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In your personal experience, has moving from a 1-6x to a 1-8x (or even 1-10x) made a huge difference?


thegeneric
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I'm finally ready to buy my first big boy scope around the $1k+ mark. I've prioritized weight first (shoulder injury), durability second, reticle third....but I'm not sure how much magnification should factor into that mix.

 

Assuming that I plan to use either 1x or max magnification (nothing between), would the tighter eyebox/FOV of an 8x/10x make target acquisition a little more difficult than 6x (at varying distances)? 

 

If you used a 6x and switched to an 8-10x, did you feel that extra magnification made much of a difference?

 

Right now I'm looking at the Eotech Vudu and Trijicon Credo line. Found a NF NX8 1-8 around the $1400 mark and I'm strongly considering just picking that up, primarily based on weight alone. Any other suggestions?

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You're going to have to talk about what you use the rifle for.   I use a 1-4 on my carbine, have for about 10 years, and for anything I want to shoot with a 14.5" rifle, it's plenty.  I have heard that there are 1-8s out there that are so cheap you could buy three or four of them for what you're considering spending, but I haven't looked into them because I'm not sure I'd ever use the additional magnification.  I'm sure there are multigun matches where that kind of distance shooting is available but I've never shot one.   They might be deep bays, but generally we shoot multigun in similar bays like you would shoot a pistol match; my scope usually never leaves 1x for that and honestly a red dot would probably be faster.  On the other hand, precision/gas gun matches with even a 1-8 or a 1-10 would be a challenge; my 20" has a 3-15x50 scope on it for a reason.

Edited by twodownzero
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I recently went from a Burris 1-8 xtr II to a Vortex 1-6 Razor.  Found I didn’t need the extra magnification even with my older eyes. Other considerations were weight savings, better field of view, and primarily the more forgiving eye box. I shoot open so have a red dot on a 45 degree mount but still use the rifle on 1 power at times and again the better eye box helps.

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At that price point I would go with the Vortex 1x6 and it should be fine for most AR applications. I do not have any experience with the other optics you listed but for the price the Vortex has the best blend of Glass, reticle (brightness), weight and eye relief. I never see a hint of scope shadow with that optic and the JM- BDC reticle is easy to use. Plus it’s hard to beat their warranty. One other thing to think about is first focal plane versus second. When you step up to 1x8 and 1x10 those optics tend to be first focal plane. Both FFP and SCF optics have pros and cons. 

Edited by Boomstick303
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17 hours ago, twodownzero said:

You're going to have to talk about what you use the rifle for.   I use a 1-4 on my carbine, have for about 10 years, and for anything I want to shoot with a 14.5" rifle, it's plenty.  I have heard that there are 1-8s out there that are so cheap you could buy three or four of them for what you're considering spending, but I haven't looked into them because I'm not sure I'd ever use the additional magnification.  I'm sure there are multigun matches where that kind of distance shooting is available but I've never shot one.   They might be deep bays, but generally we shoot multigun in similar bays like you would shoot a pistol match; my scope usually never leaves 1x for that and honestly a red dot would probably be faster.  On the other hand, precision/gas gun matches with even a 1-8 or a 1-10 would be a challenge; my 20" has a 3-15x50 scope on it for a reason.

 

Right now I only plan on doing run and guns. My first one is coming up and there are 500 yard targets. I'm trying to stay away from budget optics. 

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9 hours ago, AKJD said:

I recently went from a Burris 1-8 xtr II to a Vortex 1-6 Razor.  Found I didn’t need the extra magnification even with my older eyes. Other considerations were weight savings, better field of view, and primarily the more forgiving eye box. I shoot open so have a red dot on a 45 degree mount but still use the rifle on 1 power at times and again the better eye box helps.

I also plan to run a 45 degree red dot, under what circumstances do you use the 1x power at?

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8 hours ago, Boomstick303 said:

At that price point I would go with the Vortex 1x6 and it should be fine for most AR applications. I do not have any experience with the other optics you listed but for the price the Vortex has the best blend of Glass, reticle (brightness), weight and eye relief. I never see a hint of scope shadow with that optic and the JM- BDC reticle is easy to use. Plus it’s hard to beat their warranty. One other thing to think about is first focal plane versus second. When you step up to 1x8 and 1x10 those optics tend to be first focal plane. Both FFP and SCF optics have pros and cons. 

 

I am staying away from vortex for now, I currently have a 1-8 Strike Eagle. Although I love the company and generally buy their other products, I have a friend who shoots a lot of competitions, he's told me about the amount of people who've had to send back strike eagles ("and I'm even sending back a Razor right now").

 

I'm mostly interested in spending the extra money for the extra (expected) durability. 

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1 hour ago, thegeneric said:

 

 

I am staying away from vortex for now, I currently have a 1-8 Strike Eagle. Although I love the company and generally buy their other products, I have a friend who shoots a lot of competitions, he's told me about the amount of people who've had to send back strike eagles ("and I'm even sending back a Razor right now").

 

I'm mostly interested in spending the extra money for the extra (expected) durability. 

I have a Strike Eagle and a Razor.  The SE is a POS compared to the Razor.  Don't judge the company based on anything you hear about that line.  I dropped my Razor from chest high to a hard wood floor and it didn't do anything to it.  And if it had, they would have repaired it.

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1 hour ago, thegeneric said:

I also plan to run a 45 degree red dot, under what circumstances do you use the 1x power at?

Unconventional shooting positions where it is easier to hold the rifle without canting it, small ports such as the horizontal slots in a VTAC barricade, small targets where magnification isn’t wanted because of the smaller field of view, an example of this being longer headshots.  This is what works for me.

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I keep thinking I need a 1-10x. Then I go to a match with 500 yard targets and only use 4-5x because 6x limits my fov too much and makes acquiring multiple targets spread out over a hillside too time consuming. I'll probably still end up with a 10x scope but I don't expect it to be game changing.

 

I have multiple 2.5-10, 3-12, 3-9 and a 2-12x scope and I would never even consider using and of them in a time based sport.

Edited by TonytheTiger
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2 hours ago, AKJD said:

Unconventional shooting positions where it is easier to hold the rifle without canting it, small ports such as the horizontal slots in a VTAC barricade, small targets where magnification isn’t wanted because of the smaller field of view, an example of this being longer headshots.  This is what works for me.

 That makes a lot of sense, thank you.

 

24 minutes ago, TonytheTiger said:

I keep thinking I need a 1-10x. Then I go to a match with 500 yard targets and only use 4-5x because 6x limits my fov too much and makes acquiring multiple targets spread out over a hillside too time consuming. I'll probably still end up with a 10x scope but I don't expect it to be game changing.

 

I have multiple 2.5-10, 3-12, 3-9 and a 2-12x scope and I would never even consider using and of them in a time based sport.

So why do you still think you'll end up with a 10x? especially if 6x is already limiting your FOV? I'm in that "omg more magnification is better" headspace although I'm seeing that might not be the case from the replies here (including yours).

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2 hours ago, RangerTrace said:

I have a Strike Eagle and a Razor.  The SE is a POS compared to the Razor.  Don't judge the company based on anything you hear about that line.  I dropped my Razor from chest high to a hard wood floor and it didn't do anything to it.  And if it had, they would have repaired it.

I would assume so. I still ruled out the razor based on weight and more importantly cost. 

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3 hours ago, RangerTrace said:

I have a Strike Eagle and a Razor.  The SE is a POS compared to the Razor.  Don't judge the company based on anything you hear about that line.  I dropped my Razor from chest high to a hard wood floor and it didn't do anything to it.  And if it had, they would have repaired it.

 

This!  My rifle was dropped from about waist high onto concrete directly onto the elevation scope cap.  Even though I had a Scope Coat on my Vortex Razor scope, it made the most sickening aluminum pipe dropped on the floor sound.  The elevation cap had a good sized ding in the top and knurled edge, but unscrewed and the elevation knob inside appeared OKAY.  I shot the rest of the match with no problems and when I had a chance to check the zero on a 200 yard range it hadn't changed.  The scope was mounted in a Warne one piece mount.

 

Nolan

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2 hours ago, thegeneric said:

So why do you still think you'll end up with a 10x? especially if 6x is already limiting your FOV? I'm in that "omg more magnification is better" headspace although I'm seeing that might not be the case from the replies here (including yours).

Because I'm a rifle and rifle accessories whore and like to try as many different things as I can even though the main thing I've learned from my experimentation is that all this stuff makes way less difference than we like to think.

Same reason why I have 223 AR's with 10.5, 12.5, 13, 13.7, 14, 14.5, 15, 16, 18, and 22 inch barrels even though a 14.5 or 16 would probably suffice for my needs.

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shot the razor 1x6 for many years.  wanted a bit more magnification as some of the matches have 500+.  jumped on the 1x10 razor when it was released and really like it.  the reticle (EBR-9), although a bit busy compared to the JM-1, is an improvement.  having hash marks at 50yd increments AND windage hashes is the sh%t.  YMMV, but at 66, i needed a little more magnification.  having said that, 10x kills the eye box and gives me a halo in the edges.  but i do luv 7&8x.

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I have had the 1x6 for many years and do not feel that I have ever needed more magnification. Back when I was shooting 3 gun a lot, the ranges that I shot at were never much more than 350 yards. I have a 1x6 0n my work gun and don't need anymore there either. I have had the Razors, PST Gen 2, C-More.  I had one Strike Eagle that I never mounted on a rifle, was not impressed with the SE 1x6. I do like the SE 5x25 though.

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As an Iron sight shooter, I really can't advise you on how much magnification you need. In general I see folks running 1x4 and 1X6.....maybe a few folks run the 1X10 I really don't know. All I know is at a "fixed" 1X I'm still hitting all the stuff these  1-6X variables are so maybe higher power magnification isn't all that critical and you should shop by what looks best to your eye! Magnification is way over rated here in the U.S. and over seas IPSC Rifle matches show a proclivity for the 1-4 and 1-6 range.

Now not everyone has the "young eyes" I have continually been blamed for having, and that is probably a very valid point. My 62nd birthday cake had a nice rendition of an iron sight "sight picture" on it.

Don't get hung up in Magnification!!!

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19 hours ago, RangerTrace said:

I have a Strike Eagle and a Razor.  The SE is a POS compared to the Razor.  Don't judge the company based on anything you hear about that line.  I dropped my Razor from chest high to a hard wood floor and it didn't do anything to it.  And if it had, they would have repaired it.

As a guy who has a SE 1-8, it is a POS but it's a decent entry level scope. I got mine brand new with mount for about $250 and it served as the gateway scope to enter 3gun. After zeroing it, it broke and was sent back to vortex who supposedly fixed it. After my first match it broke again and was sent back and replaced with a new one and has been fine for the 2 years since then.

 

But I've borrowed a gun with a razor 1-6 and it's night and day difference. The glass is so much clearer and the fov is better that it's no comparison. It's sort of like comparing a ford fiesta to a Corvette, sure it's the same company but 2 completely different products.

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On 9/19/2021 at 10:15 AM, thegeneric said:

 

 

I am staying away from vortex for now, I currently have a 1-8 Strike Eagle. Although I love the company and generally buy their other products, I have a friend who shoots a lot of competitions, he's told me about the amount of people who've had to send back strike eagles ("and I'm even sending back a Razor right now").

 

I'm mostly interested in spending the extra money for the extra (expected) durability. 

 

What problem are you sending a Razor back for?

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On 9/19/2021 at 8:08 AM, thegeneric said:

 

Right now I only plan on doing run and guns. My first one is coming up and there are 500 yard targets. I'm trying to stay away from budget optics. 

 

I shoot 600 with my 1-4 once in a while.  At that distance, knowing how your ammo flies and having a reticle to measure holdover is way more important than magnification.

 

Even my 1-4 is a detriment on a lot of 3 gun matches, where a rifle with a 1x red dot would be faster and easier to run than looking through a tube, no matter what quality.  I'm sure there are people way better than me who can shoot a scope just as fast as a red dot.

 

I have some good rifle scopes for precision rifle and I like good glass as much as anybody, but I don't consider a $3-500 scope for this use to be "budget" when there are optics that cost 1/5 of that.

Edited by twodownzero
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