DAA Magnetic Powder Check

[Hooked]

Hi all,

 

I recently started using the DAA magnetic powder check and noticed that even with the die set up correctly for the amount of the powder charge, I get a brief "blip" from the alarm once out of every 4 cases or so. 

 

It's not a sustained alarm like if the there was too little or too much powder, just a momentary beep. I've played with the sensitivity but it hasn't made much of a difference. 

 

Has anyone else experienced this?

 

It's not a big deal when running my 1050 manually,  but I just got an Ammobot and will be getting the DAA powder check mod'ed to work as a sensor for the Ammobot. My concern is this momentary beep will be enough for the Ammobot to lock-up. 

 

Thanks!

[427Cobra]

I just ordered one for my 650, I’ll be watching this thread 

[chevrofreak]

Move the sensor further away from the rod. 

[kmc]

I see the light blip briefly but no sound. My biggest problem now—and a showstopper—is I have powder sticking to the plastic plunger tip via I presume static electricity. It is making a helluva mess of reloading. This is not sustainable wit powder everywhere. Ideas?

[chevrofreak]

Wipe the plunger down with a dryer sheet.  

[kmc]

Thanks, I tried that but no dice. I still have powder flakes clinging to the plastic tip.

Edited December 7, 2019 by kmc

[kmc]

After further testing and some slow motion videos, static electricity is just a component of the problem. The other part of the problem is if I go too fast (what I would call normal loading speed) the powder splashed out of the case when the tip first hits the powder. The .40 cases are ~40% full of powder.

[kmc]

I’m getting closer and concluding there a basic design flaw in this DAA Magnetic Powder Check. Once you set the detector properly for a full case, there is quite a gap between the magnet and the plunger top (maybe 1.25”). This means the tip (they call it a shoe) hangs down 1+” below the bottom of the die at the beginning of the downstroke. Because if this, halfway through the downstroke, the shoe hits the powder splashing it over the side of the case, making a mess of things. I modified the rod such that it only allows the tip to drop <= 0.25” below the bottom of the die but still detects the powder level properly. It appears this has significantly reduced the powder spillage. Has anyone else seen this issue or another way around it?

Edited December 8, 2019 by kmc
Typos

[Sarge]

A light kit and eyeballs is all you need.

[kmc]

Just now, Sarge said:

A light kit and eyeballs is all you need.

Got both of those, still managed to have a squib!

[Sarge]

2 minutes ago, kmc said:

Got both of those, still managed to have a squib!

Must have been contamination or crappy primer if the eyes were working. I had a series of squibs this summer and all were S&B SPP. They were very weak

[kmc]

On 10/22/2019 at 12:50 PM, Hooked said:

Hi all,

 

I recently started using the DAA magnetic powder check and noticed that even with the die set up correctly for the amount of the powder charge, I get a brief "blip" from the alarm once out of every 4 cases or so. 

 

It's not a sustained alarm like if the there was too little or too much powder, just a momentary beep. I've played with the sensitivity but it hasn't made much of a difference. 

 

Has anyone else experienced this?

 

It's not a big deal when running my 1050 manually,  but I just got an Ammobot and will be getting the DAA powder check mod'ed to work as a sensor for the Ammobot. My concern is this momentary beep will be enough for the Ammobot to lock-up. 

 

Thanks!

I did have both beep and light blips before and after the top of each stroke but very short duration. Here’s how I fixed it...it took careful adjustment of the magnet. 
- using a case with the proper load, raise the case very slowly observing the micro-switch and where it enables the warning circui

- You'll hear the micro-switch click At the point where the warning circuit is enabled.

- At the point where it clicks, you want the magnet just a shade higher than the lower end of the sensitivity range, such that the light and beeper are both off when the micro-switch clicks.

- verify the overcharge and empty case still trigger the warning

Presto! No beeps unless you care-hopefully that makes sense.

Now, the bigger problem in my view is the spillage due to the low-hanging shoe. At anything but pedestrian Ammobot rates, this will be a BIG problem for you. Mine is pretty good after artificially limiting the downward motion of the shoe but this is a hack. I’m going to call DAA on the issue to see if I can get answer. FWIW, this is on my 650 with plans to duplicate on my 1050 if it works. Aren’t you seeing the spillage I’m referencing?

[Hooked]

12 minutes ago, kmc said:

I did have both beep and light blips before and after the top of each stroke but very short duration. Here’s how I fixed it...it took careful adjustment of the magnet. 
- using a case with the proper load, raise the case very slowly observing the micro-switch and where it enables the warning circui

- You'll hear the micro-switch click At the point where the warning circuit is enabled.

- At the point where it clicks, you want the magnet just a shade higher than the lower end of the sensitivity range, such that the light and beeper are both off when the micro-switch clicks.

- verify the overcharge and empty case still trigger the warning

Presto! No beeps unless you care-hopefully that makes sense.

Now, the bigger problem in my view is the spillage due to the low-hanging shoe. At anything but pedestrian Ammobot rates, this will be a BIG problem for you. Mine is pretty good after artificially limiting the downward motion of the shoe but this is a hack. I’m going to call DAA on the issue to see if I can get answer. FWIW, this is on my 650 with plans to duplicate on my 1050 if it works. Aren’t you seeing the spillage I’m referencing?

Thanks for the info on my initial problem. By shear luck, I was able to get the problem to go away through just playing with the setup.

 

As far as the powder splash, what I was experiencing was the shoe displacing the powder in the case as it made contact with the powder.  My 9 major load is 6.8gr of WAC so the case is about 2/3 full. When I first started using the DAA powder check, there was as much powder on my bench as in the case.

 

I turned down the diameter of the shoe and cut a couple of channels in it to allow air to escape.  It helped some, but ultimately, I just load slow when loading 9 major.  With you loading 40, there should be plenty of room for air to escape, so my mod isn’t likely to be much help - sorry.

 

If you hear anything from DAA, please let me know!  Thanks!

[kmc]

10 hours ago, Hooked said:

As far as the powder splash, what I was experiencing was the shoe displacing the powder in the case as it made contact with the powder.  My 9 major load is 6.8gr of WAC so the case is about 2/3 full. When I first started using the DAA powder check, there was as much powder on my bench as in the case.

 

I turned down the diameter of the shoe and cut a couple of channels in it to allow air to escape.  It helped some, but ultimately, I just load slow when loading 9 major.  With you loading 40, there should be plenty of room for air to escape, so my mod isn’t likely to be much help - sorry.

I was seeing the same powder splash, despite having more empty space in the case (>50%) . When I compared mine to a buddy's Dillon powder check there were a few differences. He is running automated and doesn't experience the powder splash. He had shoes that would change out by case size and they filled more of the case diameter than mine, his shoe was brass, and (most importantly I thought) the shoe only protruded from the bottom of the die ~1/4". Because the latter difference, the shoe didn't contact the powder until near the top of stroke and not long before the shell made contact inside the die. Currently I have put a ziptie on the rod above the plunger but below the magnet. It is positioned so the rod/shoe will go down far enough to reach the bottom of an empty case at the top of the brass' upward stroke, but no further. This has the effect of limiting the downward motion of the shoe to be similar to the Dillon powder check--protruding below the die ~0.25" vs 1.25" it would otherwise when the shellplate is fully lowered. This change significantly reduced the powder splash. I haven't looked closely enough to understand if this is because the DAA die/plunger helps keep the powder in the case or if the geometry/timing of the stroke somehow makes the case move naturally slower at the top of it's stroke...but the change has nearly eliminated the problem at speed. I'll see what DAA says but if I keep this powder check and this is a permanent solution I'll get a sleeve with a setscrew to replace my zip tie.

[JasonAA]

Here is another version of the splash hack.   Cut a casing or small hard plastic straw about an 1".   Raises up the weight, makes probe only contact at last minute.   I find it is easier to adjust sensitivity/range too.

[slavex]

will that still detect no powder?

[Bilbobaker]

On 12/7/2019 at 5:53 PM, kmc said:

I did have both beep and light blips before and after the top of each stroke but very short duration. Here’s how I fixed it...it took careful adjustment of the magnet. 
- using a case with the proper load, raise the case very slowly observing the micro-switch and where it enables the warning circui

- You'll hear the micro-switch click At the point where the warning circuit is enabled.

- At the point where it clicks, you want the magnet just a shade higher than the lower end of the sensitivity range, such that the light and beeper are both off when the micro-switch clicks.

- verify the overcharge and empty case still trigger the warning

Presto! No beeps unless you care-hopefully that makes sense.

Now, the bigger problem in my view is the spillage due to the low-hanging shoe. At anything but pedestrian Ammobot rates, this will be a BIG problem for you. Mine is pretty good after artificially limiting the downward motion of the shoe but this is a hack. I’m going to call DAA on the issue to see if I can get answer. FWIW, this is on my 650 with plans to duplicate on my 1050 if it works. Aren’t you seeing the spillage I’m referencing?

Did you get a resolve for the powder spillage?

[Graye2]

I recently got a 750 up and running (first progressive) and installed one of these powder checks.  Everything works fine except the majority of the time the plunger is activating the switch but not retracting on the down stroke.  It just hangs up keeping the switch activated.  Anyone else have this issue?  And if so how did you fix it?

[cool]

Jason AA your idea is excellent, I applied on my 2 EVO 45 ACP and 9 mm the rod only moves a few millimeters and I no longer have any powder projection.

I use BA10 for 45 and N340 for 9mm 147gr

[MNJoel]

On 12/7/2019 at 5:08 PM, kmc said:

I see the light blip briefly but no sound. My biggest problem now—and a showstopper—is I have powder sticking to the plastic plunger tip via I presume static electricity. It is making a helluva mess of reloading. This is not sustainable wit powder everywhere. Ideas?

 

Have you tried adjusting the sensitivity?

[kmc]

On 12/30/2020 at 8:39 AM, MNJoel said:

 

Have you tried adjusting the sensitivity?

If you're talking about splashing problem, it has nothing to do with sensitivity setting. I did get this to work and improved over the initial "factory" installation but ultimately abandoned it for two reasons: the powder splash was driving me crazy and using range brass with the combo seater/crimper die was not giving me consistent crimps.

[cool]

there are powders that splash more than others

 

 

 

 

Edited January 15, 2021 by cool

[kmc]

On 1/15/2021 at 11:41 AM, cool said:

there are powders that splash more than others

Maybe but I'm not interested in changing powders to accommodate a poorly designed powder check.

 

 

 

 

[kmc]

I figured I need to post out here again. Because of the entire thread above, I had previously abandoned this powder check and the seat/crimp combo die...maybe 10,000ish rounds ago. Then it happened. Through a stupid mistake I managed to run 35ish low-/no- powder rounds into a bin of ~150 completed rounds before I realized what I was doing. The problem is of course I had no idea which 35 were the potentially bad rounds. With the primer situation, I ended up disassembling/redoing ~80 rounds and and using the other 100 for practice. This caused me to reconsider and dig my powder check and die back out again.

 

I had originally abandoned this approach when loading 40 for two reasons: 1) powder splash was driving me nuts (despite the thread above) and 2) using a combo seat/crimp die with range brass seemed to results in inconsistent crimping. Subsequent to my posts above, I finally went back to the "watch carefully" powder check method. So here I am for attempt #2 and I'm determined to make a better run at it this time.

 

On #1) I've researched the combo die more and while others seem to be having issues, another set of people seem satisfied. I decided to spend more time setting it up, following the instructions precisely, and continue tweaking until I was completely satisfied  with seat and crimp. After far more tweaking than the first time, I have now loaded about 50 rounds successfully and the ones I tore apart to examine crimp looked good. I'll make up a few hundred and see what I find with consistency. It sure would be easier if Dillon had just added another station or two to 650/750/1050...

 

On #2) I'm still using my ziptie method described above though I also like the straw idea. This has made spillage on my 40 rounds more tolerable. When I switch over to run 9 major, I'm afraid this is going to be a much bigger problem. As a result, I'm also considering implementing a "splash guard" of sorts to see if that will further improve the situation. The idea would be to have a washer of appropriate size ride on the rod, just above the shoe. When the shell comes up and the shoe enters the brass, the washer might "seal" the top of the shell and prevent some of the spillage. I might given this a try, especially after I switch my focus to 9 major, where the shells are much more full...

[Sigarmsp226]

Guys - I am not sure what BE forum thread I read this in(looked but could not find it) someone much smarter than me suggested (after they tried it and it worked) taking the end of the DAA powder cop that goes down into the case and “roughing up” the small black plastic tip that makes contact with the powder inside the case. 
 

So I took mine off and took a aluminum finger nail file and following this persons instructions I made about three or four small grooves in one direction and then another three in a cross direction to rough up the end of the tip....I load all of my 9mm minor loads with 231 which is a flat flake powder and after doing this the amount of powder on my press reduced itself by 95%. I will get a picture of my roughed up tip and post it later today. Had grandkids in my lap right now and the wife is sleeping....Photo to follow...This suggestion worked for me with the 231 powder...Mark