures of them and my dirty gun will show what I am talking about. I use 5.5grs. of Blue Dot, and am getting a soft shooting round that is around 180/190 PF. YMMV.

[Joe4d]

might want to check your rule set. 
Lots of different ways to run a pin match. Place I shot had OPEN,,, 5 pins front of table,,, Revolver was 5 pins 1 foot from rear,,, so really no need for super heavy loads. I shot 180's at 850 fps

[gargoil66]

1 hour ago, Squirrel45 said:

Accurate Powder no under Hodgdon has actual load data for this bullet. Youll want to use something moderate to slow. Auto comp would be the fastest powder I would go with that you have on hand. Accurate #7 or #9 would be better. I will say the 230 "Lincoln logs" take them out like nothing else even at a low velocity.  As where to get these bullets, Steve Miller at Bear Creek Supply has them bearcreeeksupplybullets.com . He actually makes a few runs of these each year for myself and friends. Not to many people shooting pins any longer   sad to say. Let me know if you have any question 

 

Squirrel

S45:

 

Thankyou.

 

Found the Accurate Powder data on the 230's.  

 

And I believe I have some AA-7 and AA-9 too.

 

GG

[gargoil66]

3 minutes ago, Joe4d said:

might want to check your rule set. 
Lots of different ways to run a pin match. Place I shot had OPEN,,, 5 pins front of table,,, Revolver was 5 pins 1 foot from rear,,, so really no need for super heavy loads. I shot 180's at 850 fps

Joe:

 

Roger, but I have no idea what sort of table they will come up with or if they will spot the pins based on pistol or revolver.   

 

I figure they will use a four food wide table and run the pins down the middle.  The guys shooting 9mm will probably have a rough time.  

 

GG

[gargoil66]

1 hour ago, mchapman said:

I would suggest that you stick with 38 spl  cases, the 357 might be a bit long. I cast and powder coat my 230's and they work great. Projectile is .915, and the loaded round is 1.605 OAL. Pictures of them and my dirty gun will show what I am talking about. I use 5.5grs. of Blue Dot, and am getting a soft shooting round that is around 180/190 PF. YMMV.

Man, those are right up there.  A very firm crimp needed.  

[Joe4d]

9 minutes ago, gargoil66 said:

Joe:

 

Roger, but I have no idea what sort of table they will come up with or if they will spot the pins based on pistol or revolver.   

 

I figure they will use a four food wide table and run the pins down the middle.  The guys shooting 9mm will probably have a rough time.  

 

GG

Yeh I showed at my first match with 200 pf loads for revolver,,, Found I didnt need them based on the rule set they used. 
Although I used up what I had,, and shot my revolver in OPEN,,, 5 pins 1 foot from front on a 4X8 piece of plywood.
Then second entry I shot revolver, 5 pins 1 foot from rear. 
Far as your question all the licoln log loads I saw were for much slower powders..
Humm Mr Palermo passed away  but was a wealth of pin data.. His websight is no more so looks we lost alot of good knowledge. He had whole articles on loading these bullets.

[gargoil66]

2 minutes ago, Joe4d said:

Yeh I showed at my first match with 200 pf loads for revolver,,, Found I didnt need them based on the rule set they used. 
Although I used up what I had,, and shot my revolver in OPEN,,, 5 pins 1 foot from front on a 4X8 piece of plywood.
Then second entry I shot revolver, 5 pins 1 foot from rear. 
Far as your question all the licoln log loads I saw were for much slower powders..
Humm Mr Palermo passed away  but was a wealth of pin data.. His websight is no more so looks we lost alot of good knowledge. He had whole articles on loading these bullets.

J4D:

 

I think I will use the AA data and some AA-7 and AA-9.  Will run them over a chrono to see what I am getting for velocities.  Not that I have a clue what sort of velocities are ideal for pins but I have a few bowling pins I can use for testing.  

 

Good stuff.

 

GG

[Joe4d]

When I got my bullets from him he recommended a softer alloy than is typical for cast bullets. 

[Squirrel45]

2 hours ago, gargoil66 said:

J4D:

 

I think I will use the AA data and some AA-7 and AA-9.  Will run them over a chrono to see what I am getting for velocities.  Not that I have a clue what sort of velocities are ideal for pins but I have a few bowling pins I can use for testing.  

 

Good stuff.

 

GG

Somewhere around 800-850 would be nice in a fullsize 

[EEH]

I loaded a bunch of 230 gr wad cutter bullets, with blue dot powder and 38 special brass for pins. Worked well but smokeyyy.

I’ll try to find load data.

[EEH]

Load data. 6.1 blue dot powder @1.445 fed primers.. 38 special case

[gargoil66]

4 hours ago, EEH said:

Load data. 6.1 blue dot powder @1.445 fed primers.. 38 special case

EEH:

 

Thanks for the data.  Blue Dot isn't a powder in my inventory and I probably won't buy any because I am not sure how many times we will shoot pins. 

 

I checked my powders and have eight pounds of AA-7 so that is the powder I will use.  Relative burn rate next to Blue Dot and published data.

 

GG

[Squirrel45]

#7 is a solid çhoice 

[Joe4d]

AA7 and 38 special cases at 357 OAL,,, If you use 357 cases, you could end up with bulged cases before you get them short enough to not stick out the cylinder.

[gargoil66]

19 minutes ago, Joe4d said:

AA7 and 38 special cases at 357 OAL,,, If you use 357 cases, you could end up with bulged cases before you get them short enough to not stick out the cylinder.

J4D:

 

Will be .38 Spl cases.  FWIW I bought an M Die just in case the bullet is so long it would otherwise bulge the case.  

 

GG

[Squirrel45]

I load them with no M die, however that would certainly help. I have no issues loading bear creeks 230s.

[pcschwenke]

I’ve been looking for the same information as you.  At The Pin Shoot, full power loads are needed to knock pins 3’ off the 3 tier table.   230gr bullets are what most use, especially in 38 special cases.   Blue Dot is the powder of choice, but as others mention, #7 or 9 work on too.   Most are running the loads quite a lot hotter than mention above.  It’s been frustrating to see no one has been making these bullets for several years and Blue Dot is impossible to find… 

[EEH]

7 minutes ago, pcschwenke said:

I’ve been looking for the same information as you.  At The Pin Shoot, full power loads are needed to knock pins 3’ off the 3 tier table.   230gr bullets are what most use, especially in 38 special cases.   Blue Dot is the powder of choice, but as others mention, #7 or 9 work on too.   Most are running the loads quite a lot hotter than mention above.  It’s been frustrating to see no one has been making these bullets for several years and Blue Dot is impossible to find… 

Didn’t you get some bullets from me ?

[gargoil66]

2 hours ago, pcschwenke said:

I’ve been looking for the same information as you.  At The Pin Shoot, full power loads are needed to knock pins 3’ off the 3 tier table.   230gr bullets are what most use, especially in 38 special cases.   Blue Dot is the powder of choice, but as others mention, #7 or 9 work on too.   Most are running the loads quite a lot hotter than mention above.  It’s been frustrating to see no one has been making these bullets for several years and Blue Dot is impossible to find… 

PW:

 

One of the guys mentioned Bear Creek for the pin bullets.  I looked and they are in their catalogue.  Have to call them to ask if they have any in stock.  Was going to but since I just spent $150.00 on a four cavity mold, I will suck it up and cast them.  Casting bullets is only a bit more exciting than handloading.  The Accurate four cavity aluminum molds cast very well at about 800 degrees and avoiding getting burned is the only excitement involved with casting bullets.  

 

GG

[Squirrel45]

Steve should have I ordered some a couple months back. Not a real hot seller 

[pcschwenke]

On 8/31/2022 at 11:11 AM, EEH said:

Didn’t you get some bullets from me ?

Yes I did!  I still haven’t used them yet.   I’ve been looking for more, I shoot quite a lot.  

[EEH]

1 hour ago, pcschwenke said:

Yes I did!  I still haven’t used them yet.   I’ve been looking for more, I shoot quite a lot.  

Thought they would be gone by now.

[Carmoney]

On 8/29/2022 at 11:49 AM, gargoil66 said:

EEH:

 

Thanks for the data.  Blue Dot isn't a powder in my inventory and I probably won't buy any because I am not sure how many times we will shoot pins. 

 

I checked my powders and have eight pounds of AA-7 so that is the powder I will use.  Relative burn rate next to Blue Dot and published data.

 

GG

 

Dude, you ordered a bullet mold for an exotic bullet that has no use other than pin-shooting, but you won't buy a pound of a new powder?