929 Light hits, squibs, and bullet creep, oh my :)

[ysrracer]

My smithed 929 gets light hits using factory ammo. I've even cranked in the strain screw.

 

I recently found out Federal 115gr 9mm ammo isn't crimped.

 

Anybody seen this before?

 

Edited July 15, 2020 by ysrracer

[ysrracer]

[ysrracer]

[ysrracer]

[IHAVEGAS]

Using 0.40" moon clips my 929 (about 6# double action) set off factory federal 115 grain ammo ok. 

 

Did not shoot much of it though because the bullets always creeped, same as you experienced. Perhaps I would have seen some light strikes if I would have fired more rounds. 

[SteelShooten]

I have enocuntered problems with FC 9mm brass providing inadequate neck tension so....this is not too surprising.  

I reload oodles of range brass for general purpose 9mm use.   I have found quite a few FC cases that won't hold a 124gr bullet well enough to resist being twisted apart by hand.   A couple simply telescoped with moderate finger pressure applied.    At first I was worried that something had gone awry with my sizing die but narrowed it down to these occasional shells.   The bullets from the disassembled loads were installed in other pieces of brass and did not repeat the failure.

Not all FC brass does this.    There doesn't appear to be a good way to predict (before they get sized) which shells won't work.

 

I don't use FC 9mm brass in my revolver anyway.

 

As to the light strikes, you mentioned that the revolver has been tuned by a smith, what ammunition did the smith set this gun up to shoot?

[MikeyScuba]

Try re-seating the loaded rounds with one of these

https://kmshooting.com/product/primer-deluxe-2/

 

Don't go overboard just a light squeeze will do. 

I've done thousands of *live* rounds (match ones) but I've been told I'm certifiably crazy for doing so.  None ever went bang.

 

We recently shot 3000 rounds of WIN primed reman ammo with a 7lb trigger and heavier rebound spring.  What was interesting is my wife's gun had a issue so she switched to her competition gun -5.5lb trigger/comp. rebound spring.  It fired the WIN primed ammo with only 1 light strike (out of ~800).  Go figure.  The primers were set at a proper depth.

 

[JRB]

good afternoon

 

What MickeyScuba says about the crimping, your loading unit will do it.

next put an extended firing pin in, it worked on mine.

 

J. Russell Bryan

Canadian Shooter of anything that fun.

[pskys2]

I've heard a few reports of some factory 9mm rounds having the pull out problem in a Revolver, the 115 gr comes to mind.

 

As for the light strikes.  You need a minimum of 40 ounces on the hammer fall to be reliable with well seated Federal Primers, other primers will require more (factory is usually over 64 ounces).  This is a factor of the mainspring arch which can be adjusted, within reason, with the strain screw.  But if you have a mainspring that has been arched less to give a lighter hammer fall with the strain screw tightened you have to go with a longer strain screw or change the arch of the mainspring.  A quick fix is to put a spent primer cup minus the anvil of course between the tip of the strain screw and the main spring this adds a few ounces to the hammer fall.

The rebound spring has nothing to do with the hammer fall, just the overall feel of the action.

Further the head space will have an effect on primer ignition.  I had a very light action, 4 lbs, from a name Revolver Smith and it worked for a few thousand rounds then I started getting light strikes due to the changes of use.  I've since upped the action weight on my 627's to 40 ounce hammer fall, 11 lb, -1 to 2 coils, rebound spring, smoothed up action for a solid 5.5 lb pull with good rebound pressure.  I actually like it better than the real light action of 4 lbs.

 

To test your hammer fall weight:

Make sure the Revolver is Empty, cock the hammer, put a Trigger Pull Gauge hook around the hammer, then pull the trigger, hold the trigger back and allow the hammer to reach the mid point of its fall.  That reading where it is balanced is your hammer fall weight.

 

For Federal Primers seated .005 to .010 below flush you need 40 ounces (can vary due to head space or other factors that hinder the solid impact on the cartridge).  If you want to use other primers you may need more weight I've had good luck with most other primers at close to 60 ounces.  My EDC/IDPA Revolver, S&W 325 TR 45 ACP, has a 60 ounce hammer fall, 13 lb rebound and an action weight of 7.5 lbs.  I've not had any issues with lighting off all factory ammo with it.

 

There are also other issues but they are a bit more effort.  I'd check the weights first.

 

Another note it looks like your primers are only flush, make sure you can at least feel an indention of the primer below the rim with your thumb.  I'm having good luck setting it at .009 to .011 with a caliper, but I'm using a 1050 which allows you to set that.  A 550/650/750 has no easy adjustment you just have to fully lever the press handle up to its max.  This usually puts the primer about .005 below flush.

Edited July 16, 2020 by pskys2

[IHAVEGAS]

56 minutes ago, pskys2 said:

A quick fix is to put a spent primer cup minus the anvil of course between the tip of the strain screw and the main spring this adds a few ounces to the hammer fall.

 

Timely. 

Thanks. 

[pyrrhic3gun]

There are these things called cleaning brushes.  Google it.  :^)

Is the pic of the original cylinder or the replacement cylinder that was found to be bad?  Or was that your 627? 

What thickness of moon clips are you using?  Get the .040 if you don't have them.

Check all your moon clips for flatness.  They need to be dead flat when you are trying for a light trigger pull.  Any bend in the moon creates a spring effect that soaks up some of the energy in the firing pin/hammer drop.

Attention to every detail is required.  That's why the Rocket doesn't like revos.  :^)

As far as factory ammo, forget it. Load you own with the Lee undersize die, using Win brass (nickel plated if you can find it), make sure the Federal primers are fully seated (and I mean almost crushed).  

Or you could just sell it and buy a Glock.  :^)  sarcasm warning*

 

 

[IHAVEGAS]

3 hours ago, pyrrhic3gun said:

What thickness of moon clips are you using?  Get the .040 if you don't have them.

 

I'm finding the 0.40 with Win to be a pain in the butt. Too stiff to use with the BMT mooner and if you are using once fired brass extractor marring around the rim prevents some of the brass from being as pristine as required to allow the bullets to be held straight.

 

Other factors may outweigh these nuisance things, particularly for the shooter who is very competitive and happy to go to a little extra trouble, but I think many might want to play a bit before buying enough clips to feel committed. 

[MikeyScuba]

Try nickel plated WIN, that will make the regular WIN look like a good time.   I should sell my 2 BMT’s -they just don’t work well with .040” moons.

[ysrracer]

My issue with the .040 clips is THEY COST TWICE AS MUCH as the .035 clips.

 

I'm thinking if I take a .035 and wrap it in the foil from Wrigley chewing gum, I should be good...

 

...and I get a piece of gum

[ysrracer]

4 hours ago, pyrrhic3gun said:

Attention to every detail is required.  That's why the Rocket doesn't like revos.  :^)

 

The Rocket? That guy's a poser

 

I shot with his grandson Mike Reed, and he seems like a good kid.

Edited July 18, 2020 by ysrracer

[Distant Thunder]

16 hours ago, ysrracer said:

My issue with the .040 clips is THEY COST TWICE AS MUCH as the .035 clips.

 

I'm thinking if I take a .035 and wrap it in the foil from Wrigley chewing gum, I should be good...

 

...and I get a piece of gum

 

Hmmm, but does this lead to issues of sticky extraction? More importantly, will your reloads lose their flavor on the bedpost overnight?

[GMM50]

A longer firing pin might help but that's another can o worms