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223 to 300 BLK RT1500 trim Problems


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All - I starting using my RT1500 to convert and Trim 223 (LC brass) to 300 BLK OUT - I am not getting clean cuts for some reason - lots of brass flashing/spiraled material remains - any ideas how to correct?
 

I tried one of the “chip breaker” cutters. The one I have helps a little. It’s form GSI international. A local company here in the valley. I know several companies make these cutters. I’d also be curious to know if anyone has had better luck with one bs another.


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I have made lots of 300 BO cases with the RT1500. 

 When I pull the handle all the way down,I let it off and go back down to the bottom of the stroke. 

Kind of a retap at the bottom. Seems to help with the tails left behind. 

I find that it does leave a sharp edges. It would be nice to find a way to clean up the edge and chamfer the inside so it doesn't damage the bullets when being pressed into the case. 

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I have made lots of 300 BO cases with the RT1500. 

 When I pull the handle all the way down,I let it off and go back down to the bottom of the stroke. 

Kind of a retap at the bottom. Seems to help with the tails left behind. 

I find that it does leave a sharp edges. It would be nice to find a way to clean up the edge and chamfer the inside so it doesn't damage the bullets when being pressed into the case. 

 

Couple things. I do find the GSI cutter makes a cleaner cut than the Dillon cutter. I used to double clutch when I started. Don’t need to any more. The GSI tool head and dies is a 2 step process. First GSI die is a rough size and trim. 2nd GSI die is final trim and size. Leaves a very nice mostly clean neck. It’s more work than doing it in one pass, but as you’re finding you’re gonna do the work one way or another.

 

For bulk practice ammo I wet tumble all my 223 (5.56) / 300 blackout after resizing on the 650/RT1500. Knocks the burs left right off.

 

I also load bulk stuff on 650 w/ bullet feeder so I have an Lyman M die at station 1. The M Die knocks off any bur left behind and opens the mouth just enough for the bullet feeder to place a bullet without it falling over. This is true for 300 BO or 223/5.56.

 

https://www.gsiinternational.com/trim-dies-_8_4243.html

 

They used to make a cool tool head, but maybe don’t produce it anymore.

 

 

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24 minutes ago, iflyskyhigh said:

 

 

https://www.gsiinternational.com/trim-dies-_8_4243.html

 

They used to make a cool tool head, but maybe don’t produce it anymore.

 

 

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So what you are saying is you run the cases thru on two passes. 

 One with the GSI semi size die and then the completed sizing trim die last. 

 Looks like if I try this out I would like to come up with a lock nut with a set screw in it so I get the trimmer back to the same spot each time. Without to much work. 

 Any idea who makes the nuts with setscrew. 

 I did buy one of the tool heads with the built-in vacuum port. It works great. 

Edited by Jsjac
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So what you are saying is you run the cases thru on two passes. 
 One with the GSI semi size die and then the completed sizing trim die last. 
 Looks like if I try this out I would like to come up with a lock nut with a set screw in it so I get the trimmer back to the same spot each time. Without to much work. 
 Any idea who makes the nuts with setscrew. 
 I did buy one of the tool heads with the built-in vacuum port. It works great. 

Yes. Two passes. It doesn’t really matter if you lock the trimmer in. You’re gonna to readjust it any way. The initial rough trim is way to long. You’re gonna have to adjust the trimmer down for the final size.

Like I said it’s work. But you’re gonna have to work in one spot or another. This way I don’t have to handle the brass. Just pop it back in the case feeder. Reset the trimmer and go. I do have two different tool heads. One with the rough cut die and one with the final size die. Then I just leave the final die set up for further resizing and trimming fired brass. I know you don’t need to trim every time but sometimes I get range brass that wasn’t mine mixed in so I run it through the trimmer set up wether it needs it or not.

Further more, to complicate things even more, I run an RCBS small base die on station 1 of the rifle size when I’m trimming brass down for the first time from 223. That way I KNOW it will chamber.

I make thousands of 300 BO brass at once so I don’t have to do it often. It is kind of a PIA.

I then anneal all newly formed 300 BO brass.

I do use quite a few locking die rings. My favorites are the RCBS ones.


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Looks like they no longer sell the tool head with the built in vacuum port 
 
Instead of two passes has anyone considered using the 2” mini chop saw first and then only one pass with the RT1500?

I used to use the Harbor Freight saw before I got the RT1500.

It’s a pain. IMHO its more work. And it tears up the necks. It’s not a clean cut.


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Looks like they no longer sell the tool head with the built in vacuum port 

 

Instead of two passes has anyone considered using the 2” mini chop saw first and then only one pass with the RT1500?

 

Thank you for sharing your experiences with the HF chop saw

 

I noticed my vacuum line was plugged with brass shaving so maybe that is why is was have trouble getting a clean cut?

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Looks like they no longer sell the tool head with the built in vacuum port 
 
Instead of two passes has anyone considered using the 2” mini chop saw first and then only one pass with the RT1500?
 
Thank you for sharing your experiences with the HF chop saw
 
I noticed my vacuum line was plugged with brass shaving so maybe that is why is was have trouble getting a clean cut?

It’s possible the case is spinning too as your trying to cut it. This could lead to the rough cut.

I spoke with the engineer down at GSI and he explained that’s why they went with the two stage cut down. They noticed that often when trying to cut a case all the way down in one pass, the case would often start spinning in the die and screw everything up. Hence the two stage process. I know there are people who do it one pass, guess sometimes it works sometimes it doesn’t.


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  • 6 months later...

I’m a bit frustrated with the Dillon 1500 trimmer. No matter what speed I drive the tool head or how many passes I make, the carbide cutter produces a long strand of brass that wraps around the cutter spindle and clogs up the mechanism. I can’t trim more than two pieces without pulling a rats nest of thread from the cutter. After talking with Dillon I re-indexed the carbide cutter to try another cutting service - no joy.  
 

Is there another style of carbide insert with chipbreaker grind?

 

I want to resize and trim 223 brass down to 300blk in ONE pass. I don’t wanna fart around with chopsaw’s and multiple tool heads.

 

 

74BCF0E3-D090-4A77-96A2-6B39E7285B76.jpeg

179304D9-FE9E-4ADF-943E-4C830CD33B27.jpeg

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On 3/6/2021 at 12:06 PM, TDean said:

I’m a bit frustrated with the Dillon 1500 trimmer. No matter what speed I drive the tool head or how many passes I make, the carbide cutter produces a long strand of brass that wraps around the cutter spindle and clogs up the mechanism. I can’t trim more than two pieces without pulling a rats nest of thread from the cutter. After talking with Dillon I re-indexed the carbide cutter to try another cutting service - no joy.  
 

Is there another style of carbide insert with chipbreaker grind?

 

I want to resize and trim 223 brass down to 300blk in ONE pass. I don’t wanna fart around with chopsaw’s and multiple tool heads.

 

 

74BCF0E3-D090-4A77-96A2-6B39E7285B76.jpeg

179304D9-FE9E-4ADF-943E-4C830CD33B27.jpeg

Are you using the vacuum attachment to clean the cuttings out. 

I have had to clean the cuttings out once and a while. 

 I use a clear piece of tubing between the vacuum head and the vacuum hose to see the cuttings go by. 

I have never had stuff pile up in the case like that. 

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On 3/6/2021 at 10:06 AM, TDean said:

I’m a bit frustrated with the Dillon 1500 trimmer. No matter what speed I drive the tool head or how many passes I make, the carbide cutter produces a long strand of brass that wraps around the cutter spindle and clogs up the mechanism. I can’t trim more than two pieces without pulling a rats nest of thread from the cutter. After talking with Dillon I re-indexed the carbide cutter to try another cutting service - no joy.  
 

Is there another style of carbide insert with chipbreaker grind?

 

I want to resize and trim 223 brass down to 300blk in ONE pass. I don’t wanna fart around with chopsaw’s and multiple tool heads.

 

 

74BCF0E3-D090-4A77-96A2-6B39E7285B76.jpeg

179304D9-FE9E-4ADF-943E-4C830CD33B27.jpeg

I think you case is spinning in the die as the case is cut down, before it reaches the 300 BO shoulder, hence the final picture.

 

It’s a lot of brass coming off. Make sure you have sufficient suction on the vacuum. 
 

Try one of the chip breaker cutting heads. They don’t eliminate the problem but they help. 

 


 

 

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  • 3 weeks later...

Not new to the site, but new to making 300 blackout. I'm having issues that seem to me to be more operator malfunction than problems with the equipment. I'm using an RT1500 on a 650 Dillon. I have the correct tool head. What is the best process steps to turn the 223 into 300 B/O. How many tool heads need to be committed to the process of making a round and what stations do what task? 

 

Here's how I started doing it. I sized the 223 brass in a Dillon 223 sizing die and de-primed. The it cycled to the 1500 to be cut and trimmed and formed to 300. I'm using the Whidden die as the Dillon was not available.. I had the brass shaving issues but I solved a lot of it when I went a 6 horsepower shop-vac. Wow that's loud! Anyway, then I run the cut brass through the deburr stage, and run them all through the Sheridan cutaway case gauge. 99.5% of them plunk in. A few don't. I cull them out. 

 

Then I change tool heads and and start to load. Install primers, powder/expand with "C" drop, bullet (220gr Berry's flat bottom), crimp and I have a final product. Again, some don't fit the case gauge. And they won't go into battery. The ones that fit work flawlessly and cycle my 16" barrel no problem.  

 

I know I'm doing something wrong but after 3 weeks of trying to sort it out, I'm at a loss. This is why I'm asking. 

 

Last night the RT1500 was cutting the brass at an angle. I've changed nothing. No idea why it decided to do that. I have the CSI cutter but haven't installed it yet. Sorry for the lengthy post, but I don't want to go any further without some advice. 

 

Oh, I'm using Remington .223 brass no crimp pockets. and I've cut them to 1.350. 

 

 

Thanks............ John

 

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6 minutes ago, coltfreak said:

Not new to the site, but new to making 300 blackout. I'm having issues that seem to me to be more operator malfunction than problems with the equipment. I'm using an RT1500 on a 650 Dillon. I have the correct tool head. What is the best process steps to turn the 223 into 300 B/O. How many tool heads need to be committed to the process of making a round and what stations do what task? 

 

Here's how I started doing it. I sized the 223 brass in a Dillon 223 sizing die and de-primed. The it cycled to the 1500 to be cut and trimmed and formed to 300. I'm using the Whidden die as the Dillon was not available.. I had the brass shaving issues but I solved a lot of it when I went a 6 horsepower shop-vac. Wow that's loud! Anyway, then I run the cut brass through the deburr stage, and run them all through the Sheridan cutaway case gauge. 99.5% of them plunk in. A few don't. I cull them out. 

 

Then I change tool heads and and start to load. Install primers, powder/expand with "C" drop, bullet (220gr Berry's flat bottom), crimp and I have a final product. Again, some don't fit the case gauge. And they won't go into battery. The ones that fit work flawlessly and cycle my 16" barrel no problem.  

 

I know I'm doing something wrong but after 3 weeks of trying to sort it out, I'm at a loss. This is why I'm asking. 

 

Last night the RT1500 was cutting the brass at an angle. I've changed nothing. No idea why it decided to do that. I have the CSI cutter but haven't installed it yet. Sorry for the lengthy post, but I don't want to go any further without some advice. 

 

Oh, I'm using Remington .223 brass no crimp pockets. and I've cut them to 1.350. 

 

 

Thanks............ John

 

I’d skip the 223 sizing process to start. Seems unnecessary and may lead to the case spinning inside the 300 blackout die while the 1500 is trying to trim. Seems like the case spinning inside the die is what leads to many peoples cutting issues. This is the reason GSI went with a 2 step process for cutting and then trimming to length.

 

Not saying you can’t do it in a single step....

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1 hour ago, iflyskyhigh said:

I’d skip the 223 sizing process to start. Seems unnecessary and may lead to the case spinning inside the 300 blackout die while the 1500 is trying to trim. Seems like the case spinning inside the die is what leads to many peoples cutting issues. This is the reason GSI went with a 2 step process for cutting and then trimming to length.

 

Not saying you can’t do it in a single step....

Thank you. I looked at the GSI dies but they don't have a finish die in stock and no word on when they would get one. How does the 2 step process actually work? Do I need 2 trimmers? If I bought the GSI rough die and combined it with the Whidden die would that work for now?

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23 hours ago, coltfreak said:

Here's how I started doing it. I sized the 223 brass in a Dillon 223 sizing die and de-primed. The it cycled to the 1500 to be cut and trimmed and formed to 300. I'm using the Whidden die as the Dillon was not available.. I had the brass shaving issues but I solved a lot of it when I went a 6 horsepower shop-vac. Wow that's loud! Anyway, then I run the cut brass through the deburr stage, and run them all through the Sheridan cutaway case gauge. 99.5% of them plunk in. A few don't. I cull them out. 

 

Then I change tool heads and and start to load. Install primers, powder/expand with "C" drop, bullet (220gr Berry's flat bottom), crimp and I have a final product. Again, some don't fit the case gauge. And they won't go into battery. The ones that fit work flawlessly and cycle my 16" barrel no problem.  

 

 

Dont forget to run them through a FL resize die.  That will fix any cases that didnt get 100% done in the forming die.

 

My process is tumble clean, run through rollsizer, run through 1050 to deprime/swage/trim to 1.355 then load normally.

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On 3/25/2021 at 11:38 AM, coltfreak said:

Thank you. I looked at the GSI dies but they don't have a finish die in stock and no word on when they would get one. How does the 2 step process actually work? Do I need 2 trimmers? If I bought the GSI rough die and combined it with the Whidden die would that work for now?

Sorry for delay.

 

I only have 1 trimmer, but I use 2 tool heads. One of the tool heads is set up with the rough trim die and decapper. The other is final trim and size die. I just move the trimmer around. Not worth it to me to have multiple trimmers. 


My final step on the second tool head is to run finished case through a Forster full length sizing die with the decapping pin removed so I can use it in the final station. I also use the second tool head for fired 300 blackout brass.

 

It’s time consuming but I’m doing thousands of cases at a time so I’m not doing it often. I also only use LC brass for 300 BO. I bought a poop ton of LC 5.56 brass years ago that had damaged necks that worked perfectly for the task.

 

You I can use any die you want for the final trim if you can get ahold of the GSI rough trim die.

 

I’m out on the road. I’ll try and get pictures of my tool heads for you when I get home. 
 

if you go back and read my other post above I think I may have gone into more detail. 

Edited by iflyskyhigh
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This die works great for 300:

https://www.whiddengunworks.com/product/trim-die-2/

 

And this blade for your trimmer is designed to prevent those brass curlicues.

https://ballistictools.com/store/rt-1200-carbide-cutting-blade-for-Dillon-rapid-trim

 

I decap, trim, test (gauge each cartridge), ream/swage (I like the ream pockets best) crimp pockets and then clean the brass.  Now I have perfect brass ready to load.

 

 


 

 

 

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Ok, I am going to suggest a solution- no offense to anyone - I saw similar results when I first got my trimmer used - and was just figuring out how to set it up.  Is the carbide cutter on the trimmer shaft on backwards ? I was trying to figure out why I was getting the results I was in trimming some 30-06 - and it dawned on me to look at the cutter. when I turned it around, it worked as it should.  the guy before me must have installed it backwards, and I did not know any better. I am trimming down 30-06 to 7.7 x58 right now and that is trimming a LOT of brass,no issues. ( I use a 308 trim die and adjust it to get min case length in the 7.7.)

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  • 2 weeks later...

Thanks for the replies gents.  I am using vacuum.  I talked with Dillon tech who said I was probably being to careful on the down stroke.  He told me to be more deliberate (quicker).  He was right!  Problem solved!  😉

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