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CO 23+1 mag lock-back when empty?


ck1
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Tried to search for an answer, couldn't find it...

 

I'm running the CZ/Mec-Gar Nickel mags (SKU: 11155) + TTI extension base pads (TTI-CZ-FP) + Grams spring & follower kit (FKCMG-11)... gives me 23+1rds and seems to be running great.

Question is: the mags no longer lock back when empty (gun doesn't go to slide-lock when dry), is this normal..?

 

I don't really need the gun to lock back when dry, but just wondering if it's supposed to, and if everything is running correctly?

 

Thanks.

 

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Just now, haiedras said:

That's normal, you really don't want those to slide lock anyway.

 

OK cool. It was my first time out today with the Grams' kits and was wondering if not-locking-back on empty was normal... Thanks.

 

FYI/FWIW for anyone who stumbles upon this thread: the nickel mags + TTI extensions would load to 21+1 with the stock springs and followers as advertised, but it wasn't 100% reliable in my S2 (maybe 80%, not match-worthy IMO), that recipe caused malfunctions for me and my guess is the stock mag guts weren't truly up to the task of pushing up all those rounds (even with brand spanking new mags/guts).

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17 hours ago, haiedras said:

That's normal, you really don't want those to slide lock anyway.

 

8 hours ago, jeremy kemlo said:

My grams followers lock my slide back and I can put 23+ one in. Your best bet is to call the manufacture they will gladly help you. 

 

So..... great, two responses, two different and opposite answers...? 🙄 🤪

 

I guess I can try giving Grams a call... but pretty sure like most manufacturers, they're just going to tell me it's fine either way as long as the gun is feeding/working... 

 

Hopefully more guys will chime in with their experiences with this setup... because what is "normal" hasn't been established yet hahaha...

 

I know lock-back on empty isn't needed for USPSA, I get it, if we run dry we already messed up, that's not my question. I'm just trying to find out if it should be locking back when empty?

Of course I don't plan on running my gun dry before I reload if I can help it... but if it's supposed to lock-back when dry, then I do want it to, because at least that'll cost me less time to deal with than a dead trigger when dry IMHO.

Edited by ck1
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The only way you are going to get the correct answer for  your gun is to contact Grams directly.  It is the only way to be sure.  The confusion in the answers is that it probably varies.  I own an 9mm XDM where the slide does not lock back after firing the last round.  All of the magazines I have the grams Spring and Follower installed in for my Sig X5 Legion the slide locks back after the last round has been fired.  I am assuming the reason you have the Grams spring and follower installed is for competition use.  If you are not already aware , the reason for the comment for "you really don't want the slide to lock back", is because if you have reached slide lock in competition you have either not planned the stage correctly, or the stage has gone horribly sideways.  I honestly don't care either way in regards to reaching or not reaching slide lock.  for the reason I just stated, I rarely empty a magazine during a course of fire.  Many people remove the ability for the magazine to reach slide lock to avoid other issues during competition.  There are a couple of videos on YouTube on how to accomplish that.  

 

The reason for Grams design is for max round count.  Not reliable slide lock.  If you want the gun to reliably slide lock after all rounds have been fired you should not alter the original magazines.  Anytime you alter a magazine you are essentially make the mag less reliable.  Just my personal experience and humble opinion.

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12 hours ago, jeremy kemlo said:

My grams followers lock my slide back and I can put 23+ one in. Your best bet is to call the manufacture they will gladly help you. 

Mine do the same, I never worry about it. If I lock my slide back during a stage it means I screwed up big time.

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What the folllwer will do will vary with different magazines and gun/slide stop setups.  With my open gun I had to dremel the follower down as it would frequently lock the slide back with one round left sitting on the follower.  In my limited gun it would not lock the slide back but feed every round flawlessly.

 

As far as what it "should" do you will have to ask Beven.  He is a very nice guy who will be happy to answer your questions. 

 

What you want it to do is a matter of preference.  Personally, I would love to have it lock the slide back to prevent the dreaded click instead of bang on the final target of a stage (happened to me twice last season).  However, I would rather error on the side of not locking back to make sure the last round feeds.  

 

Factory followers seem to be able to accomplish both tasks reliably.  Im guessing its trickier to do with thin higher capacity followers???

 

Edited by Will Abrahams
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3 hours ago, Will Abrahams said:

What the folllwer will do will vary with different magazines and gun/slide stop setups.  With my open gun I had to dremel the follower down as it would frequently lock the slide back with one round left sitting on the follower.  In my limited gun it would not lock the slide back but feed every round flawlessly.

 

As far as what it "should" do you will have to ask Beven.  He is a very nice guy who will be happy to answer your questions. 

 

What you want it to do is a matter of preference.  Personly, I would love to have it lock the slide back to prevent the dreaded click instead of bang on the final target of a stage (happened to me twice last season).  However, I would rather error on the side of not locking back to make sure every round feeds.  

 

Factory followers seem to be able to accomplish both tasks reliably.  Im guessing its a tricker to do with thin higher capacity followers???

 

 

Thanks. I put an email into Grams, but haven't heard anything yet... As for locking back vs feeding, yeah, I'd rather it feeds good than lock back when empty too if I have to choose. 

 

And I think we all wish we always remembered to reload when we were supposed to or stuck with our stage plan every time lol... but things don't always go to plan lol.

That's why on the other side of the coin it would be nice if they could feed reliably AND lock-back on empty, because; cussing and grabbing a fresh mag is faster than: cussing, checking/clearing an imaginary malfunction because you’re actually empty, then cussing some more while reaching for a fresh mag hahaha 😂 .......

 

3 hours ago, Will Abrahams said:

Also, what did you do to get the TTI basepads to fit the Nickel mags?  

 

IDK, I've got 6, and IIRC 2 were a tighter fit than the others, but they all went on without too much fuss for me...

Edited by ck1
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Just to be clear, when I said "feeds reliably" I meant feeds the last round reliably : )

 

I could not get the +4 TTI basepads to fit the nickel mags.  They would slide on but I couldn't push up the retention pin as it would hit the mag body.  The Henning seemed to fit well.

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