tnoble Posted August 15, 2020 Share Posted August 15, 2020 Sending my new S2 off at the first of the week to have the slide cut for CO. Was just planning on the optic cut only but now I’m second guessing if I should have the slide lightened. I know I don’t have to since they increased the weight limit for CO. Pros cons either way? Thanks, T Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malarky112 Posted August 15, 2020 Share Posted August 15, 2020 Plan on shooting IDPA at all? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KlausN Posted August 15, 2020 Share Posted August 15, 2020 I don’t think lightening cuts are “needed”. An indication if you should pay for it might be your level of shooting. So if you don’t know if you need it then you probably don’t need it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tnoble Posted August 15, 2020 Author Share Posted August 15, 2020 Maybe IDPA once a year, not really my thing. as far a my level of shooting I typically run in the top 10 plus or minus overall at the locals. However I do not have any experience with CO. Can’t pickup the front sight as fast as I would like any longer so looking to make a switch. The little bit that I have run the S2 I feel that it would be okay at full weight, maybe a little top heavy? Just wanted to hear from the S2 guys if they felt there was an advantage on way or the other. Thanks, T Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CharlieD Posted August 15, 2020 Share Posted August 15, 2020 Check out the new Harbinger V1 cut from Primary Machine, it’s a good middle ground on slide weight, and it looks good too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stmark73 Posted August 15, 2020 Share Posted August 15, 2020 (edited) I have both a lightened and a non lightened shadow 2 slide milled for CO. The lightened slide feels snappier for me compared to the soft recoil of the non lightened slide. I use 124gn bullets at 130-135 pf. thank you, Mark Santos Edited August 15, 2020 by Stmark73 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tnoble Posted August 15, 2020 Author Share Posted August 15, 2020 The harbinger V1 &V2 is what got me second guessing having the slide lightened, looks good. but as Stmark stated If lighten is noticeably snapper I would prefer the slower impulse feel of the heavier slide. Is one way harder on the optic taking a beating. More weight coming to a stop or Is snappier harder on the optic. Going to run the SRO. Thanks, T Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CharlieD Posted August 15, 2020 Share Posted August 15, 2020 The V1 puts the slide at the same weight as the Glock 17 I was shooting, but with a heavy steel frame, not snappy at all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zzt Posted August 15, 2020 Share Posted August 15, 2020 4 hours ago, tnoble said: but as Stmark stated If lighten is noticeably snapper I would prefer the slower impulse feel of the heavier slide. Is one way harder on the optic taking a beating. More weight coming to a stop or Is snappier harder on the optic. Going to run the SRO. Thanks, T A lightened slide is only 'snappier' if you use the same recoil spring. You tune your gun and load together to see what reduces muzzle rise. Consider that you will add weight with a plate and SRO. The added weight will slow the slide speed. So you lighten the slide to offset that weight. Ideally the weight would be removed at the rear of the slide, if possible. I currently have six slide mounted optics. None has ever failed due to recoil. The longest serving is on a 1911 45 (44,000 rounds). If you have tuned your gun/load so the slide does not slam back at the end of the stroke your dot will be fine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zombywoof Posted August 15, 2020 Share Posted August 15, 2020 You always want a lighter slide. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eerw Posted August 15, 2020 Share Posted August 15, 2020 Too light... the gun will handle like s#!t. cut for the dot and run drills. then start cutting in small increments if needed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gregj529 Posted August 15, 2020 Share Posted August 15, 2020 I did the Harbinger cut before they added the new one. I couldn't be more pleased with the look and feel of the gun. No issues with groups from the lightened slide. I'd say do it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tnoble Posted August 16, 2020 Author Share Posted August 16, 2020 Thanks for the input, seems like most are in favor or like the lightened slide. I can’t get it sent out until Tuesday morning so I still have a couple days to think it over. I know I could send it back for additional milling after the optic cut but would like to send it once and pay once. Shouldn’t be this hard Those that had to have it done under the old rules would you do it now? Thanks, T Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darqusoull13 Posted August 17, 2020 Share Posted August 17, 2020 No point in lightening it. You're just asking for a problem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ck1 Posted August 17, 2020 Share Posted August 17, 2020 (edited) 48 minutes ago, Darqusoull13 said: No point in lightening it. You're just asking for a problem. I tend to agree there's no point really in lightening the slide now given the rules change on weight, but I don't know if you'll have a problem by lightening the slide (unless the lightening-cuts end up having you crack a slide prematurely, which I guess it could make more likely to happen). Thing is, IMO one of the CZ's built-in design advantages is their slides already have less-mass riding over the frame than most other designs and there really isn't a whole bunch of weight in the slide to lose, and seems like the trend is heading towards having an overall heavier gun. The thing about lightening-cuts too is they're permanent, whereas it might just be better to play around with recoil springs to change slide velocity that way and find what one likes. Most/all of the guys I've seen with dots on S2's didn't have the slides lightened to necessarily change how the gun feels, they just did it because they had to in order to make weight under the old rules. Edited August 17, 2020 by ck1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darqusoull13 Posted August 17, 2020 Share Posted August 17, 2020 Great follow up and I completely agree. You USED to have to do it. Now it's modifying the expensive part of the gun (slide) instead of the cheap parts (springs) to tune recoil. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chgofirefighter Posted August 17, 2020 Share Posted August 17, 2020 Personally, I wouldn't go with Primary Machine slide cuts but only do Cajun Gun Works, they do extensive research vs cosmetic look. Talk to Scott at Cajun Gun works and he'll make it right! Also, it all boils down to personal preference, I'm using a 9lbs recoil spring and lightened slide by Cajun and its super flat but then again I load my own ammo which makes 130+ PF. Lastly, doesn't matter if your slide is lightened or not, it boils down to "grip" control. I prefer a lightened slide, faster slide cycle... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YVK Posted August 18, 2020 Share Posted August 18, 2020 (edited) I started when slide milling was necessary. Both of mine are in low to mid 11s with SROs on. I still have one non-milled slide, just in case something possessed me to shoot Production again and it weighs 13.8 oz. Based what I see on sights and on timer, if I have to set another slide up, I would definitely have it lightened. Based on mine and reported experiences, I wouldn't put windows through the front serrations, and I would probably not touch the recoil spring tunnel. Edited August 19, 2020 by YVK Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PrimaryBruce Posted August 19, 2020 Share Posted August 19, 2020 (edited) Even our Harbinger V2 isn't "too light". We have a lot of Grand Master shooters running Harbinger V2 slides and placing top 3 at matches every weekend. Many refuse to go back to stock slides even with the weight restriction no longer a factor. With the correct ammo selections and recoil spring, many report they prefer the feel of the lighter slide and have seen faster split times on the shot timer. YMMV. If you're worried, the V1 basically just puts the slide at stock weight with the optic added. Edited August 19, 2020 by PrimaryBruce Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Woodsk Posted August 19, 2020 Share Posted August 19, 2020 I have one of the of the PM V2 slides now, ~5k through it with a 11lb variable spring (pre rule change). I prefer heavier bullets with this slide. I have another one at PM right now for just he optic cut. once I have some rounds through it I'll give some feed back. One think to think about with CO is the durability of the optic you are using. With this variable there the slide weight takes on a different dynamic. Velocity is (and the resultant forces) what kills the current dots on the market (so far the SRO is appears to be the most durable). In addition increased velocity I think will make tracking the dot a bit more work, not sure yet but I'll update when I get the other slide back. BTW - If any one is unsure, the optic cut that primary machine does is absolutely the best non-plate pocket there is. I have optics on 5 guns from them and they are deep and tight. The plate systems out there are flexible for changing optics but plate systems in general have gaps that impart specific forces on the optic at the end of the reward stroke of the slide that induces vibration to the electronics. The milled pocket that PM does (maybe F4F but I do not have one) reduces these forces. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Superkaratemonkeyfighter Posted August 21, 2020 Share Posted August 21, 2020 The most important is that the muzzle or sights return to target as fast as they can. Take the “FEEL out of the equation, Will a lighter slide tuned properly return to zero quicker ? If both a stock and lightened slide are tuned properly NOT identically which will return to zero faster ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WYgunner Posted November 18, 2022 Share Posted November 18, 2022 I am considering getting my slide lightened and I am currently looking at both the PM Harbinger 1 and 2. After all the time that has passed since the original post does anyone have any updates on the V1 vs V2 for recoil impulse and durability? Thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CharlieD Posted November 19, 2022 Share Posted November 19, 2022 V1 is my preference by far. The windows in the V2 creates sharp edges at the serrations that make it uncomfortable to grab. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WYgunner Posted November 19, 2022 Share Posted November 19, 2022 Did you happen to weigh your V1 without an optic? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mSNACKS Posted November 20, 2022 Share Posted November 20, 2022 I have a S2 slide lightened by CGW. Strictly did it to make weight in IDPA CO. I think it handles well, less reciprocating mass usually helps out recoil. As people have said any slide lightened or not can be tuned to feel ideal. I think the biggest factor is if it’s needed to make weight in a certain game definitely go for it. If not the extra possibly unneeded cost could be put towards ammo to practice or a class from a good instructor either of which you’d probably see more return on Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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