AZ1911 Posted September 11, 2019 Share Posted September 11, 2019 (edited) I am looking to start loading 9mm for IDPA. I have only loaded .45acp and 12 and 28ga shotshells in the past. But I have loaded .45acp for many years. Being pretty new to competition I would appreciate a little advise in where to start in my load development. I will be shooting a Dan Wesson 9mm 1911 single stack for IDPA ESP. Items on hand to start are: Berrys 115gr plaited bullets Berrys 147Gr plaited bullets Titegroup powder CCI 500 Small Pistol Primers Once fired brass Everything I read says "load em long" so would a starting be like 1.13 or like 1.16 and then plunk to determine correct length? I just don't know where to start. Obviously I would then need to check that they fit in my Mags (Wilson, Tripp, and Dawson). I will probably try different bullets later but the Berrys is what I have on hand right now. I am not too sure on the Major/Minor power factor as I don't shoot USPSA yet. So I am looking for a nice medium load to work up from. Something good for local IDPA matches. Any advise or help would be appreciated as the threads I get when I search specifically talk about Major or Minor and I am not sure which I should go with. I wouldn't think I would need MAJOR loads. Loading on a Dillon 550. Thank You, KJ Edited September 11, 2019 by AZGlock21 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrackCage Posted September 11, 2019 Share Posted September 11, 2019 Shooting single stack in USPSA, you would not be able to run 9mm major. I'm not an IDPA shooter but my gut says you wouldn't be allowed to over there either. Do you have a reloading manual? I would generally suggest you start there. For 9mm minor in USPSA, I was loading 147gr with 3.1-3.2gr of Titergroup at 1.115" OAL. This was a flat point bullet, so if using a round nose, you may be loading a hair longer. My power factor was 130 (minimum for minor was 125, so this gives some cushion). Yes, you can likely load longer. I chose an OAL that worked in all my 9mms. Get a reloading manual, start there and use the lowest load data. Don't just go off what you see on the forums. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GrumpyOne Posted September 11, 2019 Share Posted September 11, 2019 He can run 9mm major in USPSA Single Stack....he'll still be scored minor though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bench Posted September 11, 2019 Share Posted September 11, 2019 1 minute ago, GrumpyOne said: He can run 9mm major in USPSA Single Stack....he'll still be scored minor though. What GrumpyOne said...he just beat me to it... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hi-Power Jack Posted September 11, 2019 Share Posted September 11, 2019 Really little reason to reload 9mm with current prices. But, if you do, you want to try both the 115's and the 147's - see which you prefer. Some prefer the heavier bullets for reduced recoil sensation, but since you're shooting .45, you may not even notice. I'd load one bullet into an empty case at 1.13", and see if that fits into your mag, and does it Plunk into and easily fall out of your chamber. If it does, I'd stick there for a while. I'd shoot for PF around 130 - 135, or so - you'll find that pretty light, but it should knock down your steel pretty well. You can continue to reload those cases until they split or the primers won't stay in them …. If you have TG, that should be fine - I don't know how much you need to get to PF 135, but someone will be along to tell you how much, and try to talk you into using N320, but the TG is just fine for now. You must know about crimp if you're loading .45. You might be able to find 9mm ammo for $8/box - that's pretty good. Good luck with it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AZ1911 Posted September 11, 2019 Author Share Posted September 11, 2019 Thanks for the replys. Yes, I will use a manual to verify all information but sometimes finding out real world info from guys actually doing it can be very valuable. Titegroup it is for right now as I have about 6 pounds of it. I do understand that there is not much in savings on loading 9mm right now. I just want to. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
4n2t0 Posted September 12, 2019 Share Posted September 12, 2019 (edited) 1 hour ago, AZGlock21 said: Thanks for the replys. Yes, I will use a manual to verify all information but sometimes finding out real world info from guys actually doing it can be very valuable. Titegroup it is for right now as I have about 6 pounds of it. I do understand that there is not much in savings on loading 9mm right now. I just want to. How to determine OAL: Link *If your bullet doesn't easily collapse when inserted just use your press to incrementally decrease the OAL until the round plunks. Plunk test video: Link Load data: 3.4gr-3.6gr of Titegroup under that 147gr bullet will get the job done. Edited September 12, 2019 by 4n2t0 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arlin Posted September 12, 2019 Share Posted September 12, 2019 Please check all your cases and make sure you do not reload any stepped cases. These cases can and do separate in the chamber. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jcc7x7 Posted September 12, 2019 Share Posted September 12, 2019 Only thing I find with my PM9 is that it has a tighter chamber than the rest of my 9's/ I have to bump the crimp a little tighter for it Usually just past straightening out the bell I believe it's .377 and then they feed great. Power factor for IDPA is 125 to the best of my knowledge so any of the loads mentioned should be in the ballpark, it's best to use a chronograph to verify the PF. 147's are a hoot to shoot through the DW, front sight hardly moves! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yondering Posted September 12, 2019 Share Posted September 12, 2019 3 hours ago, AZGlock21 said: Everything I read says "load em long" so would a starting be like 1.13 or like 1.16 and then plunk to determine correct length? I just don't know where to start. Obviously I would then need to check that they fit in my Mags (Wilson, Tripp, and Dawson). I will probably try different bullets later but the Berrys is what I have on hand right now. Don't worry about the magazines, load the rounds to fit your barrel. Most of the time the chamber itself is the limiting factor on OAL, rather than the mags, even with shorter magazines. You probably know but if not - OAL is what we measure, but the important dimension is really to the point on the bullet ogive that contacts the chamber throat. Because of that, OAL numbers can vary a lot between different bullet styles, especially if you compare a flat point or hollow point to a round nose. The point of this is: don't try to compare to or match other people's OAL numbers with a different bullet, make your bullet fit your barrel. The plunk test as mentioned above is the most common and easy way to do that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AZ1911 Posted September 12, 2019 Author Share Posted September 12, 2019 Excellent information. Exactly what I was looking for. Thanks! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stick Posted September 12, 2019 Share Posted September 12, 2019 1 hour ago, Yondering said: The point of this is: don't try to compare to or match other people's OAL numbers with a different bullet, make your bullet fit your barrel. The plunk test as mentioned above is the most common and easy way to do that. This is we load 9mm. Make the bullet fit the gun an cater your loads to your gun. 115gr and 124gr bullets recoil more of a flip, while 147gr bullets tend to be more of push Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zzt Posted September 12, 2019 Share Posted September 12, 2019 If your mags or springs are new they will require breaking in before they will reliably feed long OALs. 1911 9mm mags ARE a problem. For example, Tripp and Wilson mags absolutely will not work in my 1911 Open gun. I finally settled on Brownell's 9mm mags. After extended break in they will feed JHP ammo loaded to 1.161" OAL. OAL has a direct influence on pressure. For a given charge and bullet, shorter OALs produce higher chamber pressures. Shorter OALs require less powder to make the same PF as a long OAL. Your reloading manual will specify the OAL the data was recorded at. Don't vary from that, unless that OAL will not feed and you have to load longer. The first thing I do with any new barrel is determine what my max OAL is, and the range of OALs that will feed properly. Load five in a case with no powder or primer to .010" lower than your max OAL. Then do another five .010" shorter than that. Repeat until you find the OAL that will not feed. You've established your range. Pull the bullets and pick a load within your range. The same manufacturer makes both the Dawson and Brownell's 9mm mags. Since you have three brands of mags, try your ladder of OALs in each to see what works. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
4n2t0 Posted September 12, 2019 Share Posted September 12, 2019 (edited) 1 hour ago, zzt said: Your reloading manual will specify the OAL the data was recorded at. Don't vary from that, unless that OAL will not feed and you have to load longer. Translation... The OAL listed in the manual is completely useless, never use that measurement, always determine your own OAL. Edited September 12, 2019 by 4n2t0 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
124gr9mm Posted September 12, 2019 Share Posted September 12, 2019 14 hours ago, Hi-Power Jack said: Really little reason to reload 9mm with current prices... You might be able to find 9mm ammo for $8/box - that's pretty good... Where do you get decent ammo that cheap? I mainly shoot 124gr 9mm (occasionally 147gr) and I can't find anything good that's $8/box Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cjmill87 Posted September 12, 2019 Share Posted September 12, 2019 Most of the big names (Blazer, American Eagle, Fiocchi etc.) have been around .17/round, maybe cheaper if you catch some sales. With some of the rebates earlier this year I was able to get Lawman 124s for around $.137/round. Just gotta do some research. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AZ1911 Posted September 12, 2019 Author Share Posted September 12, 2019 (edited) I will agree, I have been buying Blazer Brass for 8.49 a box. Just under 17 cents a round. Again, I am loading 9mm because I want to. Also, I think I can load it for around 100-120 per 1000 when I get my load developed and buy in bulk. Edited September 12, 2019 by AZGlock21 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AZ1911 Posted September 12, 2019 Author Share Posted September 12, 2019 I have my loads set to 1.135 and they plunk perfectly in my barrel. As well as my aftermarket Glock barrels. Crimp is .377 and slide in and out of my barrel as well as a case gauge nice and smooth. I pulled the crimped bullets and only a slight crimp ring and no gouging or damage to the copper plaiting. So far, so good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hi-Power Jack Posted September 12, 2019 Share Posted September 12, 2019 Sounds like you're almost all the way there … Good luck. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zzt Posted September 12, 2019 Share Posted September 12, 2019 6 hours ago, 4n2t0 said: The OAL listed in the manual is completely useless, never use that measurement, always determine your own OAL. That's just BS. You never load shorter than the OAL listed in the manual, because if you do you will raise the pressure. You won't know by how much. As I said, load longer if you have to for feeding. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
4n2t0 Posted September 12, 2019 Share Posted September 12, 2019 (edited) 3 hours ago, zzt said: That's just BS. You never load shorter than the OAL listed in the manual, because if you do you will raise the pressure. You won't know by how much. As I said, load longer if you have to for feeding. That statement in bold is erroneous. Again, the OAL's listed in manuals are completely useless. Edited September 12, 2019 by 4n2t0 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GrumpyOne Posted September 12, 2019 Share Posted September 12, 2019 Posting GuidelinesAttitudePlease be polite. Or if not polite, at least respectful.No bickering. Regardless of the subject matter.Antagonistic, offensive, or quarrelsome tones are not acceptable.No trolling. No alternate accounts. i see any more like the above, and several people will get forum timeouts. Play nice, or don't play at all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
4n2t0 Posted September 12, 2019 Share Posted September 12, 2019 (edited) 29 minutes ago, GrumpyOne said: Posting GuidelinesAttitudePlease be polite. Or if not polite, at least respectful.No bickering. Regardless of the subject matter.Antagonistic, offensive, or quarrelsome tones are not acceptable.No trolling. No alternate accounts. i see any more like the above, and several people will get forum timeouts. Play nice, or don't play at all. I've seen much worse on this forum which did not garner moderator attention, weird. I edited my post to be more straight forward, better? Edited September 12, 2019 by 4n2t0 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sarge Posted September 12, 2019 Share Posted September 12, 2019 Then there are those who don’t even own a loading manual.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AZ1911 Posted September 13, 2019 Author Share Posted September 13, 2019 1 hour ago, Sarge said: Then there are those who don’t even own a loading manual.... Well if you are talking about me I actually have 4 loading manuals. But thanks for your comment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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