Using Airsoft as a training tool

[SWoody]

Hi all, 

 

I'm a younger guy who began his interest in firearms due to playing airsoft in my teen days. 

 

Now, I'm beginning to pickup USPSA and can't help but feel as if airsoft is one of the most viable tools for practicing indoors/ with a lower budget. 

 

Are there any folks who routinely use airsoft guns to practice? I'd be interested in hearing how you think the skills translate, as I have quite a lot of experience in the former field and am highly considering building an airsoft replica of my CZ Shadow II to practice draws/transitions/movement with in the backyard with smaller cardboard targets. 

 

Looking forward to further discussion between two of my favorite hobbies. 

[WFargo]

Hi, yes, I decided at the start of the first lockdown here in the Netherlands in March, to become a member of the Dutch Airsoft association and purchase a pistol for in-house training. 

I decided to go for a Tokyo Marui as they were supposedly high quality with parts readily available and very easy to customize. 

It fits in my holster and I can set up any drill or stage in my house I feel like. I have taken off all plastic parts and replaced them for metal. 

It is completely identical to my limited blasters including weight. The only difference is the minimal recoil, but it is in my opinion the most realistic way of training, plus it is a lot more fun than dry fire.  With dry fire you need to be 'honest' with regards to your sight picture / grip / trigger control... with airsoft, it simply forces you to do so... because you are actually shooting!  My house is one big IPSC-stage.... my wife hates me for it....  It is apparantly no fun to step on an airsoft BB with bare feet... 

Here's my custom blaster... 

 

[38super]

Get some Lego's they're even better on bare feet.

[WFargo]

Yep, got those as well... 

[konkapot]

I've tried it on and off over the years. Not enough translation from airsoft to livefire performance. Anything I could do with airsoft I could do just as well in dryfire. 

 

Airsoft works good for force on force stuff. 

[Ming the Merciless]

I use airsoft quite a bit.  Like WFargo, I built an airsoft 'Open' pistol identical to my Steel Challenge pistol, it even says 'Limcat' on the slide (Sorry Johnny!) and used it to teach my wife for her first Steel Challenge match.  It worked great, I have a full set of scaled down Steel Challenge targets that I set up in my backyard.  We went step by step from un-bagging to Make Ready, just like it was a real match with a timer and used all the correct commands.  After several weeks of training, she shot her first match and did quite well.  I like using airsoft for first shot drills on the Challenge targets, but I did make one mistake....I let my wife shoot the airsoft plate racks and Texas Star, so I had to build another 'Open' airsoft pistol, so she could have the 'Limcat'.

[SWoody]

Great replies thus far. I appreciate the input. 

 

I also am thinking about building a Glock replica from a Tokyo Marui base. I've seen that Guarder makes a full steel slide kit which sounds delightful for practicing with (and possibly may add some more recoil). 

 

I have done quite a bit of dry firing for both my G19/Shadow II around the house, but want to get more practice with the "sights bouncing" during the recoil action. I have noticed that my ability to transition between targets during live fire is thrown off due to the recoil. I have a tendency to lose the front sight during a quick transition after a shot and think airsoft will definitely help with this (and at a much cheaper cost). 

 

Does anyone actually play airsoft as a training tool for force-force tactics? I feel as if that may also be something to consider, especially at more military-simulation type events. 

[SWoody]

22 hours ago, WFargo said:

Hi, yes, I decided at the start of the first lockdown here in the Netherlands in March, to become a member of the Dutch Airsoft association and purchase a pistol for in-house training. 

I decided to go for a Tokyo Marui as they were supposedly high quality with parts readily available and very easy to customize. 

It fits in my holster and I can set up any drill or stage in my house I feel like. I have taken off all plastic parts and replaced them for metal. 

It is completely identical to my limited blasters including weight. The only difference is the minimal recoil, but it is in my opinion the most realistic way of training, plus it is a lot more fun than dry fire.  With dry fire you need to be 'honest' with regards to your sight picture / grip / trigger control... with airsoft, it simply forces you to do so... because you are actually shooting!  My house is one big IPSC-stage.... my wife hates me for it....  It is apparantly no fun to step on an airsoft BB with bare feet... 

Here's my custom blaster... 

 

This is a beauty. I dig the framecut as well. Any issues installing aftermarket parts into the Marui? 

[WFargo]

No issues at all, installing aftermarket stuff... It may require some very very limited adjusting / filing / sanding, but it's really super simpel. 

On top of that, anything you need to do, you can find tutorials about it on youtube. 

Actually that force on force stuff is very big here in the Netherlands. Skirmishes, they call them. It's not for me, but I understand people like it. If you see the gear these guys are using, I'm betting some actual operators might be jealous. 

For me it was really about adding another 'level' to my training at home. It's not a replacement for dry fire, but it's a fun addition. Even though I'm quite serious about IPSC shooting, the first and foremost is, that it needs to be fun. 

On top of that, I got interested in IAPS (airsoft practical shooting) and actually signed up for the Dutch Open Championship (which is a very very very well organised international match, run in such a way that IPSC / USPSA could learn a thing or two).... but then COVID f#cked that up as well..... so haven't shot a match, yet.... but it will happen!

 

[Ming the Merciless]

There have been a couple of local airsoft USPSA/IPSC matches here.  A friend went to one and shot some video, it looked like fun, so I went to the next one.  Unfortunately a bunch of Skirmish Timmys showed up and pretty much spoiled it for everyone with their attitudes.  I guess shooting fast at small targets is hard or something.

[SGT_Schultz]

19 hours ago, SWoody said:

I have done quite a bit of dry firing for both my G19/Shadow II around the house, but want to get more practice with the "sights bouncing" during the recoil action. I have noticed that my ability to transition between targets during live fire is thrown off due to the recoil. I have a tendency to lose the front sight during a quick transition after a shot and think airsoft will definitely help with this (and at a much cheaper cost).

 

I hate to say this but airsoft will not help you solve this problem at all.  They have very little recoil.

 

The only way to learn how to control a centerfire pistol in recoil is..............................wait for it............................shooting a centerfire pistol.

 

There's no simulation that I know of that will replicate the forces acting on your hands and arms when a real firearm is fired

[RJH]

I have never messed with air soft, but I figure there must be something to it.  Tatsuya Sakai, who is from Japan, practiced exclusively with an airsoft gun in Japan, as real guns are not legal, then came to the US a month ahead of the 2004 Steel Challenge championship to get sometime with a real gun, and then won the match.  So probably worthwhile practice.  Good luck

[perttime]

Action Air, shot with airsoft pistols, is a Discipline of its own in IPSC. Obviously, the recoil isn't the same as with a center fire pistol. But all the other stuff is there. Stages are just usually with short distances and reduced size targets.

You get breaking down the stage, target transitions, reloads, movement. All the things that really determine your time. And you know where your hits (if any) are on the targets. The Asian guys who are currently winning everything are seriously fast.

[SWoody]

13 hours ago, SGT_Schultz said:

 

I hate to say this but airsoft will not help you solve this problem at all.  They have very little recoil.

 

The only way to learn how to control a centerfire pistol in recoil is..............................wait for it............................shooting a centerfire pistol.

 

There's no simulation that I know of that will replicate the forces acting on your hands and arms when a real firearm is fired

This is fair. I understand that the recoil with airsoft gas blowback pistols won't come close to mimic'ing a 9mm/.40. 

 

However, I think just having the feedback of the slide moving when I pull the trigger may help train my eyes to follow that front sight post a bit better during the slide action. 

 

I don't intend to replace my own training of live fire, but rather, use airsoft as an aide during times when I cannot live fire. 

[SWoody]

11 hours ago, perttime said:

Action Air, shot with airsoft pistols, is a Discipline of its own in IPSC. Obviously, the recoil isn't the same as with a center fire pistol. But all the other stuff is there. Stages are just usually with short distances and reduced size targets.

You get breaking down the stage, target transitions, reloads, movement. All the things that really determine your time. And you know where your hits (if any) are on the targets. The Asian guys who are currently winning everything are seriously fast.

I just searched through some YouTube content on action air. Those guys can fly! 

 

I think I'm going to pickup a Tokyo Marui G19 and an ASG Shadow II. I'll keep you guys posted with the results when I get them in! 

[Ming the Merciless]

22 hours ago, RJH said:

I have never messed with air soft, but I figure there must be something to it.  Tatsuya Sakai, who is from Japan, practiced exclusively with an airsoft gun in Japan, as real guns are not legal, then came to the US a month ahead of the 2004 Steel Challenge championship to get sometime with a real gun, and then won the match.  So probably worthwhile practice.  Good luck

 

Sakai shot every day for a month and the rumors were something like 1,000 rounds a day.

 

[RJH]

21 minutes ago, Ming the Merciless said:

 

Sakai shot every day for a month and the rumors were something like 1,000 rounds a day.

 

 

 

That is awesome and wouldn't surprise me,  but I would still have to believe that the airsoft practice still played a big part in his performance.

 

On a side note I remember seeing him shoot on tv way back and he a strange stance, but i guess it worked for him 

[SWoody]

Update: Purchased an ASG Shadow II (C02 version). Very fun to play with and I've had a tough time putting it down. Being able to grab it and plink whenever I choose is incredible. We'll see if it pays off come next match, but I feel as if my manual of arms with the system has become much better in the past week I've been using the ASG replica then transitioning to dry-fire on the CZ. 

[AngeloConde]

On 11/21/2020 at 1:04 PM, SWoody said:

Update: Purchased an ASG Shadow II (C02 version). Very fun to play with and I've had a tough time putting it down. Being able to grab it and plink whenever I choose is incredible. We'll see if it pays off come next match, but I feel as if my manual of arms with the system has become much better in the past week I've been using the ASG replica then transitioning to dry-fire on the CZ. 

Thats awesome I was actually just looking at that considering of getting a real shadow 2 again. And start in carry optics 

[eboadway]

Made a few target traps and shot in the basement for the first time. Great tool here in the Northeast where it's 20 degrees outside! Used 1/2 scale targets and worked great!

[fraizer15]

I shoot open and tried airsoft. Never could get a gun with the same or similar feel as my match gun so I now just dry fire and work on calling the shots.

[StefVanHauwe]

 

[Muricanwerewolf]

I credit a winter of playing with my airsoft guns in the basement with a large jump in my skill level. Now I mostly just dry fire because it's a bit more convenient but it's a great bridge between dry fire and live fire. People worry about the recoil not being the same and then go and dry fire, where there's no recoil. So that criticism doesn't make much sense.