Zeroing a red dot?

[Stafford]

At what distance should a dot be zeroed at for USPSA Carry Optics division? I've heard 25 or 20 yards commonly used. However, it seems that most shots taken are in the 10-15 yard range, though some are less. 

 

If zeroed at 20 yards, what does it do to accuracy at 10 yards? 

[davsco]

with every gun, barrel and load different from others, i'd just pick a zero (20-25 sounds good) and then shoot 0-50yds and see where you're hitting so you can adjust poa as needed at a match.

[stick]

20 to 25 yard zero is common because this is usually the longest shot you'll encounter in USPSA.  Zero your gun and shots taken at 10-15 will only be a 1" or so off.  Once you zero the gun, put out four targets. one at 20 yards, one at 15 and one at 10 and one at 3.  Shoot them to determine holdover.  It's easy and you'll have the answers you ask.

[waktasz]

18.5

Meters

[Don_B]

Don't over think it! Where you zero is not as important as knowing where your holds are at different distances. 

 

For over 20 years I have zeroed my open guns at 15 yards. I have no issues hitting plates at 50 yards just by knowing where to hold, anything closer I just hold on. Except for a very close target with a no-shoot or hard cover, then I hold high because of the offset from the bore. 

[shred]

Knowing your holds is key.  If you zero further out (25-50), then all your impacts are below the line of sight.  If you zero in close, you can have both above and below holds, but they can be less.

 

If you mess around enough with ballistic calculators you can find a distance where if you zero using the top of the dot, the bullet stays under the dot out further than you care to shoot.  That often ends up around 18 yards for me.

[waktasz]

If you're thinking about hold overs except for on extreme close or far shots, you're doing it wrong.

[SGT_Schultz]

4 hours ago, waktasz said:

If you're thinking about hold overs except for on extreme close or far shots, you're doing it wrong.

 

This.  I can't believe how so many can overcomplicate something so simple.  I zero at 20 yards and don't worry about it from there on.

 

Even extremely close shots are a no brainer.  Look at the size of the A zone..............

[SGT_Schultz]

6 hours ago, Stafford said:

If zeroed at 20 yards, what does it do to accuracy at 10 yards? 

 

Nothing significant

Edited August 27, 2020 by SGT_Schultz

[waktasz]

5 minutes ago, SGT_Schultz said:

 

This.  I can't believe how so many can overcomplicate something so simple.  I zero at 20 yards and don't worry about it from there on.

 

Even extremely close shots are a no brainer.  Look at the size of the A zone..............

 

I was thinking more about upper A zone only targets with a NS below that
 

[echotango]

That is why I zero 10-12yrds. Most NS are close. At 25 yards I am <2" low.  I don't have to pay attention to hold over at all.  

 

Edited August 27, 2020 by echotango

[Sethdaniel05]

I zero at 10 to 12 and then confirm at 25. I’m only about 1” difference at 25. Not enough for me to think about hold overs.


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[Tango]

9 hours ago, Don_B said:

Don't over think it! Where you zero is not as important as knowing where your holds are at different distances. 

 

For over 20 years I have zeroed my open guns at 15 yards. I have no issues hitting plates at 50 yards just by knowing where to hold, anything closer I just hold on. Except for a very close target with a no-shoot or hard cover, then I hold high because of the offset from the bore. 

are you really thinking hold overs in the heat of the stage? i mean, i feel that i have to slow down so much to even think about it

[Intheshaw1]

I think it's import to know your holdovers moreso on really tight shots with no shoots. Shot a 3 gun stage where there were 6 really close rifle targets that we're all NS besides the head. About a third of the shooters hit a NS at least once.

 

Now, the offset on an AR is a lot more, but it's still worth knowing what it is on a tight shot.

[Don_B]

1 hour ago, Tango said:

are you really thinking hold overs in the heat of the stage? i mean, i feel that i have to slow down so much to even think about it

With my open gun sighted in at 15 yards the only hold over I worry about is on a very close target, 3-5 yards with a no shoot right below the head. At that distance your poi will be low because of the height the red dot is above your bore. Of course the type of red dot and mount will determine how much that is. That is why you need to know what the holds are for your gun. 

 

The key to this is not to think about it, Just know that on the close targets you will hold at the top of the head  

[echotango]

1 hour ago, Don_B said:

 

 

The key to this is not to think about it, Just know that on the close targets you will hold at the top of the head  

That's thinking about it. Time wasted. 

[sheepdog566]

Any reason why I would be hitting 4” right at 25...dead on at 10

[Tango]

1 hour ago, Don_B said:

With my open gun sighted in at 15 yards the only hold over I worry about is on a very close target, 3-5 yards with a no shoot right below the head. At that distance your poi will be low because of the height the red dot is above your bore. Of course the type of red dot and mount will determine how much that is. That is why you need to know what the holds are for your gun. 

 

The key to this is not to think about it, Just know that on the close targets you will hold at the top of the head  

it can't be low more than 2 inches unless you use a ridiculously high optic, but i don't know your setup obviously....worrying about being 2 inch low at super close targets?....i dont know, seems slow to me

Edited August 28, 2020 by Tango

[Tango]

i zero at 10yd and try to shoot a 5 shot group in 1 inch circle, then confirm at 25...with 147grain minor PF ammo both are usually dead on....i dont have to think hold overs or anything like that

 

it maybe a bit high at 40yds, but most likely i will pull down too...so no big deal

[Don_B]

26 minutes ago, Tango said:

it can't be low more than 2 inches unless you use a ridiculously high optic, but i don't know your setup obviously....worrying about being 2 inch low at super close targets?....i dont know, seems slow to me

An open gun with a vertical Cmore mount is 2" offset. So it doesn't matter if it is sighted in at 10 or 15 yards it is still going to be low at 3 yards.

 

If your setup works for you that is great. Mine works for me so we are all good. 

[Tango]

47 minutes ago, Don_B said:

An open gun with a vertical Cmore mount is 2" offset. So it doesn't matter if it is sighted in at 10 or 15 yards it is still going to be low at 3 yards.

 

If your setup works for you that is great. Mine works for me so we are all good. 

Yea, but it will be at most 2 inches low, and at most distances less low....maybe you miss an A box but you wont pull it into the no shoot because of offset. You shoot open so C's shouldn't be a big deal. Am I missing something?

[Don_B]

13 minutes ago, Tango said:

Yea, but it will be at most 2 inches low, and at most distances less low....maybe you miss an A box but you wont pull it into the no shoot because of offset. You shoot open so C's shouldn't be a big deal. Am I missing something?

No apparently I am missing something. I tried to give the original poster some information about sighting in red dots and have found out that I am doing everything wrong. So I will withdraw from this conversation so you can share your wisdom. Adios. 

[SGT_Schultz]

13 hours ago, waktasz said:

 

I was thinking more about upper A zone only targets with a NS below that
 

 

Yep those are tough, but judging by the offset I have to apply to the dot drill at 5 yards at worst all I'll get is A-C if I aim right for the center of the noggin.  If I hit the NS is because my grip got loose or I slapped the s#!t out of the trigger.

 

I'm currently shooting a P-10 OR so the dot sits pretty low on it.

Edited August 28, 2020 by SGT_Schultz

[jcc7x7]

7 hours ago, sheepdog566 said:

Any reason why I would be hitting 4” right at 25...dead on at 10

Do you have an off set mount?

[shred]

You don't think about the offsets while you're shooting the stage.  You set those when you're doing your walkthrough.  If you're not visualizing where the dot needs to go on each target, up your walkthrough game.

 

Now that the sport is almost all 25-yards and in, the need to know where you hit at 35 or 40 or 50 is much less.  Used to be every Area match had a few at 50 if not straight-up 50-yd standards and an A/B only at 25 was groaned about but not unexpected.