Reloading Setup: S1050 or RL1100

[cperazza]

New to reloading pistol ammo, but experienced in rifle single stage loading.

 

I am looking to reload for 38SC and 40 Cal Long Major.

 

1) What setup you recommend and why?

  - Bulletfeeder, Case Processing Machine

 

2) When you recommend incorporating the Auto drive and sensors?

- Autodrive, Remote Stop, Swage Sense, Decap Sense, Bullet Sense, Digital Powder Check

[ltdmstr]

The 1100 is a better design than the Super, so I'd go with that.  Actually, an older RL1050 would be my first choice if you can find one.  As for add-ons, a bullet feeder and LED lighting are the top choices.  Also a quick release for the powder measure.  Case Pro or Rollsizer are probably not necessary if you have a custom gun/barrel.  As for autodrive, I have three 1050s and prefer to run them manually.  To me, it's not worth the time, trouble and expense to automate.  But some people like it.

[pjb45]

I have loaded both on my RL1050.  
I have been industrious and loaded thousands at a sitting.  Yes, I have the auto primer.  It fills about the same time I need to add more primers.

I have been exceptionally lazy and loaded 200 about 10 minutes before I left for the match.

 

Micro bullet seating die ++++

Lee undersize die for the 40 S&W is a must.

I changed out the powder tray to one that allow for small increments in measurement.

Being on the lazy side, I had tool heads for  9, 40, 45. 223 (two - trimming and seating).  The first time you do a caliber change take your time.  It actually becomes faster with experience.

[avastcosmicarena]

10 minutes ago, pjb45 said:

I have loaded both on my RL1050.  
I have been industrious and loaded thousands at a sitting.  Yes, I have the auto primer.  It fills about the same time I need to add more primers.

I have been exceptionally lazy and loaded 200 about 10 minutes before I left for the match.

 

Micro bullet seating die ++++

Lee undersize die for the 40 S&W is a must.

I changed out the powder tray to one that allow for small increments in measurement.

Being on the lazy side, I had tool heads for  9, 40, 45. 223 (two - trimming and seating).  The first time you do a caliber change take your time.  It actually becomes faster with experience.

How long does the caliber change take with a dedicated tool head? I'd be looking to switch back and forth between 9mm and .223.

[DJRyan13]

9 to 223 with dedicated toolheads is quick and simple.... same primer size. Switching to 45 takes a bit longer. The one thing people don’t mention when talking about converting is the fact that we all like it clean when we do so we spend a bit longer to clean up any grime....

 

As for RL1100 vs 1050... I have been a happy 1050 owner for years. If you ever want to run 30-06 sized cases, 1050. If you are just doing 9 and 223, then definitely 1100 as the powder spilling from the jerky 1050 shellplate motion is a PIA.

 

Of course, everyone’s opinion is based on what Dillon says about 1100 because no one has seen one in the wild yet..... 

[pjb45]

For more frequently than not, when I do a conversion, I do a pretty through clean and grease job also.  So that takes a little extra time.

Otherwise;

Tool heads off and new one on, in about 5 minutes, that includes getting everything organized. 

Adjustment for the Lee undersize die about 10 in order to make sure it does its job.

Powder ,three to 10 measures to assure correct amount. So with weighing about 10 minutes (see note)

The bullet seating die about 15 minutes.  This can be time intensive.  It is almost totally dependent on how tight I get the tool head.  Even a half turn of the bolt can change the seating. I load 1.175 OAL.

 

Note: I typically measure 4-5 sets of 10 to assure I get a pretty consistent measure.  I do this every time the machine is not used for more than 3 weeks.  OR if I am loading ammo for a major match.  I have never been bumped into Open and I run consistently between 167-171 PF on my 40.  I only use VV 320 in my 40 and 3N38 in my 38SC.  I had an older meaning totally obnoxious SV IMM 38SC with the concussion effect of a howitzer.  The ROs would back away.  It need about 174 PF to be flat shooting.  

 

[ltdmstr]

I would disagree on the Lee U die.  A lot of those will size the case down way more than is necessary to prevent bullet setback.  I use Redding carbide dies on all my machines and they work fine.  And I don't have the muffin top like you get with the U die.  As for the 1100, they are an improvement over the Super, but still have some drawbacks.  The main one being a very long stroke, which appears to be even longer than the Super.  That's one of the reasons many prefer the older RLs.

[Laxman2809]

5 hours ago, avastcosmicarena said:

How long does the caliber change take with a dedicated tool head? I'd be looking to switch back and forth between 9mm and .223.

Like 5 minutes assuming that you have dedicated everything  between the 2 calibers.

[Laxman2809]

3 hours ago, ltdmstr said:

I would disagree on the Lee U die.  A lot of those will size the case down way more than is necessary to prevent bullet setback.  I use Redding carbide dies on all my machines and they work fine.  And I don't have the muffin top like you get with the U die.  As for the 1100, they are an improvement over the Super, but still have some drawbacks.  The main one being a very long stroke, which appears to be even longer than the Super.  That's one of the reasons many prefer the older RLs.

What is the negative about sizing down more than necessary, I understand brass life could be a concern, but 40 is plentiful. 

[ltdmstr]

38 minutes ago, Laxman2809 said:

What is the negative about sizing down more than necessary, I understand brass life could be a concern, but 40 is plentiful. 

 

Can also affect accuracy.  There's no real upside and it's just not necessary.

[Sarge]

12 minutes ago, ltdmstr said:

 

Can also affect accuracy.  There's no real upside and it's just not necessary.

I think that’s speculative. I’m sure other dies prevent setback but the Udie is KNOWN to fix it. I have seen no difference in accuracy with the Udie. I have also reloaded the same undersized brass countless times with no unique ill effects.

[ltdmstr]

13 minutes ago, Sarge said:

I think that’s speculative. I’m sure other dies prevent setback but the Udie is KNOWN to fix it. I have seen no difference in accuracy with the Udie. I have also reloaded the same undersized brass countless times with no unique ill effects.

 

Maybe.  But I still don't see the benefit of excess sizing.  All that's required to prevent setback is about .002 interference fit, and every U-die I've seen gives WAY more than that.  Also, most of the muffin top bullets loaded with a U die aren't concentric.  They're offset to one side and inconsistent at that.  I just don't see how it's a good thing.

[Laxman2809]

46 minutes ago, ltdmstr said:

 

Can also affect accuracy.  There's no real upside and it's just not necessary.

I mean the upside for me is knowing that that 1 out of 10k rds will pass the gauge. 

[ltdmstr]

10 hours ago, Laxman2809 said:

I mean the upside for me is knowing that that 1 out of 10k rds will pass the gauge. 

 

Ok.  I get the same (actually better) without the excess sizing.  Btw, the excess sizing also results in additional resistance when you're running the press.  Which means more operator fatigue.  It's quite noticeable and makes a big difference after a while.  So, if you guys want to use U dies, that's fine.  I'm just disagreeing with the statement above that it's a must, because it isn't.  And there are better alternatives.

[cperazza]

On 12/22/2019 at 7:42 AM, ltdmstr said:

The 1100 is a better design than the Super, so I'd go with that.  Actually, an older RL1050 would be my first choice if you can find one.  As for add-ons, a bullet feeder and LED lighting are the top choices.  Also a quick release for the powder measure.  Case Pro or Rollsizer are probably not necessary if you have a custom gun/barrel.  As for autodrive, I have three 1050s and prefer to run them manually.  To me, it's not worth the time, trouble and expense to automate.  But some people like it.

Thanks for the feedback.

[tmz]

If budget wasn’t an issue I would consider  the Mark7 Manual Evolution.

Don’t get me wrong I have owned

6/1050s and still have one of them and like them very much so but after buying the evolution it is everything I wish that Dillon would have done to improve their machine throughout the years to become. 
Loading for me is just as big as a hobby as the shooting sport.
I tend to lean towards buying something of high-quality the first time so I don’t have to spend again.
I feel the Evolution is a very high-quality well-built machine and it would’ve been my first purchase if it was available years ago. Seeing pictures of it doesn’t do it justice unless you see one in person and actually use the machine. 
I could go on about it but if it’s something that you’re possibly interested in looking at you might want to do a little investigating on it or ask for some info here on it and I don’t mean to hijack the thread from Dillon to Mark 7 but was just throwing it out there if your budget is larger and giving you more options to think about. 

[cperazza]

Thanks for the feedback and discussion?

• @pjb45
• @avastcosmicarena
• @DJRyan13
• @ltdmstr
• @Laxman2809
• @Sarge

 

I have used reloads on my limited guns and have noticed the muffin top effect.  Haven't had any issues with feeding or accuracy.

 

What dies you guys recommend?  Heard good things about Redding Carbide.  How about the Dillon Dies?  Any thoughts on Mark 7's Ultimate Die pack?  Can it be used with the Dillon Presses?

 

Also came to find depending on the powder measure/setting, I will need a different crimping die?

[ltdmstr]

I use Redding dies on all my Dillon machines (Wilson for the single stage stuff).  Dual ring carbide for the 9x19.  I also prefer their competition seating dies.  Those have a micrometer adjustment that allows you to very precisely change the OAL in seconds, and it's repeatable.  This is particularly convenient if you use different brands/types of bullets.

[cperazza]

1 hour ago, tmz said:

If budget wasn’t an issue I would consider  the Mark7 Manual Evolution.

Don’t get me wrong I have owned

6/1050s and still have one of them and like them very much so but after buying the evolution it is everything I wish that Dillon would have done to improve their machine throughout the years to become. 
Loading for me is just as big as a hobby as the shooting sport.
I tend to lean towards buying something of high-quality the first time so I don’t have to spend again.
I feel the Evolution is a very high-quality well-built machine and it would’ve been my first purchase if it was available years ago. Seeing pictures of it doesn’t do it justice unless you see one in person and actually use the machine. 
I could go on about it but if it’s something that you’re possibly interested in looking at you might want to do a little investigating on it or ask for some info here on it and I don’t mean to hijack the thread from Dillon to Mark 7 but was just throwing it out there if your budget is larger and giving you more options to think about. 

 

@tmz

I have heard also good things about the Mark 7 Evolution.  So I was and I am still seriously considering it.  But as you stated, is it worth the additional $1000?  What am I getting above the 1050/1100?  Craftmanship, smoothness of operation, more concentric/consistent/accurate ammo? This is one of the things, which I am trying to answer indirectly through this thread.  Feel free to PM (Or we can start a new thread), I like to hear more.

 

I am also with you on getting quality IOT not have to spend more again.

[Drmike]

I have reloaded for over 30yrs but have been reloading 40sw (mainly) and 9mm on my xl650 extensively since getting into IPSC about a year ago and have been frustrated with the number of rounds that fail the case gauge.  Switching to the Lee U die and factory crimp die has helped, but really increases the effort and I have had a lot of index ring and even shell plate breakage (2) which I believe is due to having the U die screwed down far enough to remove the Glock bulge in my range pick up brass.  I also frequently have crushed brass at the U die station due to tight base of die. I am on the wait list for a RL1100 in 40SW and am considering the Redding Comp Pro dies.  Will this sort out my problems?   Any thoughts?

Edited December 26, 2019 by Drmike
Grammar

[ltdmstr]

I've been reloading for 30+ years myself and never cared for Dillon or Lee dies.  Particularly the U die, for the reasons mentioned above.  I've used Redding dies for most of that time for .38, 9, .40, .45, 5.56, 300 BLK, 6.5, .308 and .300 WSM.  All with zero issues.  I did have a Case Pro for about the last 10 years or so, and now have a Rollsizer.  If you're going to use range pickup brass, it's a good idea to process them in one of those, at least initially.  After that, it's not necessary, assuming you're shooting in a quality barrel with a relatively tight chamber and decent support.  I'm sure you can get good results with other dies.  But I would definitely recommend Redding.

[Sigarmsp226]

1 hour ago, ltdmstr said:

I've been reloading for 30+ years myself and never cared for Dillon or Lee dies.  Particularly the U die, for the reasons mentioned above.  I've used Redding dies for most of that time for .38, 9, .40, .45, 5.56, 300 BLK, 6.5, .308 and .300 WSM.  All with zero issues.  I did have a Case Pro for about the last 10 years or so, and now have a Rollsizer.  If you're going to use range pickup brass, it's a good idea to process them in one of those, at least initially.  After that, it's not necessary, assuming you're shooting in a quality barrel with a relatively tight chamber and decent support.  I'm sure you can get good results with other dies.  But I would definitely recommend Redding.

Itdmstr - So I am reading this and paying attention to your 30 years of wisdom....I just went over to the MidSouth  Shooting Supply website and they have several three die sets for pistol calibers To choose from...Could you please be so kind as to provide the set you recommend when your time allows....I am guessing one of the links below is what you are going to recommend but I want to be sure which one before ordering.....Thanks in advance and Merry Christmas...Mark

https://www.midsouthshooterssupply.com/item/0007666172/9mm-luger-premium-handgun-die-set 

 

https://www.midsouthshooterssupply.com/item/0007658172/9mm-luger-titanium-carbide-competition-pro-series-3-die-set
 

Edited December 24, 2019 by Sigarmsp226

[ltdmstr]

Looks like the 66172 set has an expander, which you don't need.  58172 is the one you want.  It has size/decap, competition seater and taper crimp.  Btw, I misstated above re: the dual ring.  That's on the .40 not the 9.  You don't need if for 9mm b/c the slight taper in the case.

[Sigarmsp226]

Thank you Sir. I will get me a set of these on order with my next primer order from MidSouth...Mark

[Drmike]

Thanks ltdmstr, I have the Redding comp pro titanium carbides on order.  They will probably beat the RL1100 here by Several weeks.