40cal open

[falconew]

So I want to build a 2011. I shoot a 40 now in limited Para 16-40. The recoil makes my follow up shots slower.  My Para 9mm I can get my follow up shots faster. I want to go up to open next year. I was thinking 40 but don’t know how it compares to the 38 super/super comp. pros cons   Is 40 a good choice?  

[BLUTO]

My 1st open was a 40 for several reasons which all made perfect sense to me at the time.  All the reasons turned out to be BS - go with a 38 or a 9Major and be done with it.

There is no way I know of (there may be) to gas a 40 to actually work the comp without risking blowing the brass.  You loose a couple rounds in the mag compared to 38.  There are other reasons but suffice it to say there is a reason the big boys run 38 or 9 major - accept it, build one and be done with it.  My opinion.

[falconew]

5 minutes ago, BLUTO said:

My 1st open was a 40 for several reasons which all made perfect sense to me at the time.  All the reasons turned out to be BS - go with a 38 or a 9Major and be done with it.

There is no way I know of (there may be) to gas a 40 to actually work the comp without risking blowing the brass.  You loose a couple rounds in the mag compared to 38.  There are other reasons but suffice it to say there is a reason the big boys run 38 or 9 major - accept it, build one and be done with it.  My opinion.

I was thinking in my head a 9mm major but why when you can just load the 38.  I know brass is cheaper for 9 then 38.   

[BLUTO]

If I were to do it again I would go 9mm for the very reason you said - 38 brass is literally gold.  Lost brass matches hurt!  A buddy and I would practice together and declare ahead how many rounds we were going to use and then stand over each other while we counted out the empties.  Ive shot some till they cracked where with 9 I would have tossed them and been done with them.  The term brass chicken comes from us 38 shooters hunting for our brass rather than cleaning or resetting - it gets old real fast.

 

[falconew]

I have not shot any 9 major. Will ask a few guys I know that do.  

[AverageJoeShooting]

Everything Bluto says is correct. I like 38sc because its a longer case which gives you more powder options. I guess it would depend on what your financial status is. I just ponied up and bought about 15k 38sc brass all at once. 

 

You will make power factor easier in 38sc also.

[Explosiveo]

Put that extra money you would have spent on 38sc brass into a really nice custom gun. Like a Rafferty. That will run just as well as a 38sc gun. In 9 major and then you can just focus on shooting and having fun. Worrying about picking up brass on every stage ruins the experience.
With 9 you can still pick up all your brass at practice and if you feel like it and have time at matches. But your not forced to do it.
You don't have to mark your brass for ease of picking up. I don't get why anyone still shoots 38sc. Nobody in my local area does. But there are other areas close by that everyone does. I think it's just because when new people get into open, they do what everyone else around them is doing.

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[falconew]

Well just was shooting my friends 9mm major. It’s an older Sti. Nice gun. Came home and talked with the wife.  Was shocked actually.   I was planning on selling a few rifles that I don’t shoot anyways to help fund it.  That would free up about 2400$.  And I said I was going to build it up slowly.  She was like. Spent up to 3500$.  With that said. I have not looked at new prices on turn key guns.  I know that can go way up. I told her I may need to go higher.  So in and around the 4000$ range what’s out there.  New or a good used one?  

[Balakay]

2 hours ago, AverageJoeShooting said:

Everything Bluto says is correct. I like 38sc because its a longer case which gives you more powder options. I guess it would depend on what your financial status is. I just ponied up and bought about 15k 38sc brass all at once. 

 

You will make power factor easier in 38sc also.

Unless you really want to shoot N105 or 3n38 what  powders are you really missing out on with 9 major?  I shoot AA7 or SWMP in both calibers.   It really just breaks down to cost and your inclination (or lack thereof) to pick up brass.  After having one of my guns rebarreled in 9, I can't honestly tell the difference between 38 and 9 at match speed..

[falconew]

I know cost comes into play. At a match I don’t want to be there picking up brass and not enjoying the company of the people at matches. Watching and learning as well.  If I have to switch powder so be it. Cheaper then the brass. If I can load a little longer and get the same out of 9 major as 38 might as well go 9

[ChuckS]

3 hours ago, falconew said:

So I want to build a 2011. I shoot a 40 now in limited Para 16-40. The recoil makes my follow up shots slower.  My Para 9mm I can get my follow up shots faster. I want to go up to open next year. I was thinking 40 but don’t know how it compares to the 38 super/super comp. pros cons   Is 40 a good choice?  

You may want to visit this near 600 post thread on the subject:

 

[RJH]

31 minutes ago, falconew said:

I know cost comes into play. At a match I don’t want to be there picking up brass and not enjoying the company of the people at matches. Watching and learning as well.  If I have to switch powder so be it. Cheaper then the brass. If I can load a little longer and get the same out of 9 major as 38 might as well go 9

 

You might look at something like the CK arms solution.   At $2750 it is about as budget a  new open gun you can get.  Leaves you money for mags within your budget.  I don't own one and have not shot one, but i think they get good reviews.  Could be worth researching

[ima45dv8]

1 hour ago, falconew said:

...what’s out there.  New or a good used one?

Before we start having a bunch of offers of used guns show up here in this thread, which would then have to be deleted, you might want to check out the Classifieds. Used open blasters abound.

[Explosiveo]

It's hard to believe but in the long run it will cost less and be much more enjoyable to spend a little more and buy a new gun from a reputable builder that stands behind their work and has some type of warranty.
This is coming from someone who bought a couple used guns starting out and now owns a custom built gun. If I had it to do over.vi would save up and spend the 5500-6k on my current gun right off the bat. Would have saved me so much money, time and frustration.


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[falconew]

23 minutes ago, ima45dv8 said:

Before we start having a bunch of offers of used guns show up here in this thread, which would then have to be deleted, you might want to check out the Classifieds. Used open blasters abound.

 

already been looking at them and Ken’s list. But not going to buy a gun sight unseen across the country. Just getting opinions on new vs used? How much is too high of a round count? 
 

and I don’t want this to turn into a here buy this on this thread.  

[falconew]

9 minutes ago, Explosiveo said:

. If I had it to do over.vi would save up and spend the 5500-6k on my current gun right off the bat. Would have saved me so much money, time and frustration.

 

 

i was on Extreme guns and ammo sight.  A new STI DVC O9mm with 3 mags is 4000$.   Call for availability 

 

atlas for 6500$


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[Joe4d]

Well to answer your question. Generally 40 isnt a great choice.  But mainly that is due to bullet expense and capacity. Hard to find lighter 40 bullets at a good price.
Would like to point out. In the OP you mentioned the justification of the switch because you can shoot 9mm faster.
However EVERYONE shoots 9mm faster, and folks in Open shoot  really faster.

Shoot open if you want because you just want to. But getting into open while also trying to save a buck is kinda a losing battle. Open is an expensive game.
There is always a better 40 limited gun,,, although I suspect not much in that Para is holding you back. Also could get some training to make you a better limited shooter. Also dont for get about Carry Optics. Several competitive off the shelf Carry optic guns you can buy tommorrow for 1/4th what an open gun will run you and plain ole 9mm ammo.

Not trying to dissuade you , just bringing up some points that stood out to me on you OP.

[falconew]

20 minutes ago, Joe4d said:

Well to answer your question. 

Not trying to dissuade you , just bringing up some points that stood out to me on you OP.

I like shooting limited and I will for a while. But the same time I want to get an open gun and practice A lot with that before I shoot a match. I have always been a 40 guy, just picked that caliber so 9 is newer to me.  I don’t mind switching calibers. My personal goal is to become a much better shooter.  I know shooting open is more expensive especially with 38 just for brass. That’s why thinking 9major. And I am the type that says buy once cry once.   I started getting training from a gm class shooter. He has helped a lot.  And will keep learning.  

[konkapot]

Like said above; there is an EPIC thread on 40 Open, Good discussion and great reference info. 

[falconew]

Started reading it earlier then had to go out.  Hopefully slow at work tomorrow 

[AverageJoeShooting]

7 hours ago, Balakay said:

Unless you really want to shoot N105 or 3n38 what  powders are you really missing out on with 9 major?  I shoot AA7 or SWMP in both calibers.   It really just breaks down to cost and your inclination (or lack thereof) to pick up brass.  After having one of my guns rebarreled in 9, I can't honestly tell the difference between 38 and 9 at match speed..

I have no idea. All I shoot is AA7. I hear lots of people complain about the VV powders and 9 major. VV is pretty popular in open major. But i don't shoot 9 major, so no real ideas on it 

[Silverscooby27]

4K? I’d buy 2 shadow 2s with optics and get back to actually shooting.

[36873687]

12 hours ago, Explosiveo said:

Put that extra money you would have spent on 38sc brass into a really nice custom gun. Like a Rafferty. That will run just as well as a 38sc gun. In 9 major and then you can just focus on shooting and having fun. Worrying about picking up brass on every stage ruins the experience.
With 9 you can still pick up all your brass at practice and if you feel like it and have time at matches. But your not forced to do it.
You don't have to mark your brass for ease of picking up. I don't get why anyone still shoots 38sc. Nobody in my local area does. But there are other areas close by that everyone does. I think it's just because when new people get into open, they do what everyone else around them is doing.

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Couldn’t said it any better

[Boomstick303]

I will start by saying I have never ran open and very little experience with open blasters.  I do have a couple of questions for if I ever entertain running any open gun. 

 

Is it just me or is 9mm major way harder on guns than 38sc is?  If it is, is that something that should be taken into account of cost to run the gun?   Doesn’t 38 SC allow you to run coated bullets which are cheaper and possibly allow longer life in the barrel, where you cannot run coated bullets in a 9mm major gun?  Shouldn’t these things be taken into consideration as well?

 

 

Edited July 13, 2020 by Boomstick303

[Explosiveo]

"Doesn’t 38 SC allow you to run coated bullets"

No, 38sc has nothing to do with being able to run coated bullets. People don't run coated bullets in open because of two things.

1. The bullets are pushed at a high velocity and coated bullets will sometimes break apart at those speeds.

2. Coated bullets tend to lead up the compensator which can be a nightmare to clean and can also be dangerous if not cleaned for extended periods of time.

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