Anyone know why sti is getting rid of their open guns?

[ELSOS]

Any words on their warranties for the guns out there? The big seller for some has been the lifetime warranty. If they aren’t making open guns anymore do they have replacement parts for when guns break?

[konkapot]

We are all making a lot of assumptions without much info. Their guns are NOT what they used to be and to make it worse they are trying to charge more. 

 

LE Market is dominated by Glocks/Sigs etc. I've been in the LE/Training industry for a bit now and I can count on zero fingers how many cops I've seen carrying STIs. 

 

Are there exceptions? Sure there might be a small muni team that buys some, or a group of cops is doing a small group buy, but there's no way for STI to sell enough guns to cops to "put food on the table."

 

I would LOVE to be a fly on the wall at STI when they made some of the decisions that put them here. I do not accept that they said "Hey let's make crappy  guns!" 

 

Maybe it was cut a corner on this widget, buy this thingy from Nigeria, spend zero time fitting anything, etc. Maybe a bunch of little things. 

 

They should start from scratch and go back to what they do well. Make an Eagle in 9/40, make an Edge in 9/40. Make one good single stack in 9/40/45. That's it. No more gold/Ti barrels, no more John Wick stuff. 

[zombywoof]

I had a 2005 era STI Grandmaster. After tens of thousands of rounds, the frame and slide cracked. After several months wait, I received my warranted replacement. I asked for a DVC-O in 9 major. It arrived in mid 2019. I compared it to a few year old DVC-O of a friend of mind. It had several changes. 

 

I finished this season shooting Carry Optics and only dabbled with my new open gun. I have almost 3000 rounds through the gun with zero problems. I live in a ban state and I'm running STI gen 1 10 round mags. 

 

I just installed a steel grip and this gun runs nice. I sure hope they don't stop making open guns.

[MILDOTS]

Is it possible that the market is saturated, it seems there are a lot of gunsmiths building open guns. Maybe it’s like Colt discontinuing the AR-15 too many companies have saturated the market I started with a caspian 38 super then transitioned to a SVI, not nearly as many options as there now.

[ltdmstr]

On 10/31/2019 at 5:25 AM, nikdanja said:

Where did STI start to go wrong?

 

The decline started a LONG time ago.  Way back when Dave Skinner bought it and Don Kimble ran the operation.  It's gotten progressively worse ever since.  Other than an occasional magazine tube, I haven't used an STI frame, slide or part in probably 20+ years.

[Slide4949]

I have a STI DVC 38 super comp open gun with about 2k round and it runs great, no problems.

[tomv]

I had one of the original DVC Open guns. Lots of teething problems in the beginning but STI finally got it right after getting the gun back 3 times. I sold it to a friend a couple of years ago and it's still going strong, running 100%.

Seems like every gun I bought from them had to go back for one reason or another. This includes a 9mm Electra which arrived with an 8 1/2 pound trigger. As usual their customer service was excellent but I wonder how they can make money with this apparent level of rework.

[cecil]

I bought a STI DVC when they were first announced...  I did have a problem initially .. it was ramped too much which caused the brass to bulge... sent it back... got it back within 5 weeks... NO PROBLEMS WHAT SO EVER SINCE..  as in everything... some problems will arise...  STI's lifetime warranty is hard to beat... I own 3 STI open pistols.. love everyone of them..  I sincerely hope STI solves their tainted reputation.. 

[aalbert]

Disheartening to see them phase out the competition end of their company (which is where their roots were at -- I was there in early 90s shooting the same bays and matches in Austin, that that would). One can only hope that they circle around, and come up with a winner (maybe that Tactical Timmy money will give them the $$ to R&D a Racing Roger Gun) ... In the meantime, I guess I will continue my search for an old Steel Master as a range toy. 

[shred]

(Hi Andy... I shot with you back then too ) Tac Timmys throw down way more cash and shoot way less rounds.  What's not to like about chasing that market?  If I was STI and could sell every $5K John Woo gun I could make, that's what I'd be doing...

[lacivilian]

2 hours ago, shred said:

(Hi Andy... I shot with you back then too ) Tac Timmys throw down way more cash and shoot way less rounds.  What's not to like about chasing that market?  If I was STI and could sell every $5K John Woo gun I could make, that's what I'd be doing...

This. From a business standpoint it makes sense to sell more guns and have a smaller percentage come back for warranty. Whether we (competition shooters) like it or not, they are running a business that is based on sheer number of sales. 

[NickBlasta]

On 11/1/2019 at 5:38 AM, ELSOS said:

Any words on their warranties for the guns out there? The big seller for some has been the lifetime warranty. If they aren’t making open guns anymore do they have replacement parts for when guns break?

 

I imagine they will eventually only do what they mostly do now, which is offer to replace your old model gun with something they currently produce. If they say they can't fix it because they don't make open guns anymore you may be able to convince them to do it, maybe not. The terms of their warranty allow them to decline a repair for whatever reason they want.

[rr4406pak]

Had an STI DVC Open in 9 Maj (My first open gun) and it was a jam-o-matic. Nothing but problems. What a nightmare.

Then the comp cracked.

STI agreed to replace it with a new DVC-O. Still waiting for it...

Don’t have much confidence that the new gun will run right. Fingers crossed.

[Tcotter2629]

Because the tactical timmys buy more guns and use them less. They can either sell a dvc that is 50% likely to come back within a year after it’s been shot 20,000 times or a staccato that will not see 20,000 in its lifetime because the “tactical” guys think competition shooting gets ya killed on da streetz 

[ltdmstr]

9 hours ago, Tcotter2629 said:

Because the tactical timmys buy more guns and use them less. They can either sell a dvc that is 50% likely to come back within a year after it’s been shot 20,000 times or a staccato that will not see 20,000 in its lifetime because the “tactical” guys think competition shooting gets ya killed on da streetz 

 

Why bother building guns that actually work and last, when you can build/sell junk to people who aren't going to shoot them?  Great business model.  We'll see where they are in a couple of years.  I'd guess they won't be around.

[AverageJoeShooting]

12 hours ago, ltdmstr said:

 

Why bother building guns that actually work and last, when you can build/sell junk to people who aren't going to shoot them?  Great business model.  We'll see where they are in a couple of years.  I'd guess they won't be around.

i think i knew as soon as SVI split off that STI wouldnt last

 

[Aircooled6racer]

Hello: I think STI knows what they can sell and what they can't sell. They just look at the numbers and what is selling. I was told years ago that most of STI's are sold over seas. If that market has dried up it would hurt their business. If they invest in themselves and start making more parts in house with good materials they will be able to compete. Thanks, Eric

[tomv]

It seems to me that they grew too fast. The production system that worked fine in the beginning with guns like the Steelmaster fell apart when the demand was much higher. Quality is the first thing that goes when trying to meet a production schedule unless the process has been re-engineered to meet the higher demand. Especially true when skilled labor is required.

[ltdmstr]

Building 1911/2011s is not a difficult task if you know what you're doing.  And it's not difficult to do on a large scale if you have people that are reasonably skilled and properly trained, and there's an actual quality control process in place.  Obviously none of those are true for STI.  How many threads are there on this forum regarding STI guns with serious issues, most of which required extensive rework or outright replacement?  When that gets to be standard operating procedure for your business, your days are numbered.  If the folks that run the company had any idea what they were doing, they could sell a lot of guns at a lower price point than SV, and make a bunch of money doing it.  But clearly they have no clue.

Edited November 6, 2019 by ltdmstr

[Nolan]

9 hours ago, AverageJoeShooting said:

i think i knew as soon as SVI split off that STI wouldnt last

 

 LOL!  You do know that happened 25 years ago, right?

 

Nolan

[AverageJoeShooting]

50 minutes ago, Nolan said:

 LOL!  You do know that happened 25 years ago, right?

 

Nolan

im not sure what this changes?

[iflyskyhigh]

im not sure what this changes?

I think it means that you insinuated the split would cause the demise of STI, but since the split happened 25 years ago, it’s tough to make that connection.

Not that it couldn’t have been a slow burn, but the split as a catalyst for the downfall of STI would probably be easier to connect if it had happened with the past few years.


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[AverageJoeShooting]

23 hours ago, iflyskyhigh said:

 

I think it means that you insinuated the split would cause the demise of STI, but since the split happened 25 years ago, it’s tough to make that connection.

Not that it couldn’t have been a slow burn, but the split as a catalyst for the downfall of STI would probably be easier to connect if it had happened with the past few years.


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Everyone knew the split would cause the demise. When one company focuses on quality and the other production it was only a matter of time before the company focused on pushing more out would loose qa. It's a story as old as time. 

[tomv]

Not necessarily true. Some of the highest volume producers on Earth also have the highest quality. Think about TV sets. The point is that the production process needs to be engineered to be fool proof. This is what ensures high output quality without a lot of rework.

[Nolan]

I'm not sure I'm seeing a demise in this case.  It just appears they have moved away from competition only guns to pursue other markets, namely the TacTimmy crowd and LEO.  That certainly is a much larger market and in most cases a much less demanding market.  Guns sold to the majority of that market will not be shot nearly as much as in the competition market.

 

Nolan