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X5 Legion Trigger - Why is it better than other 320s?


uhmeebuh
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I have a new X5 Legion that addresses my previous issues (lock up problems, LCI hole, etc) from my previous non-legion X5s and I can’t tell why the legions have a better trigger than the “normal” P320s.  
 

I’ve had both the Gray Guns competition trigger and Apex trigger in non-legion X5s and the Legion is significantly better.  
 

Does anyone know why/how the break and reset are better in the X5 Legion than the regular X5 and P320 variants?

 

Thanks!

Edited by uhmeebuh
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  • 3 weeks later...
On 3/8/2020 at 5:10 AM, zhunter said:

Legion trigger/FCU has different geometry than previous P320’s

+1. In fact to get the most out of certain trigger upgrades like armory craft for example, the legion trigger must first be installed. 

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7 hours ago, Mig233 said:

+1. In fact to get the most out of certain trigger upgrades like armory craft for example, the legion trigger must first be installed. 

I don't understand what you mean... do you mean the legion trigger bar?  If so,  that would be incorrect.  It works on any p320 as per the AC product page. He did say that it's a terrible idea to run it with the apex trigger bar though...

kg

Screen Shot 2020-03-23 at 8.25.28 PM.png

Edited by KindredGhost
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7 hours ago, Mig233 said:

+1. In fact to get the most out of certain trigger upgrades like armory craft for example, the legion trigger must first be installed uninstalled.

Typo ?

 

I started following the Armory Craft P320 trigger development last year.

Got tired of waiting for the roll out and grabbed the Keres instead.

Have it combined with Apex bar and GG sear kit.....very happy.

 

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7 hours ago, KindredGhost said:

I don't understand what you mean... do you mean the legion trigger bar?  If so,  that would be incorrect.  It works on any p320 as per the AC product page. He did say that it's a terrible idea to run it with the apex trigger bar though...

kg

Screen Shot 2020-03-23 at 8.25.28 PM.png

The AC trigger will work in a standard 320, but it is optimized when you installed the legion trigger bar, so that the legions geometry can be utilized while also having adjustable take up and reset. This according to the owner and designer of the product. 

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7 hours ago, DirectDrive said:

Typo ?

 

I started following the Armory Craft P320 trigger development last year.

Got tired of waiting for the roll out and grabbed the Keres instead.

Have it combined with Apex bar and GG sear kit.....very happy.

 

No, see my above post. The product was designed to be used with the legion trigger bar. It will work with a standard p320, but it is not optimized. 

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1 minute ago, firerain said:

The upper side bar of legion trigger is shorter than standard p320, it gives extra leverage to press the trigger. It is a copy of grayguns trigger design.

This makes total sense as to why the grey guns trigger doesn’t feel like much of an upgrade  over the legion trigger. 

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3 hours ago, Mig233 said:

This makes total sense as to why the grey guns trigger doesn’t feel like much of an upgrade  over the legion trigger. 

My GG trigger was a massive upgrade over the Legion trigger. 4.5# down to sub 2#. The trigger bar geometry is just part of it, the sear springs, trigger bar spring, and pin make a system.

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I’m glad yours turned out well, but I sold my legion a few months ago because the trigger was trash compared to my cz and sti edge. I didn’t want to spend half the gun to fix it. 
 

My friend has a Grey Guns trigger in his legion. We compared the guns side by side and the difference was slight at best. My legion trigger pulled consistently 3.5 lbs. the GG has a slightly shorter reset (maybe 10%) and a slightly more defined break. The pull weight was identical.
 

Let’s put it this way...it did not sell me on it. 

Edited by Mig233
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1 hour ago, Mig233 said:

I’m glad yours turned out well, but I sold my legion a few months ago because the trigger was trash compared to my cz and sti edge. I didn’t want to spend half the gun to fix it. 
 

My friend has a Grey Guns trigger in his legion. We compared the guns side by side and the difference was slight at best. My legion trigger pulled consistently 3.5 lbs. the GG has a slightly shorter reset (maybe 10%) and a slightly more defined break. The pull weight was identical.
 

Let’s put it this way...it did not sell me on it. 

It is possible to get a very nice trigger in the P320.

I am sub 2lbs, clean break and all non-Legion parts. 

Had I started with a Legion, I'd be at $1200 which is too much for a polymer-framed pistol, IMO.

 

I  happen to have an Edge in jail, so we'll see if that will spoil me.

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Ahh you don’t have a legion. Well that makes a ton of sense too. I’m sure the grey gun is an upgrade over the standard 320, but I never compared them side by side. 
 

I had to get rid of the legion because I would take a lesson and shoot all day with the legion. Then at the end I would put like 50 rounds through my cz with the same drills at the same targets and be way more consistent and accurate. So I figured instead of having $1200 into the legion, I’m going to just shoot my nicer pistols that I shoot better with anyway. 
 

so I guess for me the lesson was shoot with what you shoot best. 

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4 hours ago, Mig233 said:

Ahh you don’t have a legion. Well that makes a ton of sense too. I’m sure the grey gun is an upgrade over the standard 320, but I never compared them side by side. 
 

I had to get rid of the legion because I would take a lesson and shoot all day with the legion. Then at the end I would put like 50 rounds through my cz with the same drills at the same targets and be way more consistent and accurate. So I figured instead of having $1200 into the legion, I’m going to just shoot my nicer pistols that I shoot better with anyway. 
 

so I guess for me the lesson was shoot with what you shoot best. 

The "donor" P320F Red Box was unusual in that it had a 4lb trigger as shipped. (similar to a bone stock Legion ?)

The Gray Guns upgrade was the Full Meal Deal with GG sear and springs (used the "light" set).

Trigger : Keres Adjustable

Bar : Apex

 

Edited by DirectDrive
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I have the legion, I picked up the GG kit but I couldn't get the trigger on the bar. So I finally just put the legion trigger on with the GG sear and springs. It was still a improvement over stock. I don't really mind a little pre travel or over travel.

 

Is it as good as my custom 2011's? No. Will it hold back my performance in CO? Nope. So I'm rolling with it like this.

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31 minutes ago, Mig233 said:

4 lbs Sounds good for a non legion. It’s concerning that there is such a variance in factory pistols coming from Sig. 

Probably just "parts". 

If the parts assembly meets the criteria, it comes off the line and gets shipped.

Legions, I am sure get additional attention to protect the brand.

 

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  • 3 weeks later...
19 hours ago, DirectDrive said:

Some intel from another site...

A Legion owner reports that his P320 X-Five Legion striker spring is softer than a standard P320 striker spring.

When he swaps them back and forth he can feel that pull weight is less with the Legion spring.

 

 

The striker spring is definitely softer. I recently had to replace one. The legion spring is longer but noticeably softer when installing it. I found that it made very minimal difference in pull weight compared to a standard 320 striker spring, maybe 1/3 of a pound. 

Edited by Rich406
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  • 2 weeks later...

My findings on Legion versus GG trigger...The GG was a crisper wall and more defined. The Legion was OK and a good deal better than the regular X5 trigger but didn't feel right to me. When doing live fire bill drills I could easily replicate consistent .13 splits in the A zone with the GG and the Legion was more like .16 and a rare .15. GG is preferred on my end over the stock Legion trigger but I hear the Burke job on a Legion is fantastic. Too many trigger rabbit holes to go down! 

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On 4/22/2020 at 6:08 AM, Posvar said:

My findings on Legion versus GG trigger...The GG was a crisper wall and more defined. The Legion was OK and a good deal better than the regular X5 trigger but didn't feel right to me. When doing live fire bill drills I could easily replicate consistent .13 splits in the A zone with the GG and the Legion was more like .16 and a rare .15. GG is preferred on my end over the stock Legion trigger but I hear the Burke job on a Legion is fantastic. Too many trigger rabbit holes to go down! 

I agree.

But when I say GG Trigger, I mean the full meal deal with adjustable trigger, GG sear and full spring kit.

No Legion trigger is going to match that.

 

The title of this thread and the first post probably sold some Legions for SIG.

 

:D

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  • 2 weeks later...
On 3/26/2020 at 8:28 PM, Mig233 said:

I’m glad yours turned out well, but I sold my legion a few months ago because the trigger was trash compared to my cz and sti edge. I didn’t want to spend half the gun to fix it. 
 

 

 

A striker fired trigger is never going to compare to a hammer fired trigger. The factory legion trigger is very good for a striker fired gun, but expecting it to feel like a custom 2011 is just setting yourself up for disappointment.

 

I shot a CZ and a legion side by side. The CZ trigger was obviously better, but overall, I liked the way the legion felt in my hand. I could shoot it better because it fit me better. Obviously, that's going to be different for other people

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