650/750 vs 1050/1100

[67isb]

16 hours ago, Bakerjd said:

So I started looking at only reloading machines that were all down stroke.

 

 

Priming on the down stroke and built is swager makes the RL1050/Super1050/RL1100 better than a 650/750 for me.   Better/more comfortable ergonomics will save wear and tear on you shoulder. 

[ddc]

Another thing to consider is that it is more difficult to see your powder drop on the 1100.

 

On the 650 you have pretty good visibility into the case when it gets to station 3.

The case is right there in front of your eyes as you look down at the shell plate.

It is at approximately 7 o'clock and you don't have to alter your stance much, if any, to see into it.

 

On the 1100 station 6 is at approximately 11 o'clock.

To see into the case you have to look around the side of the tool head and you are looking into the case at more of an angle.

 

I'm running mine automated at the left end of a bench. I can stand at 9 o'clock and get good visibility into the case.

 

If I was going to run an 1100 manually I would most likely look into one of the backup camera solutions that can be found in any number of postings in this forum.

[dansedgli]

My $15 amazon reversing camera works a treat. 

[jejb]

Thanks for the pictures. Looks doable. 

 

Looks like I'll have a lot of time to make a decision. 1050/1100's are in short supply, and I have no reason to pay a premium. 

 

[vluc]

Remember, one has lifetime warranty, the other does not.

[George16]

1 hour ago, jejb said:

Thanks for the pictures. Looks doable. 

 

Looks like I'll have a lot of time to make a decision. 1050/1100's are in short supply, and I have no reason to pay a premium. 

 

Unless you will be needing the Swage station to process . 223 in bulk, I recommend just saving your money and stay with the 650. Output difference is negligible if you have a case feeder and bulletfeeder on your 660.
 

I already had the 550 and 650 prior to buying the 1100. But I went ahead and bought one for processing .223 in bulk. The 650 wasn’t adequate and sturdy enough to process (especially swaging and I kept breaking the plastic ring indexer) .223. I sold the 650 (with case feeder and upgrades) and kept the 550 and 1100.

[ysrracer]

37 minutes ago, George16 said:

Unless you will be needing the Swage station to process . 223 in bulk, I recommend just saving your money and stay with the 650.

 

Winner !!

[jejb]

21 hours ago, George16 said:

Unless you will be needing the Swage station to process . 223 in bulk, I recommend just saving your money and stay with the 650. Output difference is negligible if you have a case feeder and bulletfeeder on your 660.

That's what I'm thinking at this point. Maybe just buy the bullet feeder for my 650 and call it good. 

[Johnnymazz]

I have both

 

Edited June 4, 2021 by Johnnymazz

[xrayfk05]

26 minutes ago, Johnnymazz said:

I have both the 650 and 1100 automated. I shoot 1,600 rounds a month. Cant compare the 2 machines. The RL1100 is built like a tank , the 650  looks like a toy you bought at Walmart in a quality sense. Buy once cry once

 

This says absolutely nothing about non-automated output and why you should or should not get a 1050 over a 650.

In this case buy once cry once mostly means spend too much for too little.

 

I can easily load 1600 rounds in just an hour and 15 mins. on the 650, no need for a much more expensive 1050.

[tbarker13]

On 5/31/2021 at 10:23 AM, Sigarmsp226 said:

Jejb -  Caliber conversion kits and tool heads for the 1050/1100 are signifcantly more expensive than the 650 so for me this seemed to be the logical method...I am sure others will be able to share their ideas and comments.....Mark

 

To Intheshaws point - Eventually I think I will put an auto-drive on my RL1100....

 

This was my thinking as well. I set up my automated 1050 for 9mm - representing 90 percent of my reloading. I have a 650 off to the side - used for the other various rounds that I load. I do prefer the 1050 for the higher volume stuff. Particularly since that setup is automated.

[belus]

On 6/1/2021 at 5:22 AM, George16 said:

The foot print difference is insignificant to me. I used to have a 650 but sold it after a got my 1100. Now, I only have the 1100 and 550. The 1100 is used for small primer loading and processing .223 and 9mm while the 550 is used for loading .45 ACP and .308.

 

On 6/2/2021 at 5:54 AM, George16 said:

Unless you will be needing the Swage station to process . 223 in bulk, I recommend just saving your money and stay with the 650. Output difference is negligible if you have a case feeder and bulletfeeder on your 650.
 

I already had the 550 and 650 prior to buying the 1100. But I went ahead and bought one for processing .223 in bulk. The 650 wasn’t adequate and sturdy enough to process (especially swaging and I kept breaking the plastic ring indexer) .223. I sold the 650 (with case feeder and upgrades) and kept the 550 and 1100.

 

I agree with everything @George16 is saying. I have also sold my fully upgrade 650 to go to an automated 1050/550 setup. With the case feeder and bullet feeder there isn't really a speed difference between the 1050 and 650. The 1050 stays set up for 9mm and I load smaller batches of anything else on the 550. Reloading on an auto indexing press is just necessary work to get to shoot more, but I actually enjoy the hands on craftsmanship and ergonomic efficiency of the 550 when I use it for 200 rounds here or there.

Edited June 19, 2021 by belus

[mkmckinley]

I think the swage station alone is worth the 1050/1100. I primarily shoot 9mm and .223 so not having to worry about crimps is an important feature. On top of that the extra stations give more options. I don’t think a lot of home reloaders are out there wearing out RL650s, but I enjoy the fact that my Super 1050 is rated for commercial use. 

 

Warranty and price is a non issue. If/when I make enough rounds to wear out something on my 1050 I can afford to fix it or even replace the press. 100,000 rounds is conservative for a 1050 and represents more than a decade worth of shooting for me. At $0.15 per round that’s $15,000, the cost of the whole press is only like 10% of that, much less just replacing a part.

 

As far as the price of the press, The extra $1000 or so for the 1050 is nothing to sneeze at, but it’s a major addition to my shooting hobby.  It’s a major appliance to me.  Many people think nothing of adding a $1200, $2000, $5000 option to their car when they buy a vehicle. I spent almost $10,000 on a new HVAC two years ago and another $12,000 on a new roof. s#!t’s expensive! But an extra $1000 to get the press I will probably use until I die is small potatoes in the grand scheme.

Edited June 20, 2021 by mkmckinley

[bria]

Hi all I'm looking at getting into a dillon I do lots of military 223/556. So the pocket swag seems awesomeon the 1100. But how is it that you can do everything from decapping to finished in one go. Is there no case lube? Are you using case lube that does not need to be removed? Currently running a Lee 4 hole turret and its so slooow. I have done 8k on it and I would really like to speed that up. 

[midatlantic]

One added issue is RSI. Don’t laugh. To keep shooting at high volume, for me, I had to automate cause my shoulder couldn’t take 300 sometimes more pulls a week, which is like 15000 a year….that’s a lot of wear and tear on aging shoulder. Rather wear and tear shooting. Fortunately I could swing an 1100 and automation. 

[ddc]

On 1/31/2023 at 10:18 AM, bria said:

Hi all I'm looking at getting into a dillon I do lots of military 223/556. So the pocket swag seems awesomeon the 1100. But how is it that you can do everything from decapping to finished in one go. Is there no case lube? Are you using case lube that does not need to be removed? Currently running a Lee 4 hole turret and its so slooow. I have done 8k on it and I would really like to speed that up. 

 

I don't do rifle but my understanding is very few if any are doing a single pass reloading process with rifle cartridges.

 

I'm reasonably sure they do a processing pass where they get their brass all tuned up and then follow up with a loading pass.

 

Hopefully someone will come along and clarify.

 

 

Edited February 2, 2023 by ddc

[Boomstick303]

On 1/31/2023 at 10:18 AM, bria said:

But how is it that you can do everything from decapping to finished in one go. Is there no case lube?

 

On a 1050/1100 it is not possible to my knowledge to process and load brass in one pass unless the brass has been trimmed and sized already.    You could load in one pass if the brass is already sized to which it most likely has already been decapped. 

 

Shoulder bump and overall case length are very important to get correct to load reliable ammo. 

 

Typical process on a Dillon 1050/110 is as follows.

 

1.  Clean brass with pins. 

2.  Lube brass (I use Alcohol/Lanolin mixture similar to Dillon's mix).

3.  Decap, Trim and size brass or decap, size and trim brass.  There is some debate oh to size before trimming or vise versa.  I think some use the Trim die to size the brass and trim the brass.  I use a separate sizing die after trimming to make sure I have proper neck tension. If you size after trim, it is imperative that the trim die is not set too high, because you could in theory increase the length of the brass when it passes through the dedicated sizing die.  I have not had this issue but I guess its possible. 

I also use a separate Tool head which I only have to adjust case trimmer and the rest of the dies essentially remain the same.  I will check case sizing before I start mass processing to make sure the brass will be in specification.

4.  Clean brass again without pins.  This does two things.  Removes burrs from the brass that was trimmed and removes the lube from all of the brass.

5.  Load ammo.  I leave the swage rod in place for loading because it does not hurt anything and also ensures primer pockets will accept primer.  Brass is primed, Powder drop, Bullet drop via Bullet Feeder, seating die, crimp die.  I have yet to find a good way to keep bullets in place without the expander/hold down die yet so I have to crimp when using a progressive press with a bullet feeder.  Maybe other have a secret but this method works for me.  

 

This makes good ammo, but I intend to move the swage station hold down/expander die which is currently on the loading tool head to the processing tool head.  I have found I am getting brass shavings when the brass passes through that station.   Once I do this I should not have any brass shavings during the loading process.  

 

Others may do it different, but I have found this to be the most efficient for me and makes very reliable .223 ammo.  

 

The 650/750 is similar but a little more involved because you have to use a special tool attached to one of the stations to swage the .2323 bass once it is decapped.  My buddy who uses a 650 explained the process and I was like no thanks.   The reason I purchased the 1050 was I knew I would be loading .223 at some time and point, and I am glad I did.  The only con is the price of the 1050/1100 tool heads.  

 

[jejb]

16 hours ago, Boomstick303 said:

 

On a 1050/1100 it is not possible to my knowledge to process and load brass in one pass unless the brass has been trimmed and sized already.    You could load in one pass if the brass is already sized to which it most likely has already been decapped. 

 

Shoulder bump and overall case length are very important to get correct to load reliable ammo. 

 

Typical process on a Dillon 1050/110 is as follows.

 

1.  Clean brass with pins. 

2.  Lube brass (I use Alcohol/Lanolin mixture similar to Dillon's mix).

3.  Decap, Trim and size brass or decap, size and trim brass.  There is some debate oh to size before trimming or vise versa.  I think some use the Trim die to size the brass and trim the brass.  I use a separate sizing die after trimming to make sure I have proper neck tension. If you size after trim, it is imperative that the trim die is not set too high, because you could in theory increase the length of the brass when it passes through the dedicated sizing die.  I have not had this issue but I guess its possible. 

I also use a separate Tool head which I only have to adjust case trimmer and the rest of the dies essentially remain the same.  I will check case sizing before I start mass processing to make sure the brass will be in specification.

4.  Clean brass again without pins.  This does two things.  Removes burrs from the brass that was trimmed and removes the lube from all of the brass.

5.  Load ammo.  I leave the swage rod in place for loading because it does not hurt anything and also ensures primer pockets will accept primer.  Brass is primed, Powder drop, Bullet drop via Bullet Feeder, seating die, crimp die.  I have yet to find a good way to keep bullets in place without the expander/hold down die yet so I have to crimp when using a progressive press with a bullet feeder.  Maybe other have a secret but this method works for me.  

 

This makes good ammo, but I intend to move the swage station hold down/expander die which is currently on the loading tool head to the processing tool head.  I have found I am getting brass shavings when the brass passes through that station.   Once I do this I should not have any brass shavings during the loading process.  

 

Others may do it different, but I have found this to be the most efficient for me and makes very reliable .223 ammo.  

 

The 650/750 is similar but a little more involved because you have to use a special tool attached to one of the stations to swage the .2323 bass once it is decapped.  My buddy who uses a 650 explained the process and I was like no thanks.   The reason I purchased the 1050 was I knew I would be loading .223 at some time and point, and I am glad I did.  The only con is the price of the 1050/1100 tool heads.  

 

I don't like to clean twice, so for step 1, I'd put "Anneal brass" instead of clean with pins. And I'd add pins in step 4, since I only clean once. I anneal first as that can impact sizing and length of the case.

[Boomstick303]

11 minutes ago, jejb said:

I anneal first as that can impact sizing and length of the case.

 

I have yet to anneal, because I have not had a need yet.  I can see this being the case in the future possibly.  As you mentioned it would be done before any sizing would occur.

 

My method works for me, but this does not mean its the only process that works.