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I wish Production wasn't dying


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6 hours ago, DirkD said:

USPSA isn't going to change a division equipment rule that would make people's existing gear (Mags, extensions etc.) illegal for the division.

They relax rules rather than make them more restrictive and making peoples gear illegal.

15 rounds doesn't make much sense, when the stages have 8 rounds per view max, either leave it at 10 rounds, or go to mag length, I don't see production ever changing from 10 rounds or Carry Optics reducing capacity.

Nothing wrong with 10 rounds in Production, if you don't like it, shoot limited.

 

I prefer to look at problems without preconceived notion pro or contra.  That's made me a much more effective leader in business.  But whatever.

 

And please don't lecture me about Production.  I've shot plenty of it and I enjoyed it just like it was.

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4 hours ago, Thomas H said:

 

That's wild!  Out here, Production is really, really common.

 

Was it always a low-turnout division?  Or has it dropped that much in the last year or two?

 

 

Production took a nosedive here in Ohio from 2018 to now.

 

Production used to be the second or third largest division, now it's barely ahead of single stack.  Some locals have single digit production participation.

 

At the same exact time CO has skyrocketed to become the second most popular right behind limited.

 

That, and presbyopia, is why I switched to CO.

Edited by SGT_Schultz
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Like so many, old eyes made me switch.  I really liked CO when it was 10 rounds, gave the best of the two worlds.  As a super senior now, I'm not as fast as I used to be, and CO goes to the young and speedy.

 

Nothing sucks more than feeling you shot a really great match than to find yourself at the bottom of the standings...

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Production is never going to go above 10rd mags... it is the avenue to get people into USPSA and needs to accommodate people from states with mag cap restrictions (which is like 15% of states along with every major metro areas in the country).

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On 11/23/2020 at 11:47 AM, waktasz said:

 

Seems to be locale dependant. Since I've been in Florida there is only one poor soul shooting Production at any of the 4 clubs I've been to so far. 

what the hell did pepperoni go and do now, or is he still shooting that barretta limited minor appendix 

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On 12/3/2020 at 4:57 PM, mikeg1005 said:

Production is never going to go above 10rd mags... it is the avenue to get people into USPSA and needs to accommodate people from states with mag cap restrictions (which is like 15% of states along with every major metro areas in the country).

If accommodating people from those states was a real concern, we'd have Open-10 and CO-10 and PCC-10 as well.   CO got massively more popular when it went from 10 rounds to hicap.

 

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On 12/3/2020 at 11:57 AM, mikeg1005 said:

Production is never going to go above 10rd mags... it is the avenue to get people into USPSA and needs to accommodate people from states with mag cap restrictions (which is like 15% of states along with every major metro areas in the country).

 

Actually, very few metropolitan areas have capacity limits.  Outside of the NE and CA, virtually none of them do.  Yours being the exception.

 

Production doesn't need to accommodate the minority with artificially low magazine limits.  If Production goes above 10, you all can still shoot it like CO, Open, and Limited shooters do in ban places.

 

The argument that Production is an avenue to get people into USPSA is a joke.  Seriously.......look at what Production lets you do to a pistol now compared to 4 - 5 years ago.....LOL.  And ironically enough, Production's mag capacity limits makes it UNATTRACTIVE to the new guy who shows up with a Glock and 2 or 3 magazines.  Noobs are immediately directed to Limited where they get to fill up their magazines to capacity.

 

 

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15 hours ago, SGT_Schultz said:

 

The argument that Production is an avenue to get people into USPSA is a joke.  Seriously.......look at what Production lets you do to a pistol now compared to 4 - 5 years ago.....LOL.  And ironically enough, Production's mag capacity limits makes it UNATTRACTIVE to the new guy who shows up with a Glock and 2 or 3 magazines.  Noobs are immediately directed to Limited where they get to fill up their magazines to capacity.

 

 

 

...for the first match or two, while they buy a couple of extra mags and mag pouches.  After that, they move to Productiion where their gun fits.  Noobs might initially be directly to shoot Limited Minor, but (hopefully) no one tells them to stay there, at least not with a stock 9mm.

 

And sure, in Production you CAN do a lot to the gun now.  But you don't need to do so to be competitive at a local level.  On the other hand, shooting a stock gun in Limited ISN'T likely to be competitive even at a local level.  (Glock 17 with a 17-round mag shooting Minor versus a 2011 with basepads shooting Major...not a good match.)

 

Judging from this thread, things vary widely on a geographical basis---but at least around here, Production continues to be popular, particularly among new folks after a match or two.  

 

In general, in our area, Production IS indeed an avenue to get people into USPSA.  Plenty of folks shooting their 9mm mostly-stock guns in Production at local matches.

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2 minutes ago, Racinready300ex said:

I left limited for CO in part because locally that is where the most heat is. 

 

Prod has taken a massive hit in the area, Lim wasn't hit as bad. CO is the biggest division at most of the club matches I go to. And sectionals are starting to look the same.

 

GM Nick going to be very said you said that

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I actually Pulled all match data for my club and there was a pretty dramatic spike in carry optics around June of last year where carry optics doubled and production cut in half. 
 

don’t know if something happened there or if it was just coincidence 

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On 12/11/2020 at 9:40 AM, Russty said:

I'm a C shooter, soo close to B, and all the completion has evaporated. I won Production in my last match of the season and it felt blah, as I was one of four.

That's rough. I ended up division-hopping a bit until I found something I liked. Landing in Revolver, I expected a lack of local competition, but it's tough starting out when you have heat to match up against and watching it vanish.

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12 minutes ago, waktasz said:

lol wut

I think @Fishbreath is saying he knew there isnt much heat in Revo and that he sympathizes with anyone who got into Production because they ised to have local heat but said heat has moved to CO.

 

It took me a couple tries to understand.

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Twinkie's got it. At least around here, Production used to be where you went if you wanted consistent locap heat. Now there's nowhere to go. (Which isn't to say there are no good locap shooters around, just that there are few enough that there's not one at every match anymore.)

Edited by Fishbreath
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I do not claim to be a smart man, but from what I have seen, stage design has more to do with it than anything. I like prod, but if the stages are designed by open/limited shooters all the time prod just is not as fun. Also people are lazy, shoot hi cap you don't have to think as much.

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31 minutes ago, floater said:

if the stages are designed by open/limited shooters all the time prod just is not as fun.

I never cared about that.  Production is all about embracing the suck.

 

31 minutes ago, floater said:

 shoot hi cap you don't have to think as much.

I think it's the opposite.  Production's limitations give you fewer options to think about during stage planning.  Hi cap divisions open up more possibilities that you have to think through and sort out.  Much more risk vs reward is available.

 

 

 

 

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