Powder bar accuracy upgrade tricks?

[DIYguy]

Ran across a video by Knowledge2you on YouTube and as part of his video he had some tricks he used to allegedly improve the accuracy of the Dillon  powderbar throw. One was grounding his press and powder dropper, dryer sheets wrapped around the powder hopper, bench mounts, etc.

 

I've pulled cases during a loading cycle and weighed my powder charge and seen .3 to .5 + drift. Wondering what tricks different loaders are using help improve the consistency and accuracy of each powder throw.

Care to share?

[NuJudge]

Consistent motion of the handle is the biggest thing.  If you stop for awhile, pour the first 3 or so powder charges back.  

[ddc]

What cartridge are you loading for?

 

[Greg in VA]

Change the hopper to a Pyrex one.

[DIYguy]

Interested in the Pyrex hopper, haven't seen that one anywhere?

 

On the XL650, mainly loading 9mm and 223

[trickg]

17 hours ago, DIYguy said:

I've pulled cases during a loading cycle and weighed my powder charge and seen .3 to .5 + drift. Wondering what tricks different loaders are using help improve the consistency and accuracy of each powder throw.

 

.3 to .5!?  What powders are you using?  Granted, I'm a noob using my Dillon 550 - I've only had it for a couple of months and have only reloaded 700 rounds or so, and I've only used two powders (Longshot and Bullseye) but in spot-checking here and there, I've never had more than a .1 gr variance, which was pretty normal in the other reloading I did with my Lee Challenger kit setup.  I never load at either top or bottom end of the load data, so a variance of a tenth of a grain or so isn't going to be an issue from a safety perspective.

[DIYguy]

The .5 was with AR-Comp which is cut extruded powder. Switched over to H335 in the progressive for 223, use Power Pistol for the 9mm.

 

 

[ddc]

For 9mm that seems like a lot of variability. I'm on a 650 also and loading Action Pistol, Prima V, True Blue.

 

For Action Pistol my target is 3.5 and 90% of the throws I check are between 3.45 and 3.55 and occasionally a slight bit more/less.

True Blue is even better. It flows like sand in an hour glass.

Your powder can have an impact. Ball powders like True Blue will tend to flow more consistently than stick or flake.

 

I'm not using any "tricks". Just the standard 650 powder setup.

 

 

 

[DIYguy]

The variances I've seen have been with the large powder bar loading 223. For 9mm I think they tend to be within .1 but then om only loading 4.2g of Power Pistol under 147g Acme coated FP.

 

ddc: what scale are you using that measures 100ths?

[ddc]

2 minutes ago, DIYguy said:

The variances I've seen have been with the large powder bar loading 223. For 9mm I think they tend to be within .1 but then om only loading 4.2g of Power Pistol under 147g Acme coated FP.

 

ddc: what scale are you using that measures 100ths?

 

Yes that is a good point which I conveniently overlooked.

 

 My scale is a Gem Pro 250 which "reads" to 100ths but doesn't actually measure that closely.

 

They claim it measures to 0.001 grams which is approximately 0.015 grains. I would be happy if it actually measured to that.

[DIYguy]

Greg: Found Ward Lance at Dram Worx and just ordered the Pyrex hopper. Like the idea for multiple reasons. Good recommendation!

[trickg]

13 minutes ago, DIYguy said:

The variances I've seen have been with the large powder bar loading 223. For 9mm I think they tend to be within .1 but then om only loading 4.2g of Power Pistol under 147g Acme coated FP.

Ok - that makes sense.  As of yet I haven't tried to reload for rifle, so I don't have a lick of experience with that.  I'll keep my eyes open for variance in the future.

 

The Pyrex hoppers look pretty interesting.  From the Immortobot website, apparently the stock powder hoppers can corrode so badly that they have actually fallen apart for some people.  Do you know anyone that has happened to?

 

The only thing I would worry about with Pyrex is that it's glass, so it could potentially shatter if bumped a bit too hard by something accidentally, but otherwise it seems like a pretty nice upgrade.

[ddc]

31 minutes ago, trickg said:

 

... The Pyrex hoppers look pretty interesting.  From the Immortobot website, apparently the stock powder hoppers can corrode so badly that they have actually fallen apart for some people.  Do you know anyone that has happened to? ...

 

I have never heard of a hopper corroding and subsequently falling apart. They do get discolored as time goes by. I have 4 and they are from 3 to 5 years old for the oldest. All are discolored to some degree. The oldest probably has loaded at least 50K rounds and works just as well and looks exactly like the newest one with the exception that the hopper has more discoloration.

[trickg]

1 minute ago, ddc said:

 

I have never heard of a hopper corroding and subsequently falling apart. They do get discolored as time goes by. I have 4 and they are from 3 to 5 years old for the oldest. All are discolored to some degree. The oldest probably has loaded at least 50K rounds and works just as well and looks exactly like the newest one with the exception that the hopper has more discoloration.

I thought that was a bit over the top - I mean, powder is stored in plastic containers, right?  This was what was said on the website:

 

"Because many of the modern smokeless powders are more corrosive than the older ones. Powders like TiteGroup, Winchester Super Handicap and IMR 700x will attack the reservoir if left in and eventuality discolor and erode the plastic tube. Several people have mentioned that the Hornady plastic melts so bad they have fallen out and spilled powder everywhere."

 

I mean, ok I guess - I've seen powder measures yellowed and discolored by powder, but I don't really care what it looks like provided I can still see into it and check my powder levels.

[ddc]

14 minutes ago, trickg said:

I thought that was a bit over the top - I mean, powder is stored in plastic containers, right?  This was what was said on the website:

 

"Because many of the modern smokeless powders are more corrosive than the older ones. Powders like TiteGroup, Winchester Super Handicap and IMR 700x will attack the reservoir if left in and eventuality discolor and erode the plastic tube. Several people have mentioned that the Hornady plastic melts so bad they have fallen out and spilled powder everywhere."

 

I mean, ok I guess - I've seen powder measures yellowed and discolored by powder, but I don't really care what it looks like provided I can still see into it and check my powder levels.

 

hmmmm... interesting... I could imagine that certain powder formulations would be more damaging to the hoppers than others.

Plus there could be variations in the plastic used by the different manufacturers. 

My experience is limited to Dillon hoppers and I haven't loaded any of the powders they mention.

 

[Laxman2809]

Rheostat strapped on the Powder Hopper 

[MemphisMechanic]

1 hour ago, DIYguy said:

ddc: what scale are you using that measures 100ths?

 

I consider one drop on my digital scale hilariously imprecise, and won’t base any judgement off of that. I’m not aware of any scale in the $50 price range with enough resolution to accurately measure .01 grain increments.

 

All of my reloading data is recorded to the hundreths, as is the data lots of guys post on here. When you see that we’re weighing 5 to 10 drops and taking an average.

 

My target powder drop for Prima V might be to see 37.5 gr on the scale after I’ve dumped 10 charges onto it. Repeat that process 3 times and you really see trends.

 

For example? a consistent powder might be 37.5 37.40 then 37.55. Likewise, one that doesn’t meter consistently will be all over the map.

 

Edited October 8, 2019 by MemphisMechanic

[DIYguy]

"Several people have mentioned that the Hornady plastic melts so bad they have fallen out and spilled powder everywhere."

 

I don't know about plastic melting and causing it to fall out but I also have the Hornady LnL which is currently packed in a box.  What I found with the Hornady hopper is there is no mechanical fastener to anchor the hopper to the meter body. The body has ridges and the plastic is just forced into the body opening. I've had the hopper worked it's way up during a reload session and the hopper fall off the body and yah.... MAJOR f@@@!ng mess. I had to wrap duct tape around the hopper and body to hold it in place. And yah, plastic discolored so bad became dark, almost semi opaque. (slightly off topic)

 

I like the idea of the Pyrex hopper and the glass eliminating or at least reducing the static which plastic is notorious for. Thanks for the comment Greg, already order one, that's the kind of info I'm looking for. Beats dryer wipes!

 

Was contemplating running a grounding wire to the press and dropper body like Knowledge2you did but curious if anyone else has done this and if it worked.

 

Knowledge2you also mentioned using the Accutek (?) micrometer on the powderbar. Also curious if this really makes a difference.

 

I try and keep my hopper 2/3 full and keep topping it off to keep as constant as possible of a level. I keep the same rhythm for every stroke which is approximately 1-1/2 seconds down stroke, hold one second at bottom, 1-1/2 second upstroke and press and hold forward 1 second. Try and maintain exact same timing every stroke.

 

Others?

[trickg]

I guess I don't really think about it too much - maybe I should? I just figure that between the mechanical action of the powder throw, and time it takes to seat a primer on a new case, that powder flows into the powder bar the way it's supposed to.  I do like to get into a rhythm though, and I'm not a high volume shooter so it's a pretty relaxed rhythm.

[DIYguy]

3 hours ago, Laxman2809 said:

Rheostat strapped on the Powder Hopper 

Laxman:  Curious what a variable speed control strapped to the powder hopper is going to do to improve accuracy? Are you thinking grounding wire?

[Laxman2809]

36 minutes ago, DIYguy said:

Laxman:  Curious what a variable speed control strapped to the powder hopper is going to do to improve accuracy? Are you thinking grounding wire?

No and perhaps I'm not using the proper term, but I will try to describe. Imagine you could remove the motor and vibrating assembly from an RF-100 and strap that to the powder hopper. It would vibrate, and when you are loading Varget for example this vibrating should help to increase powder drop consistency by ensure the same amout of powder is in the bar every time. 

 

Seen some people on the facebook dillon reloading group, 3d printing a housing for what I described above (they did not butcher an RF-100 they found an alternative) and this 3D Part is like a ring that goes around the powder hopper and holds the vibrating motor. 

[RePete]

Just pick up an air pump from a tropical fish store, a cheap unit, and rubber band it to the powder hopper.

[Greg in VA]

On 10/8/2019 at 10:50 AM, DIYguy said:

Greg: Found Ward Lance at Dram Worx and just ordered the Pyrex hopper. Like the idea for multiple reasons. Good recommendation!

I love mine !

[Bmans45]

The medium hopper looks good. Holds 30% more . 

[Joe4d]

On 10/8/2019 at 11:49 AM, trickg said:

I thought that was a bit over the top - I mean, powder is stored in plastic containers, right?  This was what was said on the website:

 

"Because many of the modern smokeless powders are more corrosive than the older ones. Powders like TiteGroup, Winchester Super Handicap and IMR 700x will attack the reservoir if left in and eventuality discolor and erode the plastic tube. Several people have mentioned that the Hornady plastic melts so bad they have fallen out and spilled powder everywhere."

 

I mean, ok I guess - I've seen powder measures yellowed and discolored by powder, but I don't really care what it looks like provided I can still see into it and check my powder levels.

total BS,, My Dillon hoppers are over 20 years old, One on my 40 tool head, actually was left half full of tightgroup for 9 years,,, I loaded it, and it still went bang and hopper still looks fine.