Start position question....chair start

[BigBamBoo]

Ok, say a stage has a chair start. And the stage briefing says: “Sitting on chair, loaded gun on table, muzzle pointed down range with trigger guard centered over "X".

Now to me....I am taking that as one can literally “sit on” the chair....not in the chair.

 

What say the crowd? 

[aandabooks]

Game on.  See how it works out for you.

[45 Raven]

Really?  What is to be gained except annoying the match director?  Sit in (on) the chair like you are supposed to sit in (on) the chair.

 

I'm certain many will disagree with me. 

[BigBamBoo]

Most WSB I see say something like, “seated in chair, back touching back of chair, etc.”.

 

I am not trying to cause trouble, the wording above is from the WSB. 
 

Just wondering how many are going to sit ON the chair back and jump to the starting position.

 

The wording really is pretty vague IMO.

[Sarge]

20 minutes ago, 45 Raven said:

Really?  What is to be gained except annoying the match director?  Sit in (on) the chair like you are supposed to sit in (on) the chair.

 

I'm certain many will disagree with me. 

I strongly disagree with you. WSB needs to be specific. Sitting on chair could mean several different things. If you want to control it say something like sitting in chair with both feet on ground in front of chair, hands on knees. You can add back against back of chair for additional stringency.

[Sarge]

4 minutes ago, BigBamBoo said:

Most WSB I see say something like, “seated in chair, back touching back of chair, etc.”.

 

I am not trying to cause trouble, the wording above is from the WSB. 
 

Just wondering how many are going to sit ON the chair back and jump to the starting position.

 

The wording really is pretty vague IMO.

I think I’ve seen it once. Nothing was really gained if I recall

[stick]

9 hours ago, Sarge said:

I strongly disagree with you. WSB needs to be specific. Sitting on chair could mean several different things. If you want to control it say something like sitting in chair with both feet on ground in front of chair, hands on knees. You can add back against back of chair for additional stringency.

I agree with Sarge! 

WSB needs to be specific.  Besides, how much time are you going to gain by sitting on the chair as opposed to sitting in the chair?

[bcane98]

The one constant complaint I get are stage briefs from shooters who appear to want the stages to fit their needs or wants ... "sitting on a chair" ...  At a recent match a fairly tall shooters sat on the back of the chair, one foot on the ground, one foot on the seat, and about DQ'd himself when the he and the chair destabilized.  Another shooters, in a not so nice tone, told me I needed to learn how to write a proper stage brief.  I blew the guy off for multiple reason other than his attitude, but simply put if I have to write specifics on how to safely sit in a chair, then you probably shouldn't be handing any firearms to include the toy one.  FLIP SIDE: I get it... gaming the system based on lack of instruction (or direction) is how people get that slight edge For The Win.

[Ming the Merciless]

5 hours ago, stick said:

I agree with Sarge! 

WSB needs to be specific.  Besides, how much time are you going to gain by sitting on the chair as opposed to sitting in the chair?

 

Quite a bit, if the chair is the standard metal folding chair,  you're tall and have bad knees.

[stick]

2 hours ago, Ming the Merciless said:

 

Quite a bit, if the chair is the standard metal folding chair,  you're tall and have bad knees.

I'm 6'5" tall.

[SGT_Schultz]

On 7/4/2020 at 9:11 PM, Sarge said:

 Nothing was really gained if I recall

 

99% of the time these gimmicky attempts at gaming produce nothing

[rowdyb]

9 hours ago, SGT_Schultz said:

 

99% of the time these gimmicky attempts at gaming produce nothing

Yep.

If you were told to sit on a chair how man people would spin the chair around and then sit on the top of the back? hahahaha. Everyone becomes an L2 when it comes to stage briefs

[Nathanb]

9 hours ago, SGT_Schultz said:

 

99% of the time these gimmicky attempts at gaming produce nothing

I do love when they crash and burn though!

[ChuckS]

On 7/5/2020 at 5:12 AM, bcane98 said:

The one constant complaint I get are stage briefs from shooters who appear to want the stages to fit their needs or wants ... "sitting on a chair" ...  At a recent match a fairly tall shooters sat on the back of the chair, one foot on the ground, one foot on the seat, and about DQ'd himself when the he and the chair destabilized.  Another shooters, in a not so nice tone, told me I needed to learn how to write a proper stage brief.  I blew the guy off for multiple reason other than his attitude, but simply put if I have to write specifics on how to safely sit in a chair, then you probably shouldn't be handing any firearms to include the toy one.  FLIP SIDE: I get it... gaming the system based on lack of instruction (or direction) is how people get that slight edge For The Win.

Embrace freestyle! "Seated on chair" is a perfectly valid start position. Some folks will try some high risk stuff. If it works, all the people who shot before them will be pissed that they didn't think of that and some may want to blame the stage designer. The shooters following the stunt, may try it also. It may not work for them . I ran a stage at a level 3 match that used that start position along with unloaded firearm on table. There were more than 400 shooters at that match. I saw some real goofy s#!t. People were doing all kinds of sorta-sitting positions with hand hovering over the hardware. All sort of interesting things happened but in retrospect, the guys who did what they have practiced and used 100's of times got the best start on the stage. Like this JJ guy.

[RJH]

Yep, doing what you practice is best. That said, my limited gun will stand up when loaded. So if the table's good on loaded table start, I will sometimes stand the gun up instead of have it laying on its side. Doing this causes much butthurt. I mainly do it just to aggravate people, their reaction is worth more than any points or time I might pick up on the stage by having my gun stood up on the table

[BARRYJ]

If you turn the chair around, you are not sitting on it, you are leaning against it.  Sitting means your body is supported.

[rishii]

Our WSB often states seated and fully covering mark on chair, and we put a mark on the seat, sometimes it’s a dot, other it’s a T

 

[TonytheTiger]

1 hour ago, RJH said:

 That said, my limited gun will stand up when loaded. So if the table's good on loaded table start, I will sometimes stand the gun up instead of have it laying on its side. Doing this causes much butthurt. I mainly do it just to aggravate people, their reaction is worth more than any points or time I might pick up on the stage by having my gun stood up on the table

Same here. No measurable advantage gained but its fun to wind up the peanut gallery.

[ChuckS]

Stake the chair to the ground. (Just good practice to keep the start position from moving during the match!)

[IHAVEGAS]

24 minutes ago, TonytheTiger said:

Same here. No measurable advantage gained but its fun to wind up the peanut gallery.

 

It is until there is an argument, and somebody gets stubborn and slows the match down, and the shooter gets his head on crooked thinking about the argument instead of the stage plan. 

[TonytheTiger]

1 hour ago, IHAVEGAS said:

 

It is until there is an argument, and somebody gets stubborn and slows the match down, and the shooter gets his head on crooked thinking about the argument instead of the stage plan. 

Nah, I only shoot 3 gun, where range lawyers are ostracized till they get the hint or return to USPSA..

 

[IHAVEGAS]

52 minutes ago, TonytheTiger said:

Nah, I only shoot 3 gun, where range lawyers are ostracized till they get the hint or return to USPSA..

 

 

I'm getting ready to try three gun. For training I have my relatives wander around pointing guns at each other for no particular reason. 

 

[TonytheTiger]

2 hours ago, IHAVEGAS said:

 

I'm getting ready to try three gun. For training I have my relatives wander around pointing guns at each other for no particular reason. 

 

Haha, touche!

[Ming the Merciless]

4 hours ago, IHAVEGAS said:

 

I'm getting ready to try three gun. For training I have my relatives wander around pointing guns at each other for no particular reason. 

 

 

LOL!  That's a normal day at my house!  

[SGT_Schultz]

5 hours ago, IHAVEGAS said:

 

I'm getting ready to try three gun. For training I have my relatives wander around pointing guns at each other for no particular reason.