Super GP100 Out in 9mm

[lrjet]

357454  my 929 has a red dot and GP iron sights so can’t compare. I mainly shoot steel challenge and Bianchi plates. I can grip the GP a little higher stronghand where my thumb is pretty close to stock release.

[perttime]

4 hours ago, lrjet said:

... The pull is around .100 longer than the 929 measured bottom tip of trigger. The GP Trigger is very smooth feels light but bit longer....

 

 

Apparently, it is possible to make the Super GP100 trigger pull shorter. A couple of IPSC Revolver shooters were discussing it on facebook a while ago.

 

edit:

found my previous comment on that:

Henrik F. Nielsen: A lot of the travel is not necessary in the end of the stroke and can be removed by careful fitting the hammer and trigger

Olle Lind: I've done that on a few S&W. Makes wonder to the speed

 

This is the group: https://www.facebook.com/groups/261609303984113/

Edited March 22, 2020 by perttime

[alecmc]

43 minutes ago, perttime said:

 

Apparently, it is possible to make the Super GP100 trigger pull shorter. A couple of IPSC Revolver shooters were discussing it on facebook a while ago.

 

edit:

found my previous comment on that:

Henrik F. Nielsen: A lot of the travel is not necessary in the end of the stroke and can be removed by careful fitting the hammer and trigger

Olle Lind: I've done that on a few S&W. Makes wonder to the speed

 

This is the group: https://www.facebook.com/groups/261609303984113/

 

Typically, from what I understand with those shorter length of pull setups means you get a heavier trigger.

The energy needs to come from somewhere, what you lose in momentum of travel needs to be made up in mainspring tension. 

[robertson]

Long action Smiths are not difficult to shoot fast, don't know how the length of pull compares to the Ruger though.

 

 

 

Edited March 22, 2020 by robertson
More sensible reply

[IVC]

21 hours ago, alecmc said:

The energy needs to come from somewhere, what you lose in momentum of travel needs to be made up in mainspring tension. 

Close, but let's be precise - in physics it's called "work" and is an integral of the applied force over distance traveled (simple product if the force is constant). This is the energy that comes from the trigger finger and represents the upper bound on the amount of energy that can be stored in the mainspring after the pull is complete. The energy stored in the mainspring will be lower, however, because part of energy goes into loading the trigger return spring and another part into friction and dissipation.

 

Further, trigger pull weight is not a constant over the trigger travel, but a curve - it varies as the trigger moves around. The trigger weight that we measure is the peak of this curve. A smooth trigger will have trigger pull weight look like a square - zero until you start pulling, constant as you pull, then zero after trigger releases. Another trigger can have a relatively low curve with a pronounced peak, so it feels heavy, but is still long because it's not heavy over longer distance of pull. Other triggers can have jagged curve where the pull weight oscillates, and we call them "gritty." 

 

There is a lot of room to play with an imperfect trigger. Minimizing energy dissipation (changing support springs and smoothing the action) and changing the trigger pull weight curve (modifying geometry) can produce a consistent trigger pull that is both light(er) and short(er). However, once the trigger is "perfect" (square pull weight curve) and there is no significant waste within the mechanism (low overhead), you do have a hard limit on what can be done - there is just so much energy available from the pull of a trigger. That's why if you pick any brand revolver and create a really good trigger, other revolvers will be at about the same pull weight and about the same pull length no matter what. You can get close to the upper limit, but you can never end up with more energy in the mainspring than the work of the trigger pull created. 

[IHAVEGAS]

On 12/27/2019 at 6:51 PM, pskys2 said:

I just finished my GP100 and while it is 1 lb heavier it feels as good (6 1/2 vs 5 1/2 lbs), if not better than my S&W's.  Haven't shot it enough yet to verify it's reliability, but lit off a couple of cylinder fulls.

 

6 1/2 , just by playing with springs and doing a bit of polishing? 

[MikeBurgess]

35 minutes ago, IHAVEGAS said:

 

6 1/2 , just by playing with springs and doing a bit of polishing? 

Yes,

that's where mine ended up by changing the main to a 9lb and rebound to an 8lb from wolf, I did some polishing while it was apart for the hammer bob but it made no real difference as it was super smooth from the factory. I've been 100% with federal primers with this setup, I tried trimming the main spring 1 1/2 coils but that stated light striking about 1 in 24 rounds. I don't hand seat primers just run them right off my LNL 

[IHAVEGAS]

1 hour ago, MikeBurgess said:

Yes,

that's where mine ended up by changing the main to a 9lb and rebound to an 8lb from wolf, I did some polishing while it was apart for the hammer bob but it made no real difference as it was super smooth from the factory. I've been 100% with federal primers with this setup, I tried trimming the main spring 1 1/2 coils but that stated light striking about 1 in 24 rounds. I don't hand seat primers just run them right off my LNL 

 

Thank you!

[pskys2]

On 3/26/2020 at 2:49 PM, IHAVEGAS said:

 

6 1/2 , just by playing with springs and doing a bit of polishing? 

Yes, it needs a bit more polishing to be 100% though.  Shot 4 ICORE Classifiers with it with no issues.  But dry firing the rebound will occasionally hang up.  

[IHAVEGAS]

On 3/22/2020 at 9:12 AM, lrjet said:

As far as loads go if you use .355 to .356 bullets your fine but I am shooting .358 poly and .357 jhp in the GP. Loads pretty good with .357jhp but .358 poly bullets I have to use 105/115/125 grain loaded kinda short with good crimp and have no problem smooth loading with TK moons both revos use the same. I cannot load my 160 grain poly bullets that fit the 929 since tighter chambers, I will probably have the chambers cut a bit looser down the road.

 

 

My luck with revolvers is that there is always some damn thing that adds a nuisance I was not planning on. Just picked up my gun, chambers are tighter than my case gauge which has been on the conservative side with every other gun I own. Any known reason why Ruger would do this? 

Will either need to open up the chambers or reload special for this gun. I'm curious about the coating inside the chambers, perhaps Ruger did that to help with brass sticking, maybe it tends to wear off over time, maybe chambers are more typical in size without the coating? 

 

 

On 3/22/2020 at 10:30 AM, revoman said:

Can I get a picture of the bobbed hammer 

 

+1 . Seems easy enough but it would be nice to have a good idea what the big kids did before firing up the Dremel.

 

11 hours ago, pskys2 said:

Yes, it needs a bit more polishing to be 100% though.  Shot 4 ICORE Classifiers with it with no issues.  But dry firing the rebound will occasionally hang up.  

 

Good info. 

[MikeBurgess]

Can I get a picture of the bobbed hammer 

Not the best picture of the hammer but you get the idea

Sent from my SM-N960U using Tapatalk

[matteekay]

Did you also remove the single-action notch? Or just the spur?

 

Looks good!

[MikeBurgess]

4 minutes ago, matteekay said:

Did you also remove the single-action notch? Or just the spur?

 

Looks good!

Just the spur, don't want to risk messing anything up grinding where I don't have to  

 

And a FYI lightening the hammer made zero difference in ignition, I did the bob job shortly after I cut the main spring to where I was getting occasional light strikes, the lighter hammer did not change the number of light strikes I was getting (kinda made me sad, I was hoping it would help with ignition)

[IHAVEGAS]

8 minutes ago, MikeBurgess said:

And a FYI lightening the hammer made zero difference in ignition, I did the bob job shortly after I cut the main spring to where I was getting occasional light strikes, the lighter hammer did not change the number of light strikes I was getting (kinda made me sad, I was hoping it would help with ignition)

 

Good information! Was wondering how much of a big deal performance wise that bobbing the hammer was, if it does not make a definite improvement I will not mess with it.

 

Finally got to shoot mine a little bit yesterday, with deep seated federals and a 9# Wolff hammer spring it appears to be hitting the primers harder than essential.

 

Bitches - Am likely going to have to do something about the chambers being crazy tight, burning clean powder the brass started sticking after about 40 rounds. Hammer rubs against the frame in one spot, probably a very easy fix with the file but how does a gun that expensive leave the shop like that? Trigger hangs about 1 time in 7 with the 8# Wolff trigger spring, more often when you are shooting single action, assume that will not be hard to fix with a bit of looking filing and polishing, but again , disappointing. I can't remember buying any other gun that was entirely bone dry, no sign of lubrication anywhere except grease to keep the hammer o-rings in place. 

[MikeBurgess]

8 minutes ago, IHAVEGAS said:

 

Good information! Was wondering how much of a big deal performance wise that bobbing the hammer was, if it does not make a definite improvement I will not mess with it.

 

Finally got to shoot mine a little bit yesterday, with deep seated federals and a 9# Wolff hammer spring it appears to be hitting the primers harder than essential.

 

Bitches - Am likely going to have to do something about the chambers being crazy tight, burning clean powder the brass started sticking after about 40 rounds. Hammer rubs against the frame in one spot, probably a very easy fix with the file but how does a gun that expensive leave the shop like that? Trigger hangs about 1 time in 7 with the 8# Wolff trigger spring, more often when you are shooting single action, assume that will not be hard to fix with a bit of looking filing and polishing, but again , disappointing. I can't remember buying any other gun that was entirely bone dry, no sign of lubrication anywhere except grease to keep the hammer o-rings in place. 

My hammer also showed a small rub mark from the frame, I filed down the sides of the hammer when I did the bob job,  apparently the rub mark took almost no energy from the hammer as it didn't change anything ignition wise. I also must have got lucky with the internals being very smooth as I have had no reset issues tat were not user caused, I have a 9lb return spring that I may install just to have a little more snap to the reset.

 

I will add that getting the hammer shims in can be a pain, I may just have been to thick the first couple times I had it out trying to stick them to the hammer with grease and then get all three parts into the frame without moving the shims did not work great for me. 

 

this is how I found works for me.

put hammer in with no shims, put hammer pin in 1/2 way from left (wrong) side use feeler gauge to push right side shim in while looking through pin hole to line it up, use small punch or pick to finalize shim alignment, pull pin from left side and place 1/2 way in from right (correct) side (through the now aligned shim) repeat shim alignment with feeler gauge on left side and once aligned push pin all the way in. 

 

[IHAVEGAS]

48 minutes ago, MikeBurgess said:

I will add that getting the hammer shims in can be a pain, I may just have been to thick the first couple times I had it out trying to stick them to the hammer with grease and then get all three parts into the frame without moving the shims did not work great for me. 

 

With my gun it was easy. The shims moved but not so much that I could not just take a small punch and line them back up. Maybe I just got lucky. 

[MikeBurgess]

1 hour ago, IHAVEGAS said:

 

With my gun it was easy. The shims moved but not so much that I could not just take a small punch and line them back up. Maybe I just got lucky. 

I got away with that once, the second time one of the shims moved enough I thought it was lined up but I really missed it with the pin, lets just say that having a shim floating around in the action is bad for stage scores.

[Tampa-XD45]

There are some decent Ruger shim videos half way down this page:  https://triggershims.com/index.html

[CMason5859]

I have found it easy to put the shims back in place with a business card.

You can just cut a small U shape out of the card and is to push it right into place.

Makes cheap easy tool to use.

 

 

 

Edited March 31, 2020 by CMason5859

[perttime]

If the hammer is rubbing on the frame, are the stock shims enough?

[alecmc]

10 hours ago, perttime said:

If the hammer is rubbing on the frame, are the stock shims enough?

 

Does it stop rubbing on the frame with them ? 

Yes ? Then yup! They're good

No? Then nope, buy some more.

 

 

Edited April 1, 2020 by alecmc

[MikeBurgess]

11 hours ago, perttime said:

If the hammer is rubbing on the frame, are the stock shims enough?

In my case nope, but seeing as how I was grinding on the hammer anyway I just thinned it out a touch while I was at it.

Basically I had a file but didn't have any extra shims 

 

[IHAVEGAS]

20 hours ago, MikeBurgess said:

In my case nope, but seeing as how I was grinding on the hammer anyway I just thinned it out a touch while I was at it.

Basically I had a file but didn't have any extra shims 

 

 

Ditto. Right or wrong I preferred to clean things up with a file and just use the shims to get the clearance to what felt "right" , I think I remember seeing 0.004" (total, not each side) recommended. 

 

Other things;

Sent Ruger a note about the cylinder chambers being too tight. My ammo that works fine with 7 other 9mm guns (including a 929) will not load, ammo that will load tends to start being hard to extract after 40 rounds or so. They replied back and want me to return the cylinder. 

 

Polishing helps. Tried just installing Wolff springs & lubing. Compared to my other GP100 (base model) the trigger felt noticeably gritty, doing all of the polishing on the MCarbo video took away some of the gritty feel. 

 

 

[IHAVEGAS]

On 3/22/2020 at 9:12 AM, lrjet said:

I will probably have the chambers cut a bit looser down the road.

 

Anybody know of a revolversmith that is set up to do this for 9mm?

 

Ruger basically told me to pack sand (but were polite about it). TK custom would hone & polish but not cut. 

[alecmc]

1 minute ago, IHAVEGAS said:

 

Anybody know of a revolversmith that is set up to do this for 9mm?

 

Ruger basically told me to pack sand (but were polite about it). TK custom would hone & polish but not cut. 

 try

 

http://olhasso.com/

Edited April 3, 2020 by alecmc