DAA primer pro collator

[CHA-LEE]

My Dillon RF100 Auto Primer filler works like a champ and has done so for many years..........

[Dirtchevy841]

22 hours ago, MemphisMechanic said:

DAA, machine this out of aluminum, polish every surface, and charge $450-550 for one that works flawlessly when filthy.

 

If it’s VibraPrime or Racer-mag-pouch quality plastic, there’s no way I’d buy something for a mechanized task such as this. If it won’t feed 10,000 filthy primers without cleaning, it’s not fit for ownership by competitive shooters with 1050s.

 

Build it as well as the PAL filler, and I’ll buy one tomorrow.

 

Same here. That’s what I asked earlier in the thread. Why didn’t they use quality material and charge more. I would’ve paid more for one that runs 100% with quality parts and build. Glad they weren’t taking anymore orders cause I would’ve wasted $200 bucks. Cause I was all in with this and was hoping it worked out. Damn 

[doublealpha]

Hi all,

I thank you for sharing your experiences and suggestions.

 

We set out to design and manufacture an automated primer tube filler that could retail at $200 or less. Machining that, as some have suggested from steel or aluminium would lead to a product which would have to retail for at $750 or more. Our goal was to produce something affordable for most, not just for the well-off few. I am sorry if this has offended some.

Calling a product cheap because it’s made of plastic is just not correct. Plastic is a material perfect for many applications, and this is certainly one of them. Yes, it is a mechanical device, but it is under not stress and applies no forces and there is no reason it cannot work perfectly made of plastics.

And as some of you will now, this is not the fastest or cheapest way to make a product. In order to produce the Primer Pro at an affordable price, we invested over $70,000 in tooling. It would have been much cheaper to make a couple of hundred from machined aluminium and go to market for $750, but forgive me if that was not my goal.
Many are quick to criticize, some without any knowledge about materials or product design and production processes.

 

Yes – I admit the “tackiness” issue of some primers (which is really the only issue, other than the reserved primers solved by the V2 disk) was missed by us, and I apologize to all for that. But it was not due to lack of testing as some seem to think. In fact, ironically, it was due to very extensive testing!! You see, we had been testing designs of the Primer Pro and refining it for well over 6 months. And during this time, the many hundreds of primers, of several brands, we were testing with, were out in open bins, in the open air. As most of you will know – once you remove the primers from their boxes, its no simply thing to put them back….

So these primers, laying out in open bins for months – became totally dry. Some primers are tacky and sticky out of the box, but when you leave them out for a long time – they get dry. They then slide over the plastic surfaces without issue. That is why we missed the severity of this problem earlier on.

But frankly, even if we had caught it – a cleaning from time to time with Pledge or some other plastic cleaner or dry lube makes this problem go away completely. To spend a minute or so to clean the unit every 2000 primers is hardly a big issue. It wont even be that often for most primers. And may need less cleaning over time as the protective layer of the cleaner sets in. I have no way of knowing if an aluminum surface would have functioned better. No one has ever tried to handle primers in this way on other surfaces.

 

I have been in touch with a few dozen customers over the past weeks who were having issues, and almost all of them are reporting now perfect function when using disk V2 and some Pledge or other cleaner on the ramp and bowl.

If anyone is having an issue –  please try that.

 

And of course, anyone who is unhappy with his primer Pro, or sees the occasional cleaning as a deal breaker, please feel free to return it and use any other solution. I guess we will not be able to satisfy all.

 

As for myself and my design, we will continue to work hard to innovate and invest in producing products to better our shooting/reloading experience. I am sorry if we are not always able to satisfy everyone’s wishes and meet everyone’s expectations and material preferences.

 

I do thank you for your feedback, both the positive and critical,

Have a great weekend,

Saul

[MemphisMechanic]

Saul,

 

I will certainly say this: No matter what people might say about their frustration with a DAA product, a great many companies in the gun community could take lessons from you when it comes to customer service.

 

Edited January 25, 2020 by MemphisMechanic

[Youngeyes]

There is nothing wrong with constructive criticism of a product. Working together, the members have helped improve many products over the years including Dillon products. The responses however, are starting to get personal and attacking. If this continues the thread will be closed. 

[The Donald]

12 hours ago, doublealpha said:

Hi all,

 

I thank you for sharing your experiences and suggestions.

 

 

 

We set out to design and manufacture an automated primer tube filler that could retail at $200 or less. Machining that, as some have suggested from steel or aluminium would lead to a product which would have to retail for at $750 or more. Our goal was to produce something affordable for most, not just for the well-off few. I am sorry if this has offended some.

 

Calling a product cheap because it’s made of plastic is just not correct. Plastic is a material perfect for many applications, and this is certainly one of them. Yes, it is a mechanical device, but it is under not stress and applies no forces and there is no reason it cannot work perfectly made of plastics.

 

And as some of you will now, this is not the fastest or cheapest way to make a product. In order to produce the Primer Pro at an affordable price, we invested over $70,000 in tooling. It would have been much cheaper to make a couple of hundred from machined aluminium and go to market for $750, but forgive me if that was not my goal.
Many are quick to criticize, some without any knowledge about materials or product design and production processes.

 

 

 

Yes – I admit the “tackiness” issue of some primers (which is really the only issue, other than the reserved primers solved by the V2 disk) was missed by us, and I apologize to all for that. But it was not due to lack of testing as some seem to think. In fact, ironically, it was due to very extensive testing!! You see, we had been testing designs of the Primer Pro and refining it for well over 6 months. And during this time, the many hundreds of primers, of several brands, we were testing with, were out in open bins, in the open air. As most of you will know – once you remove the primers from their boxes, its no simply thing to put them back….

 

So these primers, laying out in open bins for months – became totally dry. Some primers are tacky and sticky out of the box, but when you leave them out for a long time – they get dry. They then slide over the plastic surfaces without issue. That is why we missed the severity of this problem earlier on.

 

 

 

But frankly, even if we had caught it – a cleaning from time to time with Pledge or some other plastic cleaner or dry lube makes this problem go away completely. To spend a minute or so to clean the unit every 2000 primers is hardly a big issue. It wont even be that often for most primers. And may need less cleaning over time as the protective layer of the cleaner sets in. I have no way of knowing if an aluminum surface would have functioned better. No one has ever tried to handle primers in this way on other surfaces.

 

 

 

I have been in touch with a few dozen customers over the past weeks who were having issues, and almost all of them are reporting now perfect function when using disk V2 and some Pledge or other cleaner on the ramp and bowl.

 

If anyone is having an issue –  please try that.

 

 

 

And of course, anyone who is unhappy with his primer Pro, or sees the occasional cleaning as a deal breaker, please feel free to return it and use any other solution. I guess we will not be able to satisfy all.

 

 

 

As for myself and my design, we will continue to work hard to innovate and invest in producing products to better our shooting/reloading experience. I am sorry if we are not always able to satisfy everyone’s wishes and meet everyone’s expectations and material preferences.

 

 

 

I do thank you for your feedback, both the positive and critical,

 

Have a great weekend,

 

Saul

 

 

I understand how equipment is made, and needs to be made at a reasonable price. Using the correct plastics to mold a part that is ready to assemble is a very smart move.

 

I wish my collator worked correctly, the ramp problem would be easy to solve, my problem was I could run the collator until it shut off and only get 3-5 primers to get to the ramp. I tried both disks and still no luck.

[ltdmstr]

13 hours ago, doublealpha said:

Calling a product cheap because it’s made of plastic is just not correct. Plastic is a material perfect for many applications, and this is certainly one of them. Yes, it is a mechanical device, but it is under not stress and applies no forces and there is no reason it cannot work perfectly made of plastics.

 

Saul,  I appreciate your willingness to engage with customers on this.  However, the comment above clearly misses the point.  Saying that the material used here isn't the problem I think is incorrect.  And referring to "plastic" generically, is like saying that all steel is the same.  It isn't.  The material used for your machine is not high quality plastic.  It's tacky, flimsy, and incapable of holding close tolerance.  That's probably one of the primary reasons the machine hasn't worked as intended for many of us.  There are other types of plastic that are more rigid, slicker, and can be machined rather than molded.  Maybe using a different/better material would have put you above the targeted price point.  But probably not by much.  And it certainly wouldn't have tripled or quadrupled the price.  Even if it cost as much as the Dillon RF100, that would have been fine for most of us if it were similar quality and 100% reliable.  I'm sorry this hasn't worked out, both for you, and those of us who are looking for a real solution to help with this task.  I hope you'll continue working on this and eventually have a nice product that works to everyone's satisfaction.

[HesedTech]

Shimmed V2, ran another 1000 and it ran like a champ with zero flipped primers.

 

1. Shimmed V2 plate.
2. Federal SPP
3. Cleaned inside of orange rings with pledge
4. Lubed the ramp with graphite.

 

My only complaint is the last two or three primers tend to not drop into the ring for collation.  Can’t have everything. 

It works better than the Franklin Vibraprime I normally use. 

[Matt1]

Do you yanks actually shoot or are you just professional whingers?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[dansedgli]

I'll have you know I shoot 3 boxes a month. 

[teros135]

2 hours ago, Matt1 said:

Do you yanks actually shoot or are you just professional whingers?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

Uh, oh - he's on to us!

[Youngeyes]

Last warning. I've had to shut down several non productive posts. I, along with other members, would like to see this primer collator succeed. If you have constructive input and first hand experience we would love to hear it. I'm sure Saul at DAA takes this seriously. I would not like to close this thread, but I will if certain members continue with their bad attitudes. Please reacquaint yourselves with the Forum guidelines. 

Attitude
Please be polite. Or if not polite, at least respectful.
No bickering. Regardless of the subject matter.
Antagonistic, offensive, or quarrelsome tones are not acceptable.

 

If you wish to complain or vent, please do it in an E mail to DAA.  If you have productive input, we would love to hear it.  As I said, LAST WARNING

[HesedTech]

2 hours ago, corny said:

I shoot 1k per week on an average.  This thing is not engineered well nor was it well thought out. 

I value opinions, people’s help and understand you shoot 1k, but I have to ask did you buy and use the collator or are just basing this on what others have posted?

 

youngeyes, I hope that’s not quarreling or being offensive to corny. 
 

Edited January 26, 2020 by HesedTech
Added comment to Youngeyes, moderator

[Youngeyes]

48 minutes ago, HesedTech said:

I value opinions, people’s help and understand you shoot 1k, but I have to ask did you buy and use the collator or are just basing this on what others have posted?

 

youngeyes, I hope that’s not quarreling or being offensive to corny. 
 

I can't speak for corny. If he finds it offensive It would up to him to PM you and discuss it. It's not quarreling to ask for a clarification of information. It makes a big difference if a person is talking from personal experience or is making an assumption. In this case, corny is one of the people who bought and tried the unit. 

[Balakay]

24 minutes ago, Youngeyes said:

I can't speak for corny. If he finds it offensive It would up to him to PM you and discuss it. It's not quarreling to ask for a clarification of information. It makes a big difference if a person is talking from personal experience or is making an assumption. In this case, corny is one of the people who bought and tried the unit. 

I know Corny and rest assured, it is going to take a whole lot more than this to offend him.  Regardless, can the majority of users objectively support the notion that the product is well engineered?  I have nothing but respect for Saul/DAA and their willingness to innovate but in this case...the Emperor has no clothes

[Rich406]

4 hours ago, Youngeyes said:

Last warning. I've had to shut down several non productive posts. I, along with other members, would like to see this primer collator succeed. If you have constructive input and first hand experience we would love to hear it. I'm sure Saul at DAA takes this seriously. I would not like to close this thread, but I will if certain members continue with their bad attitudes. Please reacquaint yourselves with the Forum guidelines. 

Attitude
Please be polite. Or if not polite, at least respectful.
No bickering. Regardless of the subject matter.
Antagonistic, offensive, or quarrelsome tones are not acceptable.

 

If you wish to complain or vent, please do it in an E mail to DAA.  If you have productive input, we would love to hear it.  As I said, LAST WARNING

Problem is, it’s doubtful the couple people have been rude have even read all 14 pages of this post to see your warning. 
 

There has been a lot of useful info on peoples experiences with different primers  in this thead, it would be a shame to punish the majority of people for the actions of 2-3. 

[Dirtchevy841]

Has anybody ran a lot and I mean a lot to where your taking it apart and cleaning every 1-1500 primers to see how the machine and the plastic is holding up to tolerances with all the screwing and unscrewing that’s being done. Just seems it can’t be good on the plastic pieces having to keep taking it apart so much. It’s going be interesting to see how much and long it will last under these conditions. 

[HesedTech]

4 hours ago, Youngeyes said:

In this case, corny is one of the people who bought and tried the unit. 

Before I asked I looked back through the thread and could not find an earlier comment from him about purchasing and using the DA Collator. Since his comment was so negative I asked. 
 

Maybe I received a newer version, except for the need to lube the ramp and shim the V2 disk, after 2500 primers it works as advertised. I held off getting the Dillon RF collator because of the continued issues I read about it and the fact it cost close to $400 didn’t help. 
 

I’m sticking with the DA and if things change I’ll post them in the future. 
 

Thanks

 

 

[Rich406]

32 minutes ago, Dirtchevy841 said:

Has anybody ran a lot and I mean a lot to where your taking it apart and cleaning every 1-1500 primers to see how the machine and the plastic is holding up to tolerances with all the screwing and unscrewing that’s being done. Just seems it can’t be good on the plastic pieces having to keep taking it apart so much. It’s going be interesting to see how much and long it will last under these conditions. 

I’m at about 11k primers through it. After a lot of fiddling it works, however I have to clean the primer slots ever 1500ish rounds or it runs too slow. 
 

I’ve taken it apart about a dozen times now and some of the screws are starting to strip out. I’ve tried cleaning it without disassembly, but I only get another 500 rounds before I need to clean again. 

[Rich406]

24 minutes ago, HesedTech said:

Before I asked I looked back through the thread and could not find an earlier comment from him about purchasing and using the DA Collator. Since his comment was so negative I asked. 
 

Maybe I received a newer version, except for the need to lube the ramp and shim the V2 disk, after 2500 primers it works as advertised. I held off getting the Dillon RF collator because of the continued issues I read about it and the fact it cost close to $400 didn’t help. 
 

I’m sticking with the DA and if things change I’ll post them in the future. 
 

Thanks

 

 

What brand primers do you use?

[HesedTech]

12 minutes ago, Rich406 said:

What brand primers do you use?

Federal SPP. They are very clean and normally almost no residue.  Load for Tanfoglios and CZs so need the softer primers.

 

 

[DD78]

Ran another 500 primers through mine today. I’m up to 800 primers through the unit without any flipped, and it’s running about the same as it was when I took it out of the box.

So far so good, but I’ll write more detailed feedback once I get maybe another 1K through it.

I’m using CCI 500’s exclusively with the V1 disk. I’ll be curious to see if it makes it to the 2k mark without experiencing the issues many others have shared.

Hopefully I’ll have some time on Tuesday evening to get another 500 rounds loaded after work. I really want this thing to work. So far it has but I’m still pretty far from the number others have experienced problems starting.

[Longhill]

Using Fiocchi small pistol primers with a height of 3.04.

No luck getting the primers to reach the feed ramp. 

I will try shimmy next. 
Anyone have any luck with Fiocchi?

[Hooked]

I’ve run about 5k CCI and 1k of S&B through mine. Haven’t had to make any adjustments since my initial set/tweaking. Have had 1 upside down primer so far.

 

My only problem is that I can’t get the last 10 - 12 primers in the bowl to go down the feedramp.

 

Have tried 150 Fiocci non-tox primers and they ran just as well as the CCI and the S&B. Small sample size I realize, but they seem to run ok.

[slavex]

I've been running mine solid since I got it., over 25,000 primers through it. Outside of the first few thousand, it's been a new batch of primers every time I do it (the first few I just ran the same batch through over and over). I'll a tube, dump it into press, continue. I've cleaned and lubed it twice, and the second time was just to make a video of how I did it. I do not take apart the bowl and disk to clean. Takes maybe 5 minutes to do the whole thing. Since lubing it with Pledge the dust from the Ginex and Federal primers doesn't seem to stick like it did new. Or perhaps there was something left on the plastic from manufacturing that made that dust stick. I know my RF100 suffered worse from the mighty yellow dust than even the priming collator on my Revolution. Not sure why the aluminum there is so hard to clean (the RF100) but it is a pain. At least with the Primer Pro it just wipes off.

As for the durability of the machine, so far with getting close to 30,000 primers through you can't even tell the machine has been run, the plastic doesn't look any different at all, no wear visible.