gondo Posted April 14, 2020 Share Posted April 14, 2020 Been a few years since ive shot 3 gun matches and i sold my vortex razor 1-6 when i got out of the game... I dont know what to get no that im getting back into it... razor 1-10? khales? swaro? whats the best one out and why? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EaZeNuTZ33 Posted April 14, 2020 Share Posted April 14, 2020 I’ve been running the Razor 1-10x FFP for a few months now and if I was only allowed ONE scope for everything, it would be it. All of my Razor 1-6’s are seeing very little range time lately, and another Razor 1-10x will be my next scope too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
inertia Posted April 15, 2020 Share Posted April 15, 2020 I have most of the top tier scopes and feel strongly that above 6x i want ffp. Being forced to run max mag to use my holds has burned me 1 too many times. I have the atacr and the razor III is on the way. Based on my experience with the 30% more expensive Nightforce I expect the Vortex to be the current go to. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaredr Posted April 16, 2020 Share Posted April 16, 2020 can anyone running FFP razor HD's share your opinion of red dot brightness on 1x? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EaZeNuTZ33 Posted April 16, 2020 Share Posted April 16, 2020 2 hours ago, jaredr said: can anyone running FFP razor HD's share your opinion of red dot brightness on 1x? It’s like a red dot with a massive window. illumination indoors when dry firing is usually set to 3/11 illumination with overcast outside is usually 6/11 illumination on a bright day is usually 8/11 11/11 is bright enough that if I’m using it, I probably need to change my battery Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaredr Posted April 16, 2020 Share Posted April 16, 2020 bummer and thanks for the reply. I was hoping you'd say something like "not bright enough to replace an aimpoint T1 / trijocon MRO so save your $$$ and don't be tempted..." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EaZeNuTZ33 Posted April 17, 2020 Share Posted April 17, 2020 2 hours ago, jaredr said: bummer and thanks for the reply. I was hoping you'd say something like "not bright enough to replace an aimpoint T1 / trijocon MRO so save your $$$ and don't be tempted..." my wife always say i say JUST the wrong things at JUST the wrong times! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TonytheTiger Posted April 17, 2020 Share Posted April 17, 2020 I've looked through most of the high end optics except the Gen 3 Razor. I think the Gen 2 still beats most of the newer high end LPVO's, NX8, Atacr, anything Trijicon makes etc. The Kahles and Swaro might have slightly better glass but the Razor is right there for less money. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pjb45 Posted April 17, 2020 Share Posted April 17, 2020 In my very limited experience; in the SW we have targets out to 500 yards and a lot at 350-430. My tired eyes like a 8-10x. FFP would be my next scope, otherwise the dope at 5x is all different and I am not that bright to figure it out. The FOV and eye box are critical success factors - take heed. In 3g you are not shooting stable benches. I had a great IOR but now use Swarovski. Glass quality rules. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaredr Posted April 17, 2020 Share Posted April 17, 2020 2 minutes ago, pjb45 said: Glass quality rules. truth. there is a part of me that keeps thinking a primary arms would be "almost as good". And then i think of all the cr@ppy simmons .22 scopes i simply threw out when i finally got tired of bad glass... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrd Posted April 17, 2020 Share Posted April 17, 2020 In my book it's between Swaro 1-8x BRT and Vortex 1-10x. Swaro is SFP, has better FOV and lower weight. Vortex is very robust, is FFP and has higher magnification (at least on paper). Has anyone compared the true max magnification between the Swaro 1-8x and the Vortex 1-10x ? In my experience one manufacturers 10x can somehow magnify less than another manufacturers 8x. Stated magnification is not always true magnification. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ming the Merciless Posted April 17, 2020 Share Posted April 17, 2020 17 hours ago, TonytheTiger said: I've looked through most of the high end optics except the Gen 3 Razor. I think the Gen 2 still beats most of the newer high end LPVO's, NX8, Atacr, anything Trijicon makes etc. The Kahles and Swaro might have slightly better glass but the Razor is right there for less money. And the Vortex is built like a tank! It WILL take a lickin' and keep on tickin'! Plus it will build up your forearm strength from turning the zoom lever. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EaZeNuTZ33 Posted April 17, 2020 Share Posted April 17, 2020 4 hours ago, Ming the Merciless said: And the Vortex is built like a tank! It WILL take a lickin' and keep on tickin'! Plus it will build up your forearm strength from turning the zoom lever. Not anymore. Razor Gen3 1-10x weighs almost exactly what the 1-6E weighs, and the magnification ring is smoother and lighter when turning it with the included switchview lever. My comparison of my Razor 1-10 with my six Razor 1-6’s....... the 1-10 might be a hair cleaner glass. As far as FFP: In match use and practice, I find myself dialing what looks best for the targets before the stage, or up to what looks the best when dialing up during a stage. I’ve yet to hit 10x in a match, but have been at 4x, 5x, 6x, 7x, 8x and a little over 8x....I’m sure I’ll use 10x more when we get to shoot in Texas again! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CharlieD Posted April 18, 2020 Share Posted April 18, 2020 My vote is for the Kahles 1-8. The glass and FOV is better than any other LPVO (equal to Swaro for obvious reasons). The illumination is brighter than the 1-6 was, also reticle is darker and more defined from the 1-6. The scope is expensive, but it is truly amazing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pjb45 Posted April 18, 2020 Share Posted April 18, 2020 I have a PA 1-6x. Loaned it out to a friend. She rocks long distance with it. Smokes my ass all the time. The price was a bargain. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frankly Posted April 18, 2020 Share Posted April 18, 2020 $600 Vortex Viper II or Steiner $1200 Vortex 1-6 Razor or close competitor for less $1800 Vortex 1-10 Razor $3000 Kahles Isn't it that simple? Decide how much money you can budget and get the best value at each price point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pig4bill Posted April 19, 2020 Share Posted April 19, 2020 On 4/16/2020 at 6:25 PM, jaredr said: truth. there is a part of me that keeps thinking a primary arms would be "almost as good". And then i think of all the cr@ppy simmons .22 scopes i simply threw out when i finally got tired of bad glass... Primary Arms has the Platinum Series ($1300) with Japanese glass, and available with ACSS reticle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
falconpilot Posted April 19, 2020 Share Posted April 19, 2020 If you want the very best, buy a Nightforce.. https://www.nightforceoptics.com/riflescopes/atacr/atacr-1-8x24-f1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
inertia Posted April 20, 2020 Share Posted April 20, 2020 10 hours ago, falconpilot said: If you want the very best, buy a Nightforce.. https://www.nightforceoptics.com/riflescopes/atacr/atacr-1-8x24-f1 I own this, and razors, and kahles, and swaros, its not necessarily the best for 3gun, picky eyebox for how much it costs. I prefer to recommend scopes based on experience. The atacr is a beautiful piece of equipment but i shoot faster with a more forgiving scope, even with less magnification. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
avastcosmicarena Posted April 21, 2020 Share Posted April 21, 2020 21 hours ago, inertia said: I own this, and razors, and kahles, and swaros, its not necessarily the best for 3gun, picky eyebox for how much it costs. I prefer to recommend scopes based on experience. The atacr is a beautiful piece of equipment but i shoot faster with a more forgiving scope, even with less magnification. Yup, I'm curious what you'll think about the eyebox, FOV, etc. on the Razor 1-10x compared to the Kahles/Swaros you have. I have the Swaro Z8i, but I'm curious about this Razor 1-10x... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
minnesota1 Posted April 21, 2020 Share Posted April 21, 2020 You should really look at the CMore 1-6. Most have no clue they make a scope like that but it is so clear and I love the reticle and small illuminated dot. Check it out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
inertia Posted April 21, 2020 Share Posted April 21, 2020 6 hours ago, avastcosmicarena said: Yup, I'm curious what you'll think about the eyebox, FOV, etc. on the Razor 1-10x compared to the Kahles/Swaros you have. I have the Swaro Z8i, but I'm curious about this Razor 1-10x... kahles and swaros have big eyeboxes and monster fov advantages but sfp, I want both a forgiving scope with a mil ffp reticle, were headed right direction if vortex pulled it off but it still won't be as forgiving as the euro stuff. Looking for ultimate 3 gun scope someone will eventually make an 8x ffp with kahles fov, were getting close. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrd Posted April 21, 2020 Share Posted April 21, 2020 10 hours ago, inertia said: kahles and swaros have big eyeboxes and monster fov advantages but sfp, I want both a forgiving scope with a mil ffp reticle, were headed right direction if vortex pulled it off but it still won't be as forgiving as the euro stuff. Looking for ultimate 3 gun scope someone will eventually make an 8x ffp with kahles fov, were getting close. Agree , but I prefer MRAD. The jury is still out on how forgiving the Vortex 1-10x is, though. For me, the ultimate 3-gun scope has Vortex reticle, FFP, MRAD/MRAD, 1-10x magnification with FOV, glass quality, eye box and weight equal or better than the Swaro 1-8x. Of course FOV and eye box won't be as good as 10x as the Swaro on 8x, but equal or better at the same magnification. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pig4bill Posted April 21, 2020 Share Posted April 21, 2020 Eotech with a magnifier. Big eyebox, big fov. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TonytheTiger Posted April 22, 2020 Share Posted April 22, 2020 23 hours ago, minnesota1 said: You should really look at the CMore 1-6. Most have no clue they make a scope like that but it is so clear and I love the reticle and small illuminated dot. Check it out. I love mine. I wish the dot was Razor bright but thats my only complaint. I rank it between the PST gen 2 and Razor, but leaning closer to the Razor. For $815 its a hell of a scope. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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