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Staccato P 4.4


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  • 1 month later...

I think it will fit The Box.

Then you get into the semantics.  It has a "bull" barrel which is not addressed in the rules although "cone" and "heavy" barrels longer than 4.25" are not allowed.

If you have one, take it and shoot it.

If you don't, I would not buy one without a clarification from HQ.

 

That is one of those silly rules that people with nothing better to do make fun of.

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2 hours ago, Jim Watson said:

I think it will fit The Box.

Then you get into the semantics.  It has a "bull" barrel which is not addressed in the rules although "cone" and "heavy" barrels longer than 4.25" are not allowed.

If you have one, take it and shoot it.

If you don't, I would not buy one without a clarification from HQ.

 

That is one of those silly rules that people with nothing better to do make fun of.

Two different state coordinators were emails, 1 said it was legal, the other said no. I guess I have to email HQ.

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I'd say no.  It is a bull barrel and it's longer than 4.25".  At a fairly recent State IDPA match, they checked my 4.15" gun just to make sure I didn't have a newer pistol.  Like many IDPA rules, it really is lame, but oh well.

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5 minutes ago, RangerTrace said:

I'd say no.  It is a bull barrel and it's longer than 4.25".  At a fairly recent State IDPA match, they checked my 4.15" gun just to make sure I didn't have a newer pistol.  Like many IDPA rules, it really is lame, but oh well.

Wellllll crap 

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So I emailed IDPA HQ. I stated two different coordinators give two different opinions about the Staccato P. They emailed back stating they are sending the question to my coordinator because they know the rules better.............wellllll thanks HQ that didn't help. 

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29 minutes ago, Michael303 said:

Did your coordinator clarify why they believe it's not illegal?

No. I just got an email back that said the staccato P is legal for ESP. That is it. I also printed that out to take to matches around Florida.......lol. 

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Thats all fine and good till they measure the length of the barrel.  He's exactly right, the Staccato P is legal for ESP, as long as it's a 2019 model.  If they/he stick with than answer, Atlas has several 4.5ish bull barrels guns that will be legal......which I doubt.  

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52 minutes ago, RangerTrace said:

Thats all fine and good till they measure the length of the barrel.  He's exactly right, the Staccato P is legal for ESP, as long as it's a 2019 model.  If they/he stick with than answer, Atlas has several 4.5ish bull barrels guns that will be legal......which I doubt.  

Well I guess the Staccato P is legal for ESP in Florida. Seems like HQ needs to step in because different states now have different ruings.

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  • 3 weeks later...
On 8/17/2021 at 11:02 AM, Jim Watson said:

Great.  When you get an answer you like, quit asking.

I saw your post on 1911Addicts regarding a recent IDPA AC conference call where it was agreed that if a pistol makes weight and fits the box it's good to go.  I was going to reach out to my AC about this but I'm curous which AC you spoke with.

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Just to follow up on this, my area coordinator replied to my message quickly and confirmed the longer Staccato P and effectively all longer bull, heavy, cone barrels are good to go.  Considering the terms heavy and cone aren't defined, this makes the most sense.

 

I asked my AC: I came across a thread on a message board where someone said "it was agreed that if a pistol makes weight and fits The Box, it will be allowed" on a recent area coordinator conference call, effectively making the 4.4" Staccato P and other 1911s with bull barrels longer than 4.25" legal. Do you know anything about this?

 

He replied: That is the direction we were given in a recent AC call. This doesn't mean ported guns or enlarged safeties will be allowed however. The ruling was in reference to the cone vs bull barrel reference. It would be great if they actually updated the rule book but as you know there is a freeze on any rule book changes this year. We are trying to get the word out to the MDs. If you run across any MD who questions it, have them contact me, if they are in my area.

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4 hours ago, Michael303 said:

I'm curous which AC you spoke with.

 

Nicky Carter, Mississippi etc.

I am in Alabama but my official AC is a lot farther away, so I always ask Nicky when shooting at his place near Saltillo MS.  

 

I think this is a sensible approach and I hope the official rules will reflect it when they get around to a new edition.

It should also apply to the other automatic divisions EXCEPT SSP.   I would hate for SSP to end up like USPSA Production with only a nodding resemblance to stock guns. 

Edited by Jim Watson
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  • 1 month later...

I think the rules aren't actually updated and it's a gentlemen's agreement at the moment (for lack of a better term).

 

I'm also curious as I have a fair amount of Grand Power stuff floating around and the X-Calibur was previously not legal due to the 5" cone-ish barrel.

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On 10/9/2021 at 9:36 PM, matteekay said:

I think the rules aren't actually updated and it's a gentlemen's agreement at the moment (for lack of a better term).

 

I'm also curious as I have a fair amount of Grand Power stuff floating around and the X-Calibur was previously not legal due to the 5" cone-ish barrel.

 

I think "gentlemen's agreement" is a good term for it.  Rev up your Grand Power before they change their minds.

 

The Brock's Gap IDPA had a family group Saturday; Dad, Junior, and Sub-Junior, a heartwarming sight.  But they may have been too lax on equipment, these guys were all fitted out in very nice USPSA Limited rigs with 2011s, lots of bucks on sporting goods for the boys.  

I guess the MD and CSO thought it worth the dispensation to get them to shoot.

 

On 10/10/2021 at 9:20 AM, RangerTrace said:

Too bad Atlas when to the trouble of making some 4.6" bushing barreled guns!!

 

Why "too bad?"  Good quality guns, legit if they go back to black letter rules, competitive if they don't; unless a bull barrel is perceptibly more effective.

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On 8/16/2021 at 5:42 AM, apetrulis01 said:

So I emailed IDPA HQ. I stated two different coordinators give two different opinions about the Staccato P. They emailed back stating they are sending the question to my coordinator because they know the rules better.............wellllll thanks HQ that didn't help. 

 

😅🤣😂😅🤣😂

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On 10/11/2021 at 9:48 AM, Jim Watson said:

 

I think "gentlemen's agreement" is a good term for it.  Rev up your Grand Power before they change their minds.

 

The Brock's Gap IDPA had a family group Saturday; Dad, Junior, and Sub-Junior, a heartwarming sight.  But they may have been too lax on equipment, these guys were all fitted out in very nice USPSA Limited rigs with 2011s, lots of bucks on sporting goods for the boys.  

I guess the MD and CSO thought it worth the dispensation to get them to shoot.

 

 

Why "too bad?"  Good quality guns, legit if they go back to black letter rules, competitive if they don't; unless a bull barrel is perceptibly more effective.

They went to quite a bit of trouble to make a 4.6" legal.  Their testing shows the 4.6" gun with factory ammo have a perfect return to zero compared to the 4.25" bull barrel guns.  I'm not paying another 5K for .4" of barrel!!

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On 10/12/2021 at 6:09 PM, RangerTrace said:

They went to quite a bit of trouble to make a 4.6" legal.  Their testing shows the 4.6" gun with factory ammo have a perfect return to zero compared to the 4.25" bull barrel guns.  I'm not paying another 5K for .4" of barrel!!

I actually had a conversation with Adam about an IDPA legal 4.6” gun before I purchased my Hyperion. He thought the barrel was going to be the problem because nobody made a bushing barrel that length. I guess they figured it out. As dumb as I am, I might even fork over the funds for a 4.6” bushing top end but I should probably just wait for the Hyperion to get approved instead.

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