<2" group with minor PF? - list your barrel and reload data

[Kenaxford]

I thought it may be interesting to see a list of those who have found a barrel and load combination that produces 2" group or better at 25 yards and close to minor power factor.  (or 1" or better at 12yds)    Bonus points if using 147 grain. (since I like the recoil impulse of a 147 best but not seeing much out there since generally faster = more accurate)

 

• barrel manufacturer for what pistol (if factory barrel, say "factory")
• bullet manufacturer, weight and type
• powder and charge weight
• OAL
• approximate power factor

 

***to keep things simple, let's use some assumptions: brass and primer good, minimal crimp if any, charge is consistent, etc.  (I know there are tons of factors that have an impact and some of you will be dying to jump in and talk about it, but let's keep it simple and mention the big things.)  My goal here is to marry the load data with the barrel for known accurate combinations which I rarely see compiled in one place unless it includes a bunch of other data that isn't this accurate and has to be sorted through.  Probably benchrest or ransom but offhand is fine if you can shoot sub 2" at 25 yds offhand. this is your chance to flex.     

 

 

[Sinister4]

147 blue bullet TC 9mm, 3.4 grains american select, fed match primers, 1.135 oal  about 133 PF  aprox 910 fps @ 10 feet 

 

 

 

 

Edited November 16, 2021 by Sinister4

[Kenaxford]

3 hours ago, Sinister4 said:

147 blue bullet TC 9mm, 3.4 grains american select, fed match primers, 1.135 oal  about 133 PF  aprox 910 fps @ 10 feet 

 

 

 

 

so PF approximately 133.  What barrel (in what pistol) and what is your grouping size at 12-ish or 25 yards?

[zzt]

Barsto 5"9mm bull barrel, gunsmith fit.

 

Summers Industries 125gr poly coated, 2.6gr e3, 95PF, used for steel challenge.  Same hole groups at 14 yards; sub 1" at 25.

RMR 124gr Plated RN, 3.2gr e3, 109PF, used in my PCC for steel challenge.  Under 2" at 25 off hand.

Berry's 147 Plated, 4.1gr Sport Pistol, 131PF, used in PCC for knock down steel.  Under 2" at 25 off hand.

OAL 1.135" for all of them.

 

It has been my experience that if a bullet is accurate at one PF, it will be accurate at another. 

 

For coated bullets, Precision Bullets, Summers Industries and Roger's Purple PC bullets are the most accurate.  There was only one horribly inaccurate PC bullet I tried.  I don't recall the name, but it is grey coated and billed as suitable for use with a compensator.  Accuracy was so bad I could not keep all the hits on paper at 25 yards.

 

Plated bullets:  Rainier, while they made them, were by far the most accurate.  RMR and Berry's are a close second.  All the others I tried were not as good.

[Sinister4]

2 hours ago, Kenaxford said:

so PF approximately 133.  What barrel (in what pistol) and what is your grouping size at 12-ish or 25 yards?

   Glock 34, KKM barrel I fit and slide tightened,  50 feet indoor, about 1 inch 5 shots from a rest,   shoots a bit over 2 inches offhand at 50 feet.    Stock it was grouping about 3.5 inches  with similar loads    It shoots a tad better with RMR or Montana gold but I like the coated

Edited November 16, 2021 by Sinister4

[GrumpyOne]

3.5 VV N320, Precision Delta 147 FMJ, OAL 1.150. The target is from my Scorpion at 25 yards, old BSA dot, but the load is the same for my CZ Sp01 Shadow, and has the same accuracy. 134 PF out of my Shadow.

[Kenaxford]

57 minutes ago, GrumpyOne said:

3.5 VV N320, Precision Delta 147 FMJ, OAL 1.150. The target is from my Scorpion at 25 yards, old BSA dot, but the load is the same for my CZ Sp01 Shadow, and has the same accuracy. 134 PF out of my Shadow.

Factory barrel in that cz?  What is the grouping size out of the cz?

[GrumpyOne]

51 minutes ago, Kenaxford said:

Factory barrel in that cz?  What is the grouping size out of the cz?

Factory barrel, same grouping if I do my part. At 12 yards, essentially a ragged single hole, maybe .75" diameter.

[zzt]

I think I'll add to my previous post.  I'm a little anal about accuracy.  At my local pistol range target can be placed at 14, 25 and 50 yards..  If a load in any caliber will not put all bullets through the same hole at 14 yards, I'm not happy with it.  This is from a rest, not offhand.  The notion of a 2" group at 25 makes me ill.  I know it's harder to aim with a 6 moa dot at 25, but if I did my part and groups were over 1", no go.  For bullseye loads in a Ransom rest at 50 yard, if not all in the X-ring, no go.

 

I honestly cannot tell you why some bullets are more accurate than others.  You just have to try them.  You are gonna get some loosers.  I have many.  Some are okay enough to shoot in practice.  Some are bad enough they go on the free table at the club.  If you cannot find a bullet and load that shoots through the same hole at 14 yards, your barrel is crap.  Fit another.

[HOGRIDER]

CZ Shadow 2 Orange w/stock barrel.  First pic is Zeros at 1.125 OAL.  2nd pic is Blues at 1.120".  PF is in the 132-134 range for both loads.  All loads use Winchester once-fired, fully processed brass with Federal Match SP primers.

 

[Lightj75]

I don't have any pictures here because I don't normally take pictures of my groups. I mainly only shoot a group to zero one of my RDS but these loads will shoot a 2" group at 25yds off hand. 

 

147gr blues RN  3.5gr N330 @1.13

147gr brazos FP 3.5gr N330 @1.13

147gr Xtreme JHPs 3.9gr N330 1.13

147gr summit FP 3.2gr N320 @1.13

147gr blues RN 3.2gr N320 @ 1.13 

These are all between 128-133PF for me.

All these loads will shoot a 2" group which isn't exactly the hardest thing to do out of my CZ SP-01 CO gun with a 5moa SRO. I switched to the FPs from RN because other than blues most others needed to be loaded at short OALs which doesn't leave alot of room for error. 

 

[Sinister4]

Another load, N320    3.2 gr  blue 147 TC 1.130  900 fps adv  130+PF   shoots nice

 

Edited December 22, 2021 by Sinister4

[Kenaxford]

14 hours ago, Sinister4 said:

Another load, N320    3.2 gr  blue 147 TC 1.130  900 fps adv  130+PF   shoots nice

 

thanks.  please define "nice".  (grouping size at 12 or 25 yds?)  Out of what pistol/barrel?

[Sinister4]

8 minutes ago, Kenaxford said:

thanks.  please define "nice".  (grouping size at 12 or 25 yds?)  Out of what pistol/barrel?

glock 34 KKM barrel  50 feet indoor off a rest groups about a 1"- 1.5"  no bullseye gun but just fine for what we do     see my above target, n320 or american select, shoot the same groups  at 900 fps 

[Kenaxford]

8 minutes ago, Sinister4 said:

glock 34 KKM barrel  50 feet indoor off a rest groups about a 1"- 1.5"  no bullseye gun but just fine for what we do     see my above target, n320 or american select, shoot the same groups  at 900 fps 

Thank you sir.  Referring to your post above, did you tighten the slide by using a ballpeen hammer (or similar) to narrow the gap in the slide rails at the point they interact with the frame tabs?  I've thought about doing this myself as another step to try and improve accuracy.  I have a KKM barrel but still not producing groups like yours.  I'd be very happy with 2" at 25 yds.  My loads are identical to yours but I'm using round nose.  (and really dialed in on the loading variables (bell, crimp, pulling the round to inspect after, etc) Barrel pretty tight but it was a drop in.  no fitting required.  I'm guessing there is some variance in manufacturing here that I am having a hard time identifying so I'm trying to comb through all the little variables.

[Sinister4]

1 hour ago, Kenaxford said:

Thank you sir.  Referring to your post above, did you tighten the slide by using a ballpeen hammer (or similar) to narrow the gap in the slide rails at the point they interact with the frame tabs?  I've thought about doing this myself as another step to try and improve accuracy.  I have a KKM barrel but still not producing groups like yours.  I'd be very happy with 2" at 25 yds.  My loads are identical to yours but I'm using round nose.  (and really dialed in on the loading variables (bell, crimp, pulling the round to inspect after, etc) Barrel pretty tight but it was a drop in.  no fitting required.  I'm guessing there is some variance in manufacturing here that I am having a hard time identifying so I'm trying to comb through all the little variables.

 Made a little hardened steel "shim" to fit the the groove in slide, then gave it a tap with the good ol hammer,   be sure you are testing from a good heavy rest, ransom is best.  Actually 2" at 25 yards would be dang good for the glock,  try shooting your tests at 50 feet first, or even 25 feet then compare, 25 feet should be a ragged hole for 10 shots.   Ive done a few of these 34's and really 2" at 50 feet is pretty much the norm with 2.5-3 " at 75 feet   (in a GOOD rest )   I will also say on the slides its really not worth doing unless the movement is like crazy bad, the risk is very high and no going back

Edited December 23, 2021 by Sinister4

[jrabs]

Fully optimized CZ75 SA 40S&W.  Stock barrel . Year 2001 model.

150gr SWC Accurate mold.  Lubed with caranuba red.  4.1gr. WST.

Once fired Speer nickel brass.  CCI spp.

50 feet indoors.  Very light load.

[ohsevenflhx]

Walther Q5 Match Steel Frame 5" barrel and 147 RMR  FMJ truncated cone flat point MatchWinner with 2.8gr Alliant E3  OAL 1.120, 130 PF will give you 2" groups at 25 yards freestyle.....if you're steady.