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Sp01 red dot options


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I made the mistake of shooting a stage yesterday with a canik with a red dot last night, and though it was the first rounds through this configuration I shot better and faster with the red dot. I think triggerwise the cz is still better but that red dot...

 

Much easier to focus on the target rather than the front sight with a blurry target, and as a added plus it was much easier to see the hits on steel rather than just listening for hits. 

 

So today I've been looking through my options. First direct mount versus a mounting plate. I understand the sight axis will be higher with the mounting plates, and this harder to pickup if you're used to irons. But its definately not as permanent. So the jury is still out on that.

 

I maybe deluding myself but I am clinging to the hope that even my more competition orientated firearms are still suitable for self defense. Being that I'd like to keep some sort of BUIS. From what I can see vortex has some marks that could function as rear backups if the dot goes down, and leupold has an add on that could function as well. It doesnt appear that a mounting plate or even machine directed mounts would provide an option for BUIS, but curious what people have and have found to work.

 

Thank you.

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If your SP-01 is only for sport, forget the back up sights.  Seriously, just let them go.  I was where you are a year ago.  Trust me on this.  I'm not even sure they're necessary for self defense anyway.  If you need to shoot someone 10 yards away and the dot is dead but you see his chest through the lens, blast him.

 

As far as how to hook up the dot, get the slide milled.  No half measures that you can easily undo.  There is a learning curve to dots, and even if it's relatively shallow like it was for me and like it seems will be for you, make it so that you can't go back or you'll be tempted.

 

Not everyone mills the 75 and its derivatives but here are some places that say they do:

 

https://www.fire-4-effect.com/Trijicon-RMR-Mounting_p_179.html

 

https://primarymachine.com/cz-75-85-1911-2011-mill-for-rmr/

 

 

 

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^^what SGT said^^I've had a vortex on plates for two different guns and just got fed up with odds and ends loosening up so I scraped the idea and sent my SP01 into CZ Custom for milling. It took a bit of time (I've read that other machine works have a shorter turn around) but that dot is ON THERE solid. I'm not a fan of back up sights and I don't use the vortex white stripes. Spend time on indexing and your natural point of aim and you won't need the back up sights or the vortex stripes.

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30 minutes ago, SGT_Schultz said:

If your SP-01 is only for sport, forget the back up sights.  Seriously, just let them go.  I was where you are a year ago.  Trust me on this.  I'm not even sure they're necessary for self defense anyway.  If you need to shoot someone 10 yards away and the dot is dead but you see his chest through the lens, blast him.

 

As far as how to hook up the dot, get the slide milled.  No half measures that you can easily undo.  There is a learning curve to dots, and even if it's relatively shallow like it was for me and like it seems will be for you, make it so that you can't go back or you'll be tempted.

 

Not everyone mills the 75 and its derivatives but here are some places that say they do:

 

https://www.fire-4-effect.com/Trijicon-RMR-Mounting_p_179.html

 

https://primarymachine.com/cz-75-85-1911-2011-mill-for-rmr/

 

 

 

 

But But But, I on occasion will carry it...ok not often, only on the occasions where a rifle would look a bit out of place...

 

CZCustom is local to be so I'd probably be going with their plate system. But the leupold dpp and their cz adapter plate does look tempting...

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I ended up getting an extra slide for my SP01 Shadow from Stuart at CZ Custom and having it milled for a red dot (Vortex in my case).  That way it's a pretty simple switch of slides between Production and Carry Optics.  Not the cheapest option but so much easier than switching plates and re-zeroing, etc.

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2 minutes ago, MoRivera said:

I ended up getting an extra slide for my SP01 Shadow from Stuart at CZ Custom and having it milled for a red dot (Vortex in my case).  That way it's a pretty simple switch of slides between Production and Carry Optics.  Not the cheapest option but so much easier than switching plates and re-zeroing, etc.

 

That's not a bad idea either, I might have to keep an eye out for extra slides.

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Another vote for zero buis. I've had the CZC plate system and a dovetail dot mount on different SP01 Shadows. The dot is nice, you'll enjoy it. The 6 moa Venom is a choice I like.

Edited by rowdyb
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1 hour ago, rowdyb said:

Another vote for zero buis. I've had the CZC plate system and a dovetail dot mount on different SP01 Shadows. The dot is nice, you'll enjoy it. The 6 moa Venom is a choice I like.

 

Any thoughts on the two different mounting options?

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10 minutes ago, ultimase said:

 

Any thoughts on the two different mounting options?

 

Dovetail mounts suck.

 

Anything not Trijicon sucks.  Best get two of them right off the bat if you buy something other than Trijicon.

 

Name some other reflex sight brand that can routinely go over 10K rounds riding on a slide without failure.  I can't, and my Trijicon RMR has done it.

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My first two CO guns when the division still only allowed 10 rounds were SP01 Shadows with RMR's on them. One on a plate and one on a dovetail. (I currently use an OR version Shadow 2 with a SRO)

 

Dovetail mounts are only for dabblers or people who already have "some sight" sitting around unused and want to try it.

 

Having had guns direct milled I would only go that route now if it was a secondary slide, sharing duties with a stock slide on the same frame. I much prefer factory ready optics guns now. With there being no SP01 version like that I would get the CZC plate route. Having the lowest possible dot is over rated, especially when talking about a 4mm difference.

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2 hours ago, ultimase said:

 

That's not a bad idea either, I might have to keep an eye out for extra slides.

Stuart sometimes has them up in the classifieds in the CZ Forum, but you can also just ask him via PM if he has any.  I did the same with long slides that I have another Shadow frame....essentially Tactical Sport slides that fit SP01 frames.  One with irons, another with optic.

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2 hours ago, rowdyb said:

My first two CO guns when the division still only allowed 10 rounds were SP01 Shadows with RMR's on them. One on a plate and one on a dovetail. (I currently use an OR version Shadow 2 with a SRO)

 

Dovetail mounts are only for dabblers or people who already have "some sight" sitting around unused and want to try it.

 

Having had guns direct milled I would only go that route now if it was a secondary slide, sharing duties with a stock slide on the same frame. I much prefer factory ready optics guns now. With there being no SP01 version like that I would get the CZC plate route. Having the lowest possible dot is over rated, especially when talking about a 4mm difference.

 

It's funny you mention dabblers who already have "some sight" sitting around, as I just realized I have a burris fast fire sitting around. I realize 4 mm difference can be huge, but likely trainable. I am very tempted to pick up the czc plate for now and put the burris on it for a few matches. 

 

The leupold mount fits the cz contour so it's actually pretty low, alas it only really fits the dpp or shield type red dots. 

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1 hour ago, MoRivera said:

Stuart sometimes has them up in the classifieds in the CZ Forum, but you can also just ask him via PM if he has any.  I did the same with long slides that I have another Shadow frame....essentially Tactical Sport slides that fit SP01 frames.  One with irons, another with optic.

 

Thank you I'll have to stop in or pm.

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1 hour ago, jkf74 said:

I have the CZcustom plate system on my SP-01 Shadow. It was well worth the money. I much prefer the versatility of the plates over direct milling. Also seems like dots last longer on plates than they do direct mounted. 

Plus you can get a plate in case you want to convert it back to irons. 

8BDA30BF-F24A-4DEA-ACDB-12C85BBCA046.jpeg

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I just built a SP-01 into a CO gun with a upper with an accubushing I bought from Stuart.  I ended up just sending him the entire gun frame for a total make over.  I looked into the different options and I believe CGW has the deepest cut slide but you can not go back or use BUIS which I agree are useless and a distraction.  I ended up with the CZcustom plate system which is really a nice option since you can still run iron sights and easily change optics to another brand of dot.

 

Unfortunately I have not had much time to get to the range with the new gun but did put 150rds through it last night and finally zeroed the SRO.  I can't wait to use it in a steel plate match.  BTW I have a complete SP-01 upper slide I will let go for cheap if you are interested.  If you want a Shadow one without a FPB one I would check with Stuart.  CZcustom did an awesome job on the build and I am super happy with it.

 

 

 

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I have the CZC plate system on my SP01 as well as my Bull Shadow. The option to switch out optics with different foot prints is why I went with the plate over direct milling. Well worth the wait time and cost.

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10 hours ago, MoRivera said:

Need be clear though as to whether your gun is a 'regular' SP01 (with internal firing pin block), or a Shadow.

 

Plain jane regular sp01 non shadow.

9 hours ago, jkf74 said:

I have the CZcustom plate system on my SP-01 Shadow. It was well worth the money. I much prefer the versatility of the plates over direct milling. Also seems like dots last longer on plates than they do direct mounted. 

 

Do you mean the milled plate system, or the dovetail system?

7 hours ago, ramnj said:

Plus you can get a plate in case you want to convert it back to irons. 

8BDA30BF-F24A-4DEA-ACDB-12C85BBCA046.jpeg

 

I admit that is very cool, and likely the path I'd choose if I decide to go with a permanent mount.

2 hours ago, ML123 said:

I just built a SP-01 into a CO gun with a upper with an accubushing I bought from Stuart.  I ended up just sending him the entire gun frame for a total make over.  I looked into the different options and I believe CGW has the deepest cut slide but you can not go back or use BUIS which I agree are useless and a distraction.  I ended up with the CZcustom plate system which is really a nice option since you can still run iron sights and easily change optics to another brand of dot.

 

Unfortunately I have not had much time to get to the range with the new gun but did put 150rds through it last night and finally zeroed the SRO.  I can't wait to use it in a steel plate match.  BTW I have a complete SP-01 upper slide I will let go for cheap if you are interested.  If you want a Shadow one without a FPB one I would check with Stuart.  CZcustom did an awesome job on the build and I am super happy with it.

 

 

 

 

Thank you, I just found your post last night, I'll have to go through it. I am curious of the upper slide if you would direct message me.

1 hour ago, mveto said:

I have the CZC plate system on my SP01 as well as my Bull Shadow. The option to switch out optics with different foot prints is why I went with the plate over direct milling. Well worth the wait time and cost.

 

It looks like czcustom is quoting about 8 weeks for the work, and roughly $200 with one included plate. 

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43 minutes ago, ultimase said:

It looks like czcustom is quoting about 8 weeks for the work, and roughly $200 with one included plate. 

Yeah it’s a bit more than direct milling but IMO worth it, my SP01 took about 5 weeks to get back and the Bull Shadow was about 7 weeks even though I was quoted 8 weeks. It really just depends on how much work they have.

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Good thread, i am considering a red dot on my CZ75B SA right now.

CZ Custom might be the right choice for me also.

I was hoping to find a inexpensive red dot as I only do a once a month casual shoot at an indoor range; shoot and go eat and talk about it. no prizes.Some retired Boeing employees and me. 

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23 minutes ago, Max It said:

Good thread, i am considering a red dot on my CZ75B SA right now.

CZ Custom might be the right choice for me also.

I was hoping to find a inexpensive red dot as I only do a once a month casual shoot at an indoor range; shoot and go eat and talk about it. no prizes.Some retired Boeing employees and me. 

 

From what I can find thus far:

Dovetail mounts: egw (multiple optic options), czcustom (plates appears to be pretty universal), leupold mount (only would fit jpoint, shield and dpp)

Dovetail mounts do work, but they will be higher than milling the slide, also can be an issue as your sight will be a bit higher on bore axis. Also if you've trained a lot of irons they will be slightly higher on presentation. But cost wise, much less.

 

Milling the slide: cgw, czc, primary machine, there are a lot that can do the work. Milling the slide would get you the lowest possible sight to bore axis. Many of the places milling have limited options for optics, and changing would take a bit of work. CZC has a plate system that can be replaced dependent on which optic you are using, they even have a plate that has a way to mount iron sights.

 

Reading through the actual red dots, it looks like failures are fairly normal, and given the environment they are in, it's not entirely too surprising. 

Edited by ultimase
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11 hours ago, ultimase said:

 

Plain jane regular sp01 non shadow.

 

Do you mean the milled plate system, or the dovetail system?

 

I admit that is very cool, and likely the path I'd choose if I decide to go with a permanent mount.

 

Thank you, I just found your post last night, I'll have to go through it. I am curious of the upper slide if you would direct message me.

 

It looks like czcustom is quoting about 8 weeks for the work, and roughly $200 with one included plate. 

I have the milled plate system. It took around 7 weeks to get my upper back. 

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