Reasons NOT to get an Evo/Apex?

[rmantoo]

I currently have an RL1050 running a Mk7 Pro, and a Super 1050 manually operated.  I reload anywhere between 30k and 70k a year.  Most of my loads are 9mm, .40, 45acp, long colt, 556/223, 308, and 6.5 grendel and creedmoor.  I have 6 tool heads- all of those calibers except long colt are set up, so it's easy to swap calibers....

 

I only rarely set up the super 1050- most of the time I will swap toolheads/priming systems and keep the rl1050 rocking.  I'm so spoiled by the autodrive that I hate using the super manually.  

 

I think I could sell both my 1050s and all of the accessories for them for about enough to get an Apex or evo, loaded with all the sensors...

 

Is there any compelling reason NOT to sell all of the above and buy a MK7 apex or evo, then put it under my autodrive?  I've read about everything I can find aobut them, including every thread here on benos...can't find any major negatives, but figured I'd ask.

 

THanks in advance,

robert

[ddc]

One thought that occurs to me is that you would lose the redundancy that two presses provide.

[cool]

I have 2 EVO 45 and 9mm, and an RL 1050

I don't really like the '' pre-order '' so I wait a bit to order an APEX in 40SW, the case feeder looks very good.

[ddc]

9 hours ago, cool said:

I have 2 EVO 45 and 9mm, and an RL 1050

I don't really like the '' pre-order '' so I wait a bit to order an APEX in 40SW, the case feeder looks very good.

 

Is the case feeder different from what is currently offered?

 

[cool]

This is no longer the Hornady case feeder but this one

11" High Speed Case Feeder for Apex 10 - Case Feeders & Accessories - Accessories (markvii-loading.com)

[MountainMan]

The obvious down side is that you have a fully functional system now, and when you order an EVo or Apex, you will be starting over with a new press. All these presses are temperamental and it will take several thousands of rounds for you to learn the quirks and nuances of these presses.

 

Don't under-estimate the frustration protential regarding this.

 

I started with a 550b, then bought a super1050 that I used manually for 150k rounds or so, then added a Mark 7, then pivoted that autodrive onto an EVO.  And sold the 1050 to a range acquaintance. The Evo took months to troubleshoot and fine tune. all kinds of annoying little problems that eventually all smoothed away, but i STILL would not do it all over again. I would have just kept my 1050 Mark7 autodrive if I had to go back and do it again.  Took too much time to figure out.

 

This APEX is a new press, really, so don't assume it'll be flawless out of the box. They never are.

 

 

[Boomstick303]

Sometimes the new and shiny toy is not always the best toy in the toy box.

Edited February 18, 2021 by Boomstick303

[MNJoel]

1 hour ago, MountainMan said:

The obvious down side is that you have a fully functional system now, and when you order an EVo or Apex, you will be starting over with a new press. All these presses are temperamental and it will take several thousands of rounds for you to learn the quirks and nuances of these presses.

 

Don't under-estimate the frustration protential regarding this.

 

I started with a 550b, then bought a super1050 that I used manually for 150k rounds or so, then added a Mark 7, then pivoted that autodrive onto an EVO.  And sold the 1050 to a range acquaintance. The Evo took months to troubleshoot and fine tune. all kinds of annoying little problems that eventually all smoothed away, but i STILL would not do it all over again. I would have just kept my 1050 Mark7 autodrive if I had to go back and do it again.  Took too much time to figure out.

 

This APEX is a new press, really, so don't assume it'll be flawless out of the box. They never are.

 

 

Well said!

[HesedTech]

On 2/15/2021 at 2:44 PM, rmantoo said:

I've read about everything I can find aobut them, including every thread here on benos...can't find any major negatives, but figured I'd ask.

As someone very dear to me would ask me (when it showed up in my work shop), "so what was wrong with the one(s) you already have?"

 

 

Really, my personal question is, other than a new press what advantages will you get over two 1050s, one already automated? If they are real benefits get it.

 

[BillChunn]

18 hours ago, MountainMan said:

The obvious down side is that you have a fully functional system now, and when you order an EVo or Apex, you will be starting over with a new press. All these presses are temperamental and it will take several thousands of rounds for you to learn the quirks and nuances of these presses.

 

Don't under-estimate the frustration protential regarding this.

 

I started with a 550b, then bought a super1050 that I used manually for 150k rounds or so, then added a Mark 7, then pivoted that autodrive onto an EVO.  And sold the 1050 to a range acquaintance. The Evo took months to troubleshoot and fine tune. all kinds of annoying little problems that eventually all smoothed away, but i STILL would not do it all over again. I would have just kept my 1050 Mark7 autodrive if I had to go back and do it again.  Took too much time to figure out.

 

This APEX is a new press, really, so don't assume it'll be flawless out of the box. They never are.

 

 

Agree with @MountainMan

 

A friend works for a gun store that is the largest Dillon distributor in the Midwest.  They jumped on the Mark7 band wagon and became a distributor, got the correct license for ammunition manufacturing and started running three Mark7's.  My friend said The Mark7 is a great machine when it runs.  But it really has it's own little problems. 

 

This echoed what @MountainMan stated.  My friend said one of the machines was down for 8 hours while he tried to fix what was stopping it.  He said he's getting really good at disassembly and re-assembly as he has done it multiple times.

 

BC

 

 

Edited February 19, 2021 by BillChunn

[erwos]

My impression is that the Apex is an attempt to fix many of those small problems.

[BiknSwans]

10 hours ago, HesedTech said:

As someone very dear to me would ask me (when it showed up in my work shop), "so what was wrong with the one(s) you already have?"

 

 

Really, my personal question is, other than a new press what advantages will you get over two 1050s, one already automated? If they are real benefits get it.

 

 

The Mark 7 auto drive powder check requires its own station.  So does the RCBS lock out die.  Wouldn't this eliminate using a bullet feeder and a powder check on the Dillon presses?  That for me would be a big advantage of the Mark 7 machine with its 10 stations.  When I decided to go to a progressive press, not being able to have both sent me straight to Mark 7.  But many loaders can, and do, use the bullet feeder, do not use a powder check, and do fine.

 

I can say that the RCBS lock out die I have installed helped keep me out of trouble when I was learning how to run my progressive Mark 7 Evolution.  Too many times.  Having 10 stations is appropriate for someone like me, intellectually challenged and financially gifted.

[ddc]

4 hours ago, erwos said:

My impression is that the Apex is an attempt to fix many of those small problems.

 

I hope so. 

 

My experience with the 1100 leads me to think it may not work out like that. 

Prior to purchasing it I might have assumed that the 1100 fixed some number of 1050 issues.

After using it for a year I doubt if that is true.

I've never owned a 1050 but it seems that everything that gives people trouble on a 1050 is there with the 1100 also.

 

Two different companies I realize...

[MountainMan]

The Apex is cheaper to make. The EVO CNC is a great piece of hardware but...too costly to make.

 

that was my take on the comms with folks at M7 when I first heard the cast version was coming out

 

I fully believe they could also integrate solutions into the Apex after identifying them on hundreds (thousands?) of Evos/Revis. But that was not the main impetus. 
 

It’s not a criticism. I want them to be profitable forever and if they have to make a cast unit to do that, so be it.

 

 

[rmantoo]

thanks for all of the replies!

 

My primary motivation is having a seperate powder check station.  I know, lots of ways to work around it, but I have been dissatisfied with that particular aspect of the 1050 since I added a bullet feeder several years ago.  
 

Likewise, my bench isn’t big enough to permanently mount 2 progressive reloaders, so I only rarely -twice- have used the super since I got it.  

Edited February 20, 2021 by rmantoo
Misspelled words

[MountainMan]

That’s a good reason, admittedly. I have that now too on my Evo....and The entire sensor suite. I just load pistol caliber now. but if you wanted a powder check and bullet feeder on the Dillon 1050\1100, The necessary compromise was a combination bullet seating/crimping die which just isn’t that good.

 

One of the quirks of the Mark 7 Is that if there is a digital clutch stoppage and you jog up to troubleshoot, then want to continue and hit end cycle, depending on how far down the toolhead came before it clutched,  it may have or may not drop more powder into the case upon resumption. So, without the powder check sensor, you have to remember this feature and clear that case. It was a bit of a stressor but I got into the habit of doing that. Now, with the powder check sensor, there’s that back up protectionfor that concern.

 

The single most common reason the powder check sensor fires now, however, is because there was something in the case Sharing space with the powder charge and accordingly triggering the power check sensor because it was running higher than normal. This has been gravel mostly...not removed during case prep and which for some reason did not hang during the decapping process.

 

but Please don’t expect to be up and running flawlessly 24 hours after the item arrives at your doorstep. Load up A month supply before you sell your Current press and plan on a learning curve with the new press.

[Zerofade]

10 hours ago, MountainMan said:

 

but Please don’t expect to be up and running flawlessly 24 hours after the item arrives at your doorstep. Load up A month supply before you sell your Current press and plan on a learning curve with the new press.

Excellent advice.  I am slowly getting my EVO to function correctly.  It took more time than expected just to operate properly with the handle, before I even added my autodrive.  I am now troubleshooting some sensor issues (Swage sense mostly).  I wish I had more ammo loaded before starting this process!

[HesedTech]

On 2/19/2021 at 9:46 AM, BiknSwans said:

That for me would be a big advantage of the Mark 7 machine with its 10 stations.

If you need the extra like the powder check then the extra stations are definitely a reason to buy it.

 

On 2/19/2021 at 9:46 AM, BiknSwans said:

Having 10 stations is appropriate for someone like me, intellectually challenged and financially gifted.

 

I really like this! The financial part that is.

[tmz]

I used to run the Dillon 1050’s nothing wrong with them but ultimately I absolutely love the Evolutions! 

I truly think set up was very very easy. 
 

 

[Sigarmsp226]

TMZ - Am I seeing this correctly - You are running a Dillon Powder Measure system on your EVO?

 

If I may ask - Why?

 

Thanks Mark

[tmz]

2 hours ago, Sigarmsp226 said:

TMZ - Am I seeing this correctly - You are running a Dillon Powder Measure system on your EVO?

 

If I may ask - Why?

 

Thanks Mark

Previous set ups where Dillon 1050’s and I had quite a few powder measures already set up for previous loads so I thought why not just use them they’ve always been dependable and work great with the powder I use. 

[cbrussell]

What is the purpose of the dial guage?

[tmz]

6 minutes ago, cbrussell said:

What is the purpose of the dial guage?

Measures the overall length of the round. 

[JatCarver]

I'm keeping my 1050 with mk7 auto drive mostly because I don't want to go through the hassle of setting up and more so fine tuning a new press. 

 

Just wanted to say that idea to put the dial indicator on your last stating to measure COAL is brilliant! I am jealous for sure, I would have to use a seat/crimp combo die(which I probably wont do) to do it on my press but I would like more info anyways? Is this a thing that can be bought or did you have to make it?

[tmz]

39 minutes ago, JatCarver said:

I'm keeping my 1050 with mk7 auto drive mostly because I don't want to go through the hassle of setting up and more so fine tuning a new press. 

 

Just wanted to say that idea to put the dial indicator on your last stating to measure COAL is brilliant! I am jealous for sure, I would have to use a seat/crimp combo die(which I probably wont do) to do it on my press but I would like more info anyways? Is this a thing that can be bought or did you have to make it?

I made it myself, well sort of.

I cut down a Dillon powder drop die and picked up the dial indicator from Harbor freight and got lucky enough to find a harden plastic bushing from the hardware store that had the right outer diameter to press into the powder drop die and the right inner diameter to push the dial indicator into. I made a total of 3 of them and it’s a really quick way of seeing the overall link without picking up anything and it doesn’t hurt that I had the last station with nothing for it.