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X5 Legion barrels and accuracy


Lesliet
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  Greetings, all!  

     I had some curiosity concerning accuracy with the X-5 Legion stock barrel. I probably have 10k rounds or so through mine, and have yet to see any groups less than ~3" at typical competition distances, with any of the load combinations I've tried, even off a rest. I am wondering about others' experiences with this, is this just how the factory barrels are? For those who have switched to an aftermarket barrel, which one(s) did you choose, and how has it worked out?   I recently started practicing with a 5" revolver in .45 acp, and it makes much tighter groups with the right loads, like 1.75" at 13 yards, so that makes me think maybe it's not just poor technique on my part.  The Sig works ok for steels, and has been a good gun for getting started in run and gun competition, but I'd like to tighten things up a bit. 

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 I get groups of less than 1.25" at 10 yds with both of my X5 Legions.  I have found that my Legion hates heavy for caliber bullets, i.e. 147 gr bullets.  I get much better groups with 124/125 gr and 135 gr bullets.  My theory revolves around velocity mostly.  I don't think that barrel likes slower bullets.  I seemed to get better groups when I upped the charge on 147 gr bullets, but the groups were still sub standard in my eyes.

 

Edited by Boomstick303
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My experience is similar to Boomstick. 

 

I can put a whole mag in a ~2" ragged hole inside 10 yards and get most of my hits well withing a 3.5" shoot n see style target at 20 and that's my limitations on being consistent, not the gun's. 

 

I also got significantly better groups with fast 124gr loads than with 147gr loads. So far the most accurate ammo I have shot through it has been old S&B bulk 124 FMJ. They have kind of long bullets and run about 1100fps in my gun. Compared to some 147 plated running about 870fps, it was about double what the S&B did where some old 14gr fmj loads form the lat time I shot 9mm were cranking about 1050fps and were close in accuracy to the S&B. My new initial loads with 124gr JHP were running about 1030fps average and were not quite as accurate as either of the other 124gr loads I tried. 

 

Digging around various forums, I've seen similar results. Fast 124 being the sweet spot with fast 115 being pretty good as well, and slower 147 causing a bit of aggravation for some. 

 

Now I just have to get out and try my new faster 124gr JHP load. 

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20 minutes ago, Lesliet said:

That might be my issue, then, I mostly prefer 135 and 147 grain projectiles, and I'm right around 135 pf. I'll try loading some 125's to run around 1100 and see how that does. 

Thanks for the feedback!

 

Note, some on the forum have had good luck with 147 gr in the X5 Legions.  This was my personal experience.  

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Hello: I have a regular X5 and it does not like 147 grain bullets for accuracy. 124-125 grain bullets I can get 3" groups off hand at 25 yards. With the 147's I am lucky to get a 6" group. This is with the power factor in the 131-134 range for everything. Next I will be trying some 115's to see how they will do since I have a bunch of those I want to use up. Thanks, Eric

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I was shooting 147 gr SNS and Xtreme plated through my CZ Shadow 2 with great grouping results. Chrono around 130 pf.   Those same rounds did not group well when I moved to the X5 Legion.  I've experimented with 124 and 115 grain.  And for me, I've found the best results with 115 grain. 124 gr grouped better than 147, but not as well as 115.  Also, i found around a 135 pf also groups better than below 130 pf. 

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  • 3 weeks later...

Hi, all!

  Just wanted to revisit this with some range results.  I obtained a bunch of plated bullets and did some testing, in my Sig P320 X5 Legion, stock barrel, 13 yard targets. 

My best results are with two bullets, a 125 grain powerbond plated target hollowpoint, and surprisingly, a plated 147 grain rnfp. Using Titegroup, the 125 runs about 1113 fps for a pf of 139.  ~ 2" groups off a rest, which is quite acceptable for me... probably do better out of a Ransom rest, I'm not the best precision shooter. The 147s grouped similarly, at 962 fps, pf=141.  Recoil is pretty light and soft, especially on the 125 load.  I'll use the 125s for USPSA and Steel Challenge, the 147s will be good for the monthly match I go to that has falling steel. I tried several powders, including HP-38 and HS-6, but none of them really did very well for this load,except for the Titegroup, and those last two also had an unpleasant recoil impulse.  I've heard that the jacketed bullets are even more accurate, but the cost/benefit trade-off doesn't make sense for me in the kind of matches I shoot, and at my skill/income level. 

 

   So, I guess I don't need to worry about a barrel upgrade until I wear this one out. :)

 

   

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Reading back through some of the other posts, it occurs to me that faster bullets with a longer bearing surface seem to do well in this gun.  The hollowpoints I was talking about fit that description; being hollowed out, the extra material goes to making it longer, and this specific bullet has a short ogive that requires loading to a coal of .995" to gauge. (Resulting in a longer bearing surface on this bullet shape, compared to ones with a longer, more tapered nose.)

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I have terrible accuracy with my X5 Legion. Regardless of bullet choice. 115, 124, 147....  various power factors as well. It just does not group well for me. I can easily hold tight groups out to 20yds with any other handgun we own. In fact, I can get better groups with iron sights at 20yds with literally any other pistol, than I can at 10 with the X5. It's a bit frustrating. I used it this season in Carry Optics and went with the "good enough for USPSA" theory, but lately been getting quite a few longer shots at matches and it's really been an issue. Finally started hunting for answers/fixes and instead I found a surprisingly amount of similar stories. I have been shooting 124gr match loads for the past while, but group size has not changed between any of the ammo I have tried. Our Shadow2 will shoot any ammo accurately, regardless of bullet grain. The X5L refuses to make a tight group. Lockup seems to be good. Thought about changing the barrel out, but have also read a good target crown job has helped one person. Maybe it is time to sell and switch divisions. 

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1 hour ago, punisher911 said:

I have terrible accuracy with my X5 Legion. Regardless of bullet choice. 115, 124, 147....  various power factors as well. It just does not group well for me. I can easily hold tight groups out to 20yds with any other handgun we own. In fact, I can get better groups with iron sights at 20yds with literally any other pistol, than I can at 10 with the X5. It's a bit frustrating. I used it this season in Carry Optics and went with the "good enough for USPSA" theory, but lately been getting quite a few longer shots at matches and it's really been an issue. Finally started hunting for answers/fixes and instead I found a surprisingly amount of similar stories. I have been shooting 124gr match loads for the past while, but group size has not changed between any of the ammo I have tried. Our Shadow2 will shoot any ammo accurately, regardless of bullet grain. The X5L refuses to make a tight group. Lockup seems to be good. Thought about changing the barrel out, but have also read a good target crown job has helped one person. Maybe it is time to sell and switch divisions. 

 

How many rounds through the gun?  Do you have a second Legion, or X5?

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48 minutes ago, Boomstick303 said:

 

How many rounds through the gun?  Do you have a second Legion, or X5?

Approx 3000 rds and sadly, only 1 X5 Legion. lol Accuracy has been the same from day one. I was quite shocked, but just stuck with the "good enough" mindset. As time goes on, it is really starting to bother me. Specially as I have been getting more and more long shots in my USPSA matches. 

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1 minute ago, punisher911 said:

Approx 3000 rds and sadly, only 1 X5 Legion. lol Accuracy has been the same from day one. I was quite shocked, but just stuck with the "good enough" mindset. As time goes on, it is really starting to bother me. Specially as I have been getting more and more long shots in my USPSA matches. 

 

You mention that you are using this in Carry Optics.  What optic are you running for a dot?  Have you vetted out the optic?  Have you put irons back on it to make sure the optic is not the issue.  If you shoot irons off a bench and the accuracy is off with that little of round count I would contact Sig.  Sig is very receptive to issues and are pretty easy to contact.

 

 

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18 hours ago, Boomstick303 said:

 

You mention that you are using this in Carry Optics.  What optic are you running for a dot?  Have you vetted out the optic?  Have you put irons back on it to make sure the optic is not the issue.  If you shoot irons off a bench and the accuracy is off with that little of round count I would contact Sig.  Sig is very receptive to issues and are pretty easy to contact.

 

 

I have a Level 2 match Saturday, after that I am taking the dot off to verify. It is a Sig Romeo 1 Pro. So far the only thing I have come across is 1-2 people getting the crown recut seemed to help. I know it isn't the norm for these to be inaccurate, but I was surprised to see as many others complain about it as I have. 

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  • 2 weeks later...
  Greetings, all!  
     I had some curiosity concerning accuracy with the X-5 Legion stock barrel. I probably have 10k rounds or so through mine, and have yet to see any groups less than ~3" at typical competition distances, with any of the load combinations I've tried, even off a rest. I am wondering about others' experiences with this, is this just how the factory barrels are? For those who have switched to an aftermarket barrel, which one(s) did you choose, and how has it worked out?   I recently started practicing with a 5" revolver in .45 acp, and it makes much tighter groups with the right loads, like 1.75" at 13 yards, so that makes me think maybe it's not just poor technique on my part.  The Sig works ok for steels, and has been a good gun for getting started in run and gun competition, but I'd like to tighten things up a bit. 

Might need to send it to The Sig Armorer to fit a match barrel or try the drop in first like I did (needs to increase throating) This is his match fit in mine... A little side to side but front to back is tight to slide. Shoots 1" off hand for me at 10y. Was previously 4”.

62ea1dd16c7b0556ef42a7d2b6d3ca3d.jpg

Semi fit drop in
ef7d7e463e0b4bbf4a958e4bb9b88616.jpg

Semi fit didn’t help one Legion but dropped other one from 4” to 2".

125gr Precision Bullet, 4gr WST, 1.115” OAL.
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1 hour ago, Stician said:

Might need to send it to The Sig Armorer to fit a match barrel or try the drop in first like I did (needs to increase throating) This is his match fit in mine... A little side to side but front to back is tight to slide. Shoots 1" off hand for me at 10y. Was previously 4”.
 

That's a nice improvement!  So, when you say it needs to increase throating, do you mean that rounds which would plunk/spin in the stock barrel don't plunk in the Bar-Sto?  

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That's a nice improvement!  So, when you say it needs to increase throating, do you mean that rounds which would plunk/spin in the stock barrel don't plunk in the Bar-Sto?  

Exactly. I had to load the 125gr RN to 1.09” to plunk. I wasn’t happy and sent it to TSA for throating. My OEM barrels are the early ones with LCI cut. Dimensionally they were identical but not the slides. I really had higher hopes for the Legions but after investing in supporting gear and optics I didn’t want to abandon the platform to chase accuracy. Given how my match barrel still has a little side to side play, I suspect it is why Grey Guns are fitting barsto to a 4.7” 320 slide.
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Hello: I think need to do some testing to see what load works best in your pistol. Here is my 27 yard 5 shot group off hand with a stock P320 X5 non legion. These were just some Acme 124's, Clean Shot powder, Winchester small pistol primers and range brass. They are 134 power factor. I get the same results using plated, coated and jacketed bullets with a power factor of 134-140. Thanks, Eric

IMG_4102.jpg

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18 minutes ago, Aircooled6racer said:

I think need to do some testing to see what load works best in your pistol.

That recent testing I did has paid off well. Got 1st at the September Speed Steel, out of all centerfire pistol.  Still waiting for scores from the benefit match yesterday, I know I didn't win that one, but I did pretty well on 3/5 stages.  The other two, well... my problem wasn't the gun, but let's just say I observed where some deficiencies in my training are, and have come up with plans to improve those areas.  :)   I really like the 147 grain load for falling steel, it has low recoil, for being 149 pf, feels more like 135, but has enough poot to drop anything you get even a poor hit on. And it does ~ 2" groups at 13 yards. 

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