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What is the secret to IDPA shooting?


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On 9/4/2020 at 7:57 PM, rowdyb said:

shooting uspsa is actually that skill. then it is up to you to be disciplined enough when you switch about deciding when to pull the trigger.

 

as someone who shoots both there are definitely very great specialists who only shoot idpa versus the guys who pop in and out from uspsa. but if you're a regular person and you just want to get faster i'd say shoot 12 uspsa matches in a row and then come back to idpa.

 

too many SS and EX shooters I see in idpa just really don't know what fast running, fast gun handling and fast transitions are. shoot uspsa and you will.

 

there is a reason most M idpa shooters come in at B in uspsa. i did it when i switched. and the reason is that most idpa shooters are not fast in comparison. coupled with the misguided sentiment that it is speed or accuracy when it really is speed AND accuracy.

 

btw I am M in ssp, esp, pcc, ccp and cdp and have been a DC like 6 times and won at EX once at nats. so i know idpa. i'm a M in uspsa in Prod and Lim10. and a pcc M in steel challenge. so that's where i'm coming from.

 

 

Sounds like the good old days of IPSC back in the 70s and early 80s. I loved it. Speed, skill and accuracy were critical. 

Edited by Bobkoh
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On 9/4/2020 at 9:08 PM, Tango said:

I should say, I sense a feeling of superiority here among USPSA shooters, which is not warranted at the top level. I know production GM's in USPSA who can not beat IDPA M's in IDPA. These are different games, and top level shooters exist in both games. 

 

Name one person at the top of the IDPA game that is not primarily a USPSA shooter. 

Edited by waktasz
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11 hours ago, waktasz said:

 

Name one person at the top of the IDPA game that is not primarily a USPSA shooter. 

 

The local IDPA DM I shoot with (won his division at the IDPA nationals - year before last I think, had to beat Rob Leatham to do it) does not shoot USPSA and the CO guy I shoot with that is winning overalls at IDPA level 2's and 3's has maybe shot 3 - 6 USPSA matches for practice. I think there are likely other folks out there that focus on just the one sport, makes a lot of sense if you want to win and have the talent but only want to devote a limited amount of time and money. 

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The local IDPA DM I shoot with (won his division at the IDPA nationals - year before last I think, had to beat Rob Leatham to do it) does not shoot USPSA and the CO guy I shoot with that is winning overalls at IDPA level 2's and 3's has maybe shot 3 - 6 USPSA matches for practice. I think there are likely other folks out there that focus on just the one sport, makes a lot of sense if you want to win and have the talent but only want to devote a limited amount of time and money. 

Farrar and Eadens?

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

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Mike has been a USPSA member since 95 and still active. He was just second at Single Stack nats. He shoots a fair amount of IDPA but I think he'd consider USPSA his primary game

 

Edited by waktasz
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On 9/4/2020 at 9:36 PM, Tango said:

I found this. Everything is different in this style of shooting compared to the typical USPSA stage: positions, movement, cadence...lots of move, hard stop, shoot, move again, awkward positions, hard exits etc. vs USPSA you can move fluidly all the time. I think this is the main difference: having to shoot behind barriers (and slicing the pie) make the movement very choppy vs. smooth movement of USPSA. 

 

 

 

 

That stage looks very USPSA-ish

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Log into your idpa account. Search Members, select DM and USA as your filters and then look at those names, there aren't very many (just 30) of them. To my judgement half of them are very much "uspsa guys". Glen , Gregg Martin and Dave Orr are people I know in person and neither are what I'd call uspsa guys. None the less, half of the DM's are people who drop in from uspsa and win and then leave. Log in to your account and look at things nationally, rather than who is winning your state or local matches.

 

And if you take into account who has won multiple times at idpa nats then the percentage of uspsa guys would rise even higher.

 

I think there is a big divide between people who started in the fault line era of idpa and the people who started when cover was an actual thing. Running to the stick has made it much easier for people to excel at idpa on the competitive level. When cover was an invisible line and your breaking it could cost you 3 seconds onto your score how you moved through the stage was vastly different than now.

 

As someone who does both, has shot both Nats numerous times and is reasonably good at both I still stand by my original advice entirely.

 

Edited by rowdyb
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On 6/21/2020 at 9:38 AM, IHAVEGAS said:

Shooting around cover is the one thing where I see good IDPA shooters beating good USPSA shooters. 

 

I find that hard to believe.  At least 60% of the stages at every local USPSA match I go to have leans and some have pretty severe leans.

 

You may have been right back in the bad old days of no fault lines in IDPA, and I doubt it even then.

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8 hours ago, SGT_Schultz said:

 

I find that hard to believe.  At least 60% of the stages at every local USPSA match I go to have leans and some have pretty severe leans.

 

You may have been right back in the bad old days of no fault lines in IDPA, and I doubt it even then.

 

I was not intending to comment on how things are done wherever it is that you shoot, and if you do not believe I am capable of simple observation, ok.

 

 

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On 9/4/2020 at 2:22 PM, SGT_Schultz said:

 

Why do IDPA SOs invariable ask "which way are you going" when there's a choice of direction at the start?

 

What does it matter which way the shooter goes?  The SO is supposed to keep clear of the shooter no matter what.

 

As a USPSA RO, I never ask.  I always plan to move clear of the shooter in a way that will leave him complete freedom.  It's not like we need to have the timer right by them.......

For the same reason as you, to stay out of their way.

 

1. IDPA has a higher emphasis on new shooters and we are more worried about being swept.

 

2. USPSA is run and gun. IDPA is waddle and shoot. We're slow!

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I despise the "what way are you going" questions. It means nothing. What if I go a different way? As the SO you need to get out of the way. Be prepared to move any direction necessary. Any good SO knows the stage and can see what way a shooter may move. In IDPA its not like a shooter has many choices anyway. USPSA you are most often standing out of bounds behind the shooter with the rest of the stage in front of you. IF its a regressing stage then you know to run at the beep.

 

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12 hours ago, SGT_Schultz said:

 

I find that hard to believe.  At least 60% of the stages at every local USPSA match I go to have leans and some have pretty severe leans.

 

You may have been right back in the bad old days of no fault lines in IDPA, and I doubt it even then.

This. USPSA stages routinely have stages with difficult and some very difficult leans built into the stages. It's not for "cover". And IDPA  has fault lines now too.  Sometimes you've had to grab onto something to lean enough or shoot one handed. Many times there are targets centered behind a wall and you'll have to figure out which side is a little less difficult for you.

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1 hour ago, Diver123 said:

I despise the "what way are you going" questions. It means nothing. What if I go a different way? As the SO you need to get out of the way. Be prepared to move any direction necessary. Any good SO knows the stage and can see what way a shooter may move. In IDPA its not like a shooter has many choices anyway. USPSA you are most often standing out of bounds behind the shooter with the rest of the stage in front of you. IF its a regressing stage then you know to run at the beep.

 

 

"I'll decide when the beep goes off" seems to confuse them and shut them up

 

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This is another fight I don't have a dog in, but if the person with the timer (who is often working for free) thinks he/she can do a better job if I tell him my stage plan then I am fine with it.

Personally I do not ask, for reasons already noted. 

 

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1 hour ago, waktasz said:

 

"I'll decide when the beep goes off" seems to confuse them and shut them up

 

 

Perfect I'll have to remember that.

 

Other IDPA SO incompetence that annoys the hell out of me:

  • "Give me a nod when you're ready"
  • "Shooter indicates ready"

And all the other useless, non-rulebook verbiage that random SOs invent.

 

I just stand still and if the SO insists on asking if I'm ready I'll remind him that he should know what to do if I don't reply.

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4 hours ago, Zincwarrior said:

1. IDPA has a higher emphasis on new shooters

 

I disagree.  The emphasis on new shooters is just as great in USPSA.

 

 

4 hours ago, Zincwarrior said:

we are more worried about being swept.

 

Then standing behind instead of to the side will serve you better than asking.  I don't want a loaded pistol pointed at me any more than you do.

 

Edited by SGT_Schultz
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OK, let's ask the question in somewhat of an inverse ways.

  • Will shooting uspsa make a worse competitor in idpa? If so it is your fault, not the intrinsic nature of one vs the other.
  • Will earnest and directed action towards improvement ever hurt me? Nope.
  • Are the two different enough that I can't learn lessons from one to take to the other? Nope.
  • Does anyone who is primarily a uspsa shooter shoot idpa to improve an aspect of their game? Rarely.

We can skip the idpa SO bashing, I hear just as many bad and silly range commands at all matches.

Edited by rowdyb
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30 minutes ago, rowdyb said:

We can skip the idpa SO bashing, I hear just as many bad and silly range commands at all matches.

 

My favorite so far is "heat it up Bubba" at a level 2 USPSA.

 

Curious, has anyone ever seen any sort of a problem created by an incorrect range command? 

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16 hours ago, IHAVEGAS said:

 

My favorite so far is "heat it up Bubba" at a level 2 USPSA.

 

Curious, has anyone ever seen any sort of a problem created by an incorrect range command? 

If I had an RO tell me to "heat it up" I'd know I'm in for a fun day day of shooting. My kind of guy. :)

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