mike4045 Posted January 16, 2020 Share Posted January 16, 2020 Go with 3 divisions optics, Irons and revo. I shoot quite a bit of ss and it's a small division already. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ddc Posted January 27, 2020 Share Posted January 27, 2020 On 1/15/2020 at 8:41 PM, mike4045 said: Go with 3 divisions optics, Irons and revo. I shoot quite a bit of ss and it's a small division already. To make that work you would have to get rid of major/minor. If you don't the people who don't want to worry about loading major will howl. If you do the people who have $5k+ major guns will howl. After reading many of these discussions over the past five years I've come to the conclusion that there is very little if anything that could be done with division redefinition without pissing off a whole lot of people. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mike4045 Posted January 27, 2020 Share Posted January 27, 2020 2 minutes ago, ddc said: To make that work you would have to get rid of major/minor. If you don't the people who don't want to worry about loading major will howl. If you do the people who have $5k+ major guns will howl. After reading many of these discussions over the past five years I've come to the conclusion that there is very little if anything that could be done with division redefinition without pissing off a whole lot of people. Let them cry! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ddc Posted January 27, 2020 Share Posted January 27, 2020 1 minute ago, mike4045 said: Let them cry! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tophernj Posted January 28, 2020 Author Share Posted January 28, 2020 1 hour ago, mike4045 said: Let them cry! For serious! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
teros135 Posted January 28, 2020 Share Posted January 28, 2020 Right back to "I want what I want, and to heck with everybody else"... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shred Posted January 29, 2020 Share Posted January 29, 2020 Nobody likes it (which maybe means it's an OK compromise), but to get rid of Major/Minor, make a PF of 140 that scores A=5, C=4, D=1. Leave Major and Minor how they are, but within a year, few people will shoot either and even less will care when they get deleted a year after that. 140 is about the PF of the cop-loads that they're all dumping .40s for in 9, so Real World Practical too! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrackCage Posted January 29, 2020 Share Posted January 29, 2020 1 hour ago, shred said: Nobody likes it (which maybe means it's an OK compromise), but to get rid of Major/Minor, make a PF of 140 that scores A=5, C=4, D=1. Leave Major and Minor how they are, but within a year, few people will shoot either and even less will care when they get deleted a year after that. 140 is about the PF of the cop-loads that they're all dumping .40s for in 9, so Real World Practical too! If factory ammo doesn't make 140 PF in all flavors of guns, you've now just turned the sport into a reloaders-only game. While many/most of us reload, this wouldn't be good for the sport. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shred Posted January 30, 2020 Share Posted January 30, 2020 Yeah, the 2" .38 Special crowd is going to be pissed. All 3 of them. USPSA can't be all things to all people, it's time to admit the entry level caliber is 9. Tons of factory bulk 9 makes 140 or close enough for a local match with no chrono. Anyone wanting to shoot lighter ammo, there's still Minor PF. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jhgtyre Posted January 30, 2020 Share Posted January 30, 2020 On 1/30/2020 at 7:27 AM, shred said: Yeah, the 2" .38 Special crowd is going to be pissed. All 3 of them. USPSA can't be all things to all people, it's time to admit the entry level caliber is 9. Tons of factory bulk 9 makes 140 or close enough for a local match with no chrono. Anyone wanting to shoot lighter ammo, there's still Minor PF. I took the data from this site http://www.ballistics101.com/9mm.php and made this chart to show PF for many major brands of factory 9mm. 9mm Factory Ammo Power Factors.pdf Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
motosapiens Posted February 6, 2020 Share Posted February 6, 2020 On 1/29/2020 at 9:11 AM, shred said: Nobody likes it (which maybe means it's an OK compromise), but to get rid of Major/Minor, make a PF of 140 that scores A=5, C=4, D=1. Leave Major and Minor how they are, but within a year, few people will shoot either and even less will care when they get deleted a year after that. 140 is about the PF of the cop-loads that they're all dumping .40s for in 9, so Real World Practical too! when I get too old and feeble to hold onto a gun like a grown man, I will probably support a proposal like this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SGT_Schultz Posted February 8, 2020 Share Posted February 8, 2020 On 1/15/2020 at 4:37 AM, Tophernj said: SS is a dwindling division. Allowing an optic in that division just might help it grow. SS isn't dwindling because people can't see the sights. It's dwindling for the same reasons Limited 10 and Revolver are either dead or moribund depending on where you live. IDPA is the place for you: your gun will be perfect for ESP. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PEG941 Posted November 8, 2020 Share Posted November 8, 2020 So after reading all these comments I'm not sure where you would fall shooting single stack with optics i.e red dot. Would you fall in CO or Open? It looks like open but I can't tell for sure as I'm new to the whole USPSA shooting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GrumpyOne Posted November 8, 2020 Share Posted November 8, 2020 13 minutes ago, PEG941 said: So after reading all these comments I'm not sure where you would fall shooting single stack with optics i.e red dot. Would you fall in CO or Open? It looks like open but I can't tell for sure as I'm new to the whole USPSA shooting. Open Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DirkD Posted November 12, 2020 Share Posted November 12, 2020 On 1/14/2020 at 8:04 AM, Tophernj said: Does anyone else think this should be a thing? I'm a fan on the 1911 platform (TBH, I like all guns as evidenced by the fact that I shoot Glocks a lot). However, my eyes suck. I just can't see the front sight as well as I could even 5 years ago. On my Glocks I've switched over to dots and really like them. I have a gun that I'm building (ZEV OZ-9ish) as a dedicated CO rig. But it's just not a 1911. I'd love to be somewhat competitive in whatever class I shoot and if I have a dot on a 1911, I'm in "Open" and am pretty sure I'll get hosed. Shooting fast is fun, being somewhat competitive is funner. Additionally, I'm in a restricted state. This would be a solid class for those of us caught behind enemy lines (don't say it, I HAVE to be here right now) I'd say same rules as CO: No comps/magwells. Red dot mounted to the slide. Gun needs to be somewhat of a production model. All scored as minor. I think it would be a fun little sub-set. Thoughts? You will not be competitive with a 1911 in Carry Optics with a Dot on it, you have limited round capacity in a single stack as compared to other currently legal CO Guns. But i don't see why you shouldn't be allowed to run any gun on CO you wanted to as long as it didn't have a comp or ported barrel. If you do want to shoot a 1911 with a dot on it and be in carry optics, IDPA would be good, you can shoot any gun you want in CO in IDPDA as long as it doesn't have a comp, holes in the barrel, fits the box and weighs 45 ounces or less. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
perttime Posted November 13, 2020 Share Posted November 13, 2020 (edited) 22 hours ago, DirkD said: ... But i don't see why you shouldn't be allowed to run any gun on CO you wanted to as long as it didn't have a comp or ported barrel. ... People who read the rules do find out why. USPSA Rules APPENDIX D7 – Carry Optics Division ... Special conditions: 1. Only Double Action, Double Action/Single Action, and Safe Action/Striker Fired handguns are allowed, and must be on the approved list The List: https://uspsa.org/productionlist -------- Also, IPSC Rules, for the rest of the world: APPENDIX D4a: Production Optics Division .... Special conditions: 14. Only handguns listed as approved in the Production Division List on the IPSC website and fitted with an optical/electronic sight may be used in Production Optics or Production Optics Light Divisions. . Edited November 13, 2020 by perttime Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DirkD Posted November 13, 2020 Share Posted November 13, 2020 4 hours ago, perttime said: People who read the rules do find out why. USPSA Rules APPENDIX D7 – Carry Optics Division ... Special conditions: 1. Only Double Action, Double Action/Single Action, and Safe Action/Striker Fired handguns are allowed, and must be on the approved list The List: https://uspsa.org/productionlist -------- Also, IPSC Rules, for the rest of the world: APPENDIX D4a: Production Optics Division .... Special conditions: 14. Only handguns listed as approved in the Production Division List on the IPSC website and fitted with an optical/electronic sight may be used in Production Optics or Production Optics Light Divisions. . I know it isn't allowed per the rules, but it makes no sense. That is the USPSA way Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PatJones Posted November 14, 2020 Share Posted November 14, 2020 On 11/13/2020 at 9:34 AM, DirkD said: I know it isn't allowed per the rules, but it makes no sense. That is the USPSA way No, it makes perfect sense. The 1911 has a single action trigger, production and CO are for shooters with "crappier" triggers. You can shoot whatever you like in USPSA, we have a whole division for that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SGT_Schultz Posted November 14, 2020 Share Posted November 14, 2020 On 1/14/2020 at 8:42 AM, Tophernj said: Does anyone actually read the OP...? Yes, I did. No, it's not a good idea to further dilute competition with more divisions and no, it's not a good idea to roll single action pistols into carry optics. I doubt you'll find much support for either here. Certainly not mine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SGT_Schultz Posted November 14, 2020 Share Posted November 14, 2020 On 11/13/2020 at 11:34 AM, DirkD said: I know it isn't allowed per the rules, but it makes no sense. That is the USPSA way It makes no sense to you, because you don't get your way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SGT_Schultz Posted November 14, 2020 Share Posted November 14, 2020 On 11/12/2020 at 9:08 AM, DirkD said: you can shoot any gun you want in CO in IDPDA as long as it doesn't have a comp, holes in the barrel, fits the box and weighs 45 ounces or less. There you go, there's the sport for you Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SGT_Schultz Posted November 14, 2020 Share Posted November 14, 2020 On 11/7/2020 at 9:05 PM, PEG941 said: So after reading all these comments I'm not sure where you would fall shooting single stack with optics i.e red dot. Would you fall in CO or Open? And what did the USPSA rulebook say? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SGT_Schultz Posted November 14, 2020 Share Posted November 14, 2020 On 1/27/2020 at 6:09 PM, mike4045 said: Let them cry! I'm starting to change my mind about getting rid of divisions with low participation Let them cry.......... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DirkD Posted November 15, 2020 Share Posted November 15, 2020 7 hours ago, SGT_Schultz said: It makes no sense to you, because you don't get your way. I don't give a s#!t what they do, it is just another stupid rule to protect certain guns. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pskys2 Posted November 16, 2020 Share Posted November 16, 2020 Funny thing is in CO's IDPA allows a 1911, USPSA doesn't? USPSA usually falls on the side of less restrictions than IDPA. Go figure. But just wait, with the popularity of Dots on Carry Guns increasing, it may be only a matter of time before something changes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now