Level 2 USPSA Major Match Fee vs Value

[levellinebrad]

The only thing I require, as a shooter, at a major match is a higher level of stage design and higher level of competitors. Everything else is just gravy.

 

As an RO at a major match I want the higher level of stage design and it has to be worth my time to RO. I’m taking off 4 days of work that I could spend with my grandchildren so I really don’t want the trip to cost me the time AND $1000 to boot for food and lodging.

 

As a shooter, I will forego the gravy so that the match is properly staffed

[SeattleDude]

I would love to see Awesome Stages with good variation of short/fast to longer and more technical, Swingers, Clamshells, Steel.... and good amount of competitors to race against.

Bottled Water on the every stage. Dont have to be Cold I am not picky.

Place of a little shade if possible or a Cover from Rain.

Something to keep as a memory of the match (Custom Water bottle or a Patch )

 

I dont care about: Food, Prize Table, Amount of the prizes on the prize table, I dont mind helping reset and tape.

[kryo]

Being in college I like the thought of a lower match fee. I'm young and sprung enough that resetting doesn't bother me at all. Its fun if you have a friend in your squad to race to pick up steel. Having to carry a cooler in a cart or lunch really goes with the length of the day and either is fine. I really just want to shoot matches to see my improvement, compete, and possible recuperate my costs through placement cash or random prizes to do it all over again. However there is one thing I can't stand. Cotton T-shirts. They never fit correctly for me. If you have shirts, I'd pay a little more to have a wicking shirt that is not too "out there" to wear later on and have as a memento from the match.

[happygunner77]

^Keep shirts optional. That lowers the cost. 

[Laxman2809]

If the match fee includes a nice wicking shirt and personally I like kind of out there shirts. Then I would be ok with the cost being increased. Prize table is nice but not a requirement.

[mchapman]

On 11/29/2019 at 9:05 AM, happygunner77 said:

^Keep shirts optional. That lowers the cost. 

Having no shirts will lower the cost. Making it optional generally won't because in order to get decent pricing on the shirts you usually have a minimum amount you have to order to get the pricing down.

[KellyB]

The base level: a well ran match. Adequate number of ROs familiar with the rules, props that work consistently - all day long, a functional timeline, good communication, plenty of safe tables & bathroom stops.

Potential Extra-Curricular Match features
*Match Shirts - vendors & sponsors get more bang for their buck with these since competitors will wear them to other matches.

*Competitor Lunches - doesn’t have to be included but have items available for purchase, chips, drinks, sandwiches, fruit, maybe a food truck or Boy Scout group to handle this.
*Drinking Water on the Bays - bottles of water are a must, especially 85° and above temps. Jugs of water get nasty. No one carries around cups either.

*Prize Table (Random or Order of Finish) - gift certificates & deep discount cards are good. Some fly in & it’s hard to get everything in suitcase.
*Cash Payback - good idea for top spots
*Random Gun Drawings - at least one for staff & then others as well
*Match Ammo Service - if you are running a chrono, this should be mandatory.

*Onsite RV/Camping, match hotel discounts, local restaurant info - have the info available, this is just good community business.

[bret]

Just shot a level 2 match at my club, $125.

 

9 great stages, 2 guns given away at registration,  a T Shirt, iced drinks on the stages, snacks, after the match a good lunch in the clubhouse and awards ceremony. 

[SwedishMoose]

The only level 2 I've been to was the SC Sectional, and it was 10/10. 

 

I didn't care for the prize table, as half of my squad won nothing and the other half won some hogue slip on Glock 17 gen 3 grips. 

 

But there was a side match, gun giveaways, food trucks, etc. 

 

The people working the match were the ones who did the pasting, so that was probably the best part and deciding factor on why my boys settled on the SC match. 

 

The only bad part was it's also the only match I've DQ'd in, meaning I paid a lot and drove 8 hours to shoot 5 stages. 

[18111811]

On 11/18/2019 at 11:10 PM, IronicTwitch said:

Really got me thinking about the detailed planning that goes into bigger matches. Financials and schedules. Thanks to the MDs that do this and make it look easy.

 

For $150 I'd hope Staff should have a no expense match (hotels, per diem, shirts).  Happy ROs = good match atmosphere

 

As a competitor, I'm looking for a 10-14 stage match. Full or half day format. 10-12 person squads.  Staff oversight to reset movers and stage designs to minimize reshoots. 

 

Keeping squads flowing without backups is key. Expectations for time on the range influence how we hydrate and fuel and focus. I like water and shade provided on each stage.

 

Match sponsors are the only level I remember, and usually those are bullet providers. Makes sense since that's the one common consumable. Don't bother trying to beat the bushes for more sponsors.

 

I really like raffles for guns or reloading presses or components.  Added anticipation of the chance of winning even after the match is done.

 

Prize table should be trophy only. I saw a comment about cash prize for division winners to draw in top tier competitors. Maybe that's worth something.

 

Lunch provided. I saw a comment about shooting through lunch and like the idea but not sure how that'd play in reality for most.

 

Last, suggest more transparency on the match balance sheet and how many shooters are needed to break even. Not sure how far in advance that balance sheet starts. Since most clubs are run as non-profits, I think it would give ownership back to competitors that these matches are really for us.

I like your list.  What are your thoughts on staff only prizes?

[rustychev]

I have never worked a level 2  my club is looking into holding one nest year from a ROs point of view would you rather have a room provided and get stuck with a roommate or be given some amount of per diem and have to find your own place?  Same for luch more cash to bring your own or some form of food be it subs and cookie or what ever.

[Sarge]

1 hour ago, rustychev said:

I have never worked a level 2  my club is looking into holding one nest year from a ROs point of view would you rather have a room provided and get stuck with a roommate or be given some amount of per diem and have to find your own place?  Same for luch more cash to bring your own or some form of food be it subs and cookie or what ever.

Every major I’ve ever worked gave the option to room with somebody else for free or have your own room and pay half the match hotel rate. Totally normal.

And feed me.

[Joe4d]

folks tend to eat everyday. I dont see the need to buy people meals. They would be buying them at the match or not. Generally these match meals are hit and miss to the point I imagine most folks dont count on them anyway.
Always seems to be a huge hassle for MD's and I always wonder why bother ?

Far as lodging depends on your area. How many RO's need it ? How many are local ?
If you want to pay for it, just give each RO half a room in money. Let them figure it out. 

[rustychev]

3 minutes ago, Joe4d said:

folks tend to eat everyday. I dont see the need to buy people meals. They would be buying them at the match or not. Generally these match meals are hit and miss to the point I imagine most folks dont count on them anyway.
Always seems to be a huge hassle for MD's and I always wonder why bother ?

Far as lodging depends on your area. How many RO's need it ? How many are local ?
If you want to pay for it, just give each RO half a room in money. Let them figure it out. 

That last part brings to mind do you give local ROs cash as they don't have a hotel?  My first thought is no your covering cost not paying them right.

[Joe4d]

well then you end up deciding whats local..  Probably way easier to just have an RO meal / lodging allowance flat rate per day.

[zzt]

I'm going to chime in on my opinion of an LII match I recently shot.  I live in a Covid restricted State.  So there was no food truck, no sit down hot lunches, etc.  The staff cooked hot dogs and served them with or without chili whenever you could break away, and there were soft drinks.  There was water on every stage.

 

The prize table was slim this year.  So much so that there was not enough for every shooter.  So the ROs voted to donate the stuff on their prize table to the shooters table.  There were not enough ROs to staff the entire match, so ROs moved with the squads, as did the scorers.  However there were not enough scoring ROs, so some shooters had to fill in.

 

The ROs shot on Thu, then worked from 8 AM until 7:30 PM on Fri and Sat, and from 8 AM until 2PM on Sun.  What did they get for all that work, other than the heart felt thanks of every shooter on every squad?  Not very much, but they did get something.

 

This was a very expensive shoot.  My only complaint was that ROs who stayed overnight had their rooms paid for.  Those that lived near enough to commute every day received noting.  In fairness I believe a per diem should have been paid to all ROs, no matter what.  Geez!  They worked their asses off.  Cut into the 2/3 of the proceeds given out in the Lewis Class.

[aandabooks]

I've only worked a hand full of Level II and III matches the past couple years.  There can be a bit of a shortage on ROs at some of the stuff this year.  Worked the Indiana Section last weekend and for the first time worked as an embedded RO.

 

Here is my take on the RO situation for staffing these matches: There should be a staff hotel where people don't have to make their own reservations and 2 people per room or pay 1/2 for private.  Person real local then give them the cost of hotel room to cover travel costs.  Lunch should be provided for staff and if they don't want it can bring their own.  Some level of prize table for ROs or cash payment for work.

 

Value for the competitor is a different issue.  When I don't work and pay for a match, I expect the following: 10-12 well produced stages, competent staff, option to buy lunch at the range or free and I'll decide what to bring extra, shade and water on the stages.  Either a prize table by order of finish or a random gift bag on check-in.  Seen it either way but for sure don't like a random walked prize table.  

[broadside72]

I have been adjusting my expectations for majors lately.

• 10-12 good stages for L2. Not 6 good ones and 6 quick and dirty ones, but 10-12 quality stages (a few short courses are fine, just be a challenge). 
• Division and class recognition, be it a plaque, small trophy, or medal
• Random prize drawing given at check-in or have the option to be mailed if not present. Winning something is nice but I don't expect a prize
• COLD water and shade on each stage
• Competent ROs (that is my biggest gripe)
• Lunch available for purchase
• Nice to have: optional buy-in raffle for higher end prize (e.g. gun, press, etc)