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Bullets Out Magazine - Illegal?


Mikemiller69gs
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All, I currently shoot in SSP but planned to shoot my Kimber 1911 in the reshoot this Sunday. I was taking inventory this morning and double checking the CDP rules and stumbled accross a rulle in the Magazine Holder section off the General Rules, that stated "Bullets Out" magazine holders were illegal. 

A. Is this still accurate?

B. Why are they illegal?

C. If I need to buy another Mag Holder for a single stack, what is your preference?

 

Thanks for your help.

 

Mike

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IDPA requires race gear to pretend to be serviceable as concealed carry gear. Some version of why these aren’t   practical to conceal when you make a trip to the store is going to be the reason they’re not permitted.

 

 

Edited by MemphisMechanic
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For the same stupid reason it's illegal to place ammunition carriers wherever you want on your belt, in whatever orientation works best for you so long as they're concealed, which is what people actually do when the carry concealed pistols.

Edited by SGT_Schultz
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  • 3 months later...
On 10/5/2020 at 6:03 PM, SGT_Schultz said:

For the same stupid reason it's illegal to place ammunition carriers wherever you want on your belt, in whatever orientation works best for you so long as they're concealed, which is what people actually do when the carry concealed pistols.

AMEN BROTHER!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

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Where's the LIKE button?

I shoot IDPA (and USPSA, and SCSA, and some outlaw knockoffs) and agree that some of the rules keep me from fully expressing myself.  But it doesn't bother me enough to make me quit going.  

 

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Just now, rowdyb said:

Stop confusing IDPA with training. It is a test of certain skill within a prescribed rule set and NOTHING else.

Sadly the Org doesn't do enough to propagate this line of thought and encourages the fud and tribalism, to those club's and the national org's detriment.

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Wouldn't it be awesome if there was a sport where people used there ACTUAL carry gear.  I have done it a time or two in USPSA and wish there was a place to do it against other people using their actual carry gear.  Maybe not even a whole sport, maybe just a match or 2 that was  carry gear oriented

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8 hours ago, RJH said:

Wouldn't it be awesome if there was a sport where people used there ACTUAL carry gear.  I have done it a time or two in USPSA and wish there was a place to do it against other people using their actual carry gear.  Maybe not even a whole sport, maybe just a match or 2 that was  carry gear oriented

Ever been to a IDPA BUG match?  I've been to a couple years ago.  It was all carry gear!

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2 hours ago, stick said:

Ever been to a IDPA BUG match?  I've been to a couple years ago.  It was all carry gear!

I have not, but I don't carry a BUG legal gun so it is not really what I am talking about.  What i would like to see is people show up with their actual carry guns and shoot.  Whether it is a j frame, shield, G19, p 365, etc.,  dots vs irons, major vs minor, but it would have to be peoples ACTUAL main  carry gun, in their ACTUAL daily clothes, with their ACTUAL main  daily carry rig.   Not their, "I carried my SVI limited gun once as a joke" type stuff, but their actual carry gun.  I know something like this would have to be run on the honors system and their would be a douche or 2 that would cheat, that is why just a match or 2 here and their would probably be better than trying to dedicate a whole sport to it, plus no probably one would want to do it more than every once in a while  anyway

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My club hosts a couple outlaw matches every year specifically intended for CCW guns/gear.  All it takes is somebody willing to organize it.  

 

It’s kind of a hybrid between USPSA and IDPA, with even a little bit of 3-gun rules thrown in.  

 

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15 hours ago, RJH said:

Wouldn't it be awesome if there was a sport where people used there ACTUAL carry gear.  I have done it a time or two in USPSA and wish there was a place to do it against other people using their actual carry gear.  Maybe not even a whole sport, maybe just a match or 2 that was  carry gear oriented

How about people who carry a J frame or small semi auto with no extra ammo. Would you have 5 rounds or less stages or compromise and allow them to carry more ammo?

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9 minutes ago, MHicks said:

How about people who carry a J frame or small semi auto with no extra ammo. Would you have 5 rounds or less stages or compromise and allow them to carry more ammo?

They better put some ammo in their pocket. Part of the point of the match at, least in my mind, would be to sort out what works and what doesn't. Probably a max of twenty or so rounds a stage though would be plenty. Everyone would shoot heads up

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5 hours ago, RJH said:

I have not, but I don't carry a BUG legal gun so it is not really what I am talking about.  What i would like to see is people show up with their actual carry guns and shoot.  Whether it is a j frame, shield, G19, p 365, etc.,  dots vs irons, major vs minor, but it would have to be peoples ACTUAL main  carry gun, in their ACTUAL daily clothes, with their ACTUAL main  daily carry rig.   Not their, "I carried my SVI limited gun once as a joke" type stuff, but their actual carry gun.  I know something like this would have to be run on the honors system and their would be a douche or 2 that would cheat, that is why just a match or 2 here and their would probably be better than trying to dedicate a whole sport to it, plus no probably one would want to do it more than every once in a while  anyway

I see your point.  Let me be a little more clear.  BUG matches or outlaw matches require you to shoot your carry gear/gun.

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21 minutes ago, stick said:

I see your point.  Let me be a little more clear.  BUG matches or outlaw matches require you to shoot your carry gear/gun.

Gotcha.  I thought you were talking specifically idpa BUG matches that require something like a j frame or lcp.

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1 hour ago, RJH said:

They better put some ammo in their pocket. Part of the point of the match at, least in my mind, would be to sort out what works and what doesn't. Probably a max of twenty or so rounds a stage though would be plenty. Everyone would shoot heads up

Yes you'd need to allow them to carry more ammo but that in itself is a compromise away from what they actually carry. Just an example of needing to compromise in order to be able to have matches vs  what people do in real life.

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21 minutes ago, MHicks said:

Yes you'd need to allow them to carry more ammo but that in itself is a compromise away from what they actually carry. Just an example of needing to compromise in order to be able to have matches vs  what people do in real life.

I guess they won't come to shoot my fake match that I'm not having lol

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I see two types of outlaw matches.

I am smarter than Bill Wilson and whothehellever at USPSA.  

The one here is "just like" IDPA except he marks the threat targets, not the non-threat.  But that is just one of many.

I have shot them for convenient trigger time but I don't really approve of them, the local rules can mess with your mind when you get to a regulation match.

 

The specialty match.  My club holds the occasional IDPAish revolver match.  If you don't own one, you just get six in your clips.

I shot a pre Covid matche that is an annual affair for "hideable" guns.  Not exactly IDPA CCP or BUG but somewhat in between.  

Three divisions, 4" auto, 3" revolver,  and "Glock 19 if you must."  

 

The last IDPAish shoot here considering shortages and wintry weather was half BUG, half SSP. 

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On 1/24/2021 at 2:18 PM, 45 Raven said:

And of course the great thing about rules that are declared "stupid" by some shooters:  Participation in said sport is not mandatory.

 

You're absolutely right.  That's why, in western Ohio, USPSA is flourishing and IDPA is barely hanging on not just in numbers but in the quality of the competition.

 

Which is the same answer you got in pistol-forum from someone else to your same exact comment over there.

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6 hours ago, stick said:

I see your point.  Let me be a little more clear.  BUG matches or outlaw matches require you to shoot your carry gear/gun.

 

Unless of course you carry AIWB?

 

Or is that legal in a BUG match (and just illegal in any other IDPA match.)

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On 1/24/2021 at 2:18 PM, 45 Raven said:

And of course the great thing about rules that are declared "stupid" by some shooters:  Participation in said sport is not mandatory.

Doesn't change the fact they still have stupid rules and Safety Officers looking to screw a shooter whenever they can.

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12 hours ago, sundevil827 said:

Or is that legal in a BUG match (and just illegal in any other IDPA match.)

 

No.

BUG is a main match division and everything but the size of the gun is standard.

 

Edited by Jim Watson
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2 hours ago, Jim Watson said:

 

No.

BUG is a main match division and everything but the size of the gun is standard.

 

 

Thanks, its been awhile since I shot a match, and I know that AIWB is not legal, but even when I regularly shot IDPA, never had a BUG match, so had no idea. 

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