Is there such a thing as an affordable open pistol?

[chgofirefighter]

While I may have a good career and income, I can't see myself spending 6k in an open gun, let alone a custom build one.  Is there such a thing as an "affordable" open pistol?  Right now I am looking to dive into the Open Division, I've been shooting CO for 2 years and it's time for a change.  So far I've looked into the pre owned market but I don't like the fact that a previous firearm may have been abused and not truly cared for.  Plus the fact that you don't truly know how many rounds the barrel has or whatever other issues it may have.  My budget right now is under 4k, preferably $3500 give or take, STI DVC O cost me about $3400 directlly from STI due to my discount and I've also looked into the CZ Czchmate option for around $2700.  I already shoot a CZ Shadow 2 in the CO division so I'm familiar with STI's but I had a friend who used to own one and he decided to sell it and go for a 2011 instead.  So I don't truly know what that means but ever since he got a custom 2011 gun made he has encountered nothing but issues when his CZ had none...  I've also looked in the SPS Vista Pantera 2011 which cost about 2k but there isn't much info out there on it...

 

Any other recommendations?  I already have an open holster from DAA and a few shooting rigs so that's covered.  Just need the pistol, mags and I'm diving in!!  So what do you guys recommend or advise me to do or look at?  

[rancher5]

I got a perfectly great Parrot Open gun, people our interested in but won't make an offer ,granted it's in Classified section though I was slow to post Picts ,I've shot Max 4x's up to 1000 rounds total, with the non-comped setup, Not one marr or blemish, So theres that.


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[bigbob21]

Everyone has their opinions on which factory style Open gun is the best/their favorite...
It's going to be hard to convince you, as its personal preference to a certain point. i.e. tanfo/cz grip shape vs 2011 style shape 

 

A good idea tho, if your just getting into Open is: buy used. Dings on the gun don't mean much for performance and from what people say on Enos, barrels can easily see 100k shots before noticeable accuracy issues creep up.
You can find deals on enos every so often. A buddy of mine sold an STI (well used but functioning great) with 4 mags and 2 barrels and an older DAA holster for somewhere near 2000$
That's the type of deal you might want to look into in my opinion.

Also, if your not a tinkerer, new to 2011s, and/or you get frustrated easily: from what I've seen 38supercomp seems to give less problems compared to 9mm major (this is a generalization and from my experience with new guns straight from reputable builders). 9mm casings are finicky and it's been recommended by many people to find the brand that works for your gun and only shoot those. (which is hard to do if you plan on using range pickup brass)

 

goodluck

 

Edited August 21, 2019 by bigbob21

[rancher5]

I got a perfectly great Parrot Open gun, people our interested in but won't make an offer ,granted it's in Classified section though I was slow to post Picts ,I've shot Max 4x's up to 1000 rounds total, with the non-comped setup, Not one marr or blemish, So theres that.


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Pic , for grins

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[gianmarko]

define "affordable"?

[chgofirefighter]

4 minutes ago, rancher5 said:

I got a perfectly great Parrot Open gun, people our interested in but won't make an offer ,granted it's in Classified section though I was slow to post Picts ,I've shot Max 4x's up to 1000 rounds total, with the non-comped setup, Not one marr or blemish, So theres that.


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Thanks,  check your pm~  
 

 

[chgofirefighter]

2 minutes ago, gianmarko said:

define "affordable"?

Read my post, anywhere between 4k and less!  smh 

[Rnlinebacker]

While I may have a good career and income, I can't see myself spending 6k in an open gun, let alone a custom build one.  Is there such a thing as an "affordable" open pistol?  Right now I am looking to dive into the Open Division, I've been shooting CO for 2 years and it's time for a change.  So far I've looked into the pre owned market but I don't like the fact that a previous firearm may have been abused and not truly cared for.  Plus the fact that you don't truly know how many rounds the barrel has or whatever other issues it may have.  My budget right now is under 4k, preferably $3500 give or take, STI DVC O cost me about $3400 directlly from STI due to my discount and I've also looked into the CZ Czchmate option for around $2700.  I already shoot a CZ Shadow 2 in the CO division so I'm familiar with STI's but I had a friend who used to own one and he decided to sell it and go for a 2011 instead.  So I don't truly know what that means but ever since he got a custom 2011 gun made he has encountered nothing but issues when his CZ had none...  I've also looked in the SPS Vista Pantera 2011 which cost about 2k but there isn't much info out there on it...

 

Any other recommendations?  I already have an open holster from DAA and a few shooting rigs so that's covered.  Just need the pistol, mags and I'm diving in!!  So what do you guys recommend or advise me to do or look at?  

I shoot 2011s in Limited and love the way it fits my hands. However, in open the Czechmate it's a great platform and/or the Tanfo open guns. It fits my hands comfortably as well. Price is reasonable, mags affordable and for the price you could eventually afford another on one which could be your match gun. Get the barrel reamed so you can load longer.

 

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[chgofirefighter]

5 minutes ago, bigbob21 said:

Everyone has their opinions on which factory style Open gun is the best/their favorite...
It's going to be hard to convince you, as its personal preference to a certain point. i.e. tanfo/cz grip shape vs 2011 style shape 

 

A good idea tho, if your just getting into Open is: buy used. Dings on the gun don't mean much for performance and from what people say on Enos, barrels can easily see 100k shots before noticeable accuracy issues creep up.
You can find deals on enos every so often. A buddy of mine sold an STI (well used but functioning great) with 4 mags and 2 barrels and an older DAA holster for somewhere near 2000$
That's the type of deal you might want to look into in my opinion.

Also, if your not a tinkerer, new to 2011s, and/or you get frustrated easily: from what I've seen 38supercomp seems to give less problems compared to 9mm major (this is a generalization and from my experience with new guns straight from reputable builders). 9mm casings are finicky and it's been recommended by many people to find the brand that works for your gun and only shoot those. (which is hard to do if you plan on using range pickup brass)

 

goodluck

 

 

 

Thanks!~  I've been keeping my eye open on the classifieds and Armslist too 

[Explosiveo]

I've noticed that most people that buy a "cheaper" open gun usually buy a more expensive one within a year or so. Like your buddy.
So you would actually be saving yourself money to just go with a high quality 2011 out of the gate.
You don't have to spend 6k+ to get a custom gun with a builder who will stand behind it. There are a few smaller builders who are a bit less then that for their higher end guns
The can also build them for less with things like polymer grips and not using hybrid barrels etc.
I would base your decision more on what you get excited about and less on the amount of money.


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[Rnlinebacker]

Tanfo Domina facing left and Gold Cup facing to the right

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[chgofirefighter]

Just now, Explosiveo said:

I've noticed that most people that buy a "cheaper" open gun usually buy a more expensive one within a year or so. Like your buddy.
So you would actually be saving yourself money to just go with a high quality 2011 out of the gate.
You don't have to spend 6k+ to get a custom gun with a builder who will stand behind it. There are a few smaller builders who are a bit less then that for their higher end guns
The can also build them for less with things like polymer grips and not using hybrid barrels etc.
I would base your decision more on what you get excited about and less on the amount of money.


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Thanks there's a custom builder locally that one of my buddy had a gun built for him for around $4300 which isn't terribly bad but I'm still debating and researching for more affordable options.  Thanks again 

[Sarge]

4 minutes ago, bigbob21 said:

Also, if your not a tinkerer, new to 2011s, and/or you get frustrated easily: from what I've seen 38supercomp seems to give less problems compared to 9mm major (this is a generalization and from my experience with new guns straight from reputable builders). 9mm casings are finicky and it's been recommended by many people to find the brand that works for your gun and only shoot those. (which is hard to do if you plan on using range pickup brass)

 

goodluck

 

I’m glad you said that’s a generalization because it’s not even close to being accurate. 9mm ejects more erratic and that’s why you need the right mount/dot combo to run 100%. 38 is slowly starting to take a back seat to 9MAJOR .

[gianmarko]

2 minutes ago, chgofirefighter said:

Read my post, anywhere between 4k and less!  smh 

4k is a lot of money  so i would not  consider that really "affordable" these days

 

i would go for cz or tanfo, if for no other reason, because the amount of money you will be tempted to throw at the gun will be a lot less. 

 

[chgofirefighter]

Just now, Rnlinebacker said:

Tanfo Domina facing left and Gold Cup facing to the right

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Thanks are you selling them or just letting me know to look into them?  Unfortunately, Tanfo's don't have much after market support as CZ's or other 2011's but again, I don't know much about them.. or seen them in being used in my matches

[cecil]

affordable  is relative ..  there is a lot of disparity in the price of guns... you should decide what you are willing to spend … then decide if you want "bragging rights" or a pistol that will compete in the division you want to shoot … a 2011 platform will surely enable you to compete in open.. STI 2011 pistols are very visible at all the matches I attend.. check around with different vendors... prices vary considerably …  a couple of recommendations I may offer... when spending the price of these pistols.. shoot one to see if it fits your shooting style & its prudent to buy from a vendor that will service it.. open guns are definitely finicky … 

Edited August 21, 2019 by cecil

[Dwbsig]

I bought a used ck and have been very satisfied with it I think you can get a new one for under 4 k .

[cjmill87]

CK Arms has the "Solution" line starting at $2,750.  Again, as most posters have said, it's your own personal preference that can drive the price difference.

[Sarge]

2 minutes ago, chgofirefighter said:

 

 

Thanks there's a custom builder locally that one of my buddy had a gun built for him for around $4300 which isn't terribly bad but I'm still debating and researching for more affordable options.  Thanks again 

That’s the way to go. $4300 is a great deal if he agrees to stand behind it 100%. A friend of mine bought a used gun from a guy on these forums that “runs fine”. Of course it didn’t run fine and a very good local smith says he can make it great again for $1500. Only way I would buy a gun here is if seller agrees to take it back if it’s junk. And does so in front of witnesses. 

  I would spend new gun money for the peace of mind of knowing the builder guarantees it. If I bought a used gun that “runs great” and needed $1 worth of work I would feel I wasted money

[zzt]

Here is my three cents.  Buy a good, used 9mm Open gun and run it for a while.  When you decide to step up, you can sell it for most of what you paid for it.

 

If you want to buy new, give Scott at Hellfire Custom Guns a call.  610-247-0793  http://www.hellfirecustomguns.com  info@hellfirecustomguns.com

 

He just built a new open gun for one of the guys I shoot with regularly.  Cheely Custom frame, Caspian slide, KKM barrel with Binary Engineering Ti comp and all EGW internals.  $3k.  He does good work.  It will cost you more if you want to do real fancy slide lightening, etc.

 

If you buy a 9mm major gun you DO want a frame mount and reflex sight.  you DO NOT want a Slideride.  The mount has to be offset so the brass can clear.  You DO want to buy fully processed once-fired brass.  You will have no problems at all, at only 4 cents each.

 

If you are not locked into 9mm major, consider a good, used 40sw gun.  There are zero ejection problems because it is a straight walled case.  It is super easy to load for and pressures are below SAAMI limits.  You could go stupid crazy with PF and still not exceed that limit.

 

Good luck with your hunt.

[Bentsight]

Informative thread, thanks!

I'm just looking for an open 9mm for 3gun so power factor isn't really a consideration vs USPSA. I already shoot a 2011 so hoping to use same mags + a couple 170's.  Not trying to hijack the thread but will I need the same/similar build specs?

[B_RAD]

Ok.... Warning! Incoherent rambling ahead. I'm combining multiple thoughts into one thread but I feel like I might kinda answer the question?

 

I'd ask some other questions first. Because you're going to get a lot of suggestions for other paltforms. 

 

1. Is there a better option than the 2011 style open gun?

 

1.a. If not, how much better is the 2011 platform?

 

1.b. Are you willing to run a gun that's less advantages to save some money?

 

IMO, none of the other options are equal to the 2011 platform. The cz/tanfo guns are not equals to the 2011.  Why doesn't anyone here in the US run the non-2011 at the top level?  I don't know what anyone outside the US is doing but I'd guess the cz/tanfo is more popular. Is that because the 2011's are more expensive/difficult to get?

 

I've shot the checzmate and it's not on the same level as the 2011, IMO. I'd expect I'd feel the same about the tanfo model.  The Glock option is a joke.  

 

So, again I'd ask the OP if he's willing to accept a platform that's not gonna be as good to save money?

 

Once you decide what option you want to go with, then you gotta decide if you want to spend the cash. This may be backwards but you gotta decide.  

 

 

Now, to answer your question.  No. There is not an affordable option. Not when considering what you'd get if you went with the "budget" option. Thats like asking if you can build an affordable drag car?  I mean, you could buy Jetta and head out to the tracks but your gonna be disappointed! 

 

The top level shooters are shooting tricked out steel grip 2011's. While I'm not mentioning the top level shooters to just follow the crowd but I feel it indicates slot about what might be better gear.  Yes, most are sponsored and get free or deals on pricing. Though, they'd get the same deal on a plastic grip 2011's so, it seems to indicate they're choosing the options they like the best. My observations seem that steel gripped, middy/shorties with holes are common. I don't think the cheaper optioned 2011 open guns are on the same level as the steel gripped ones. These style guns are very pricey and are not what I'd consider affordable. 

 

Just my opinion. 

Edited August 21, 2019 by B_RAD

[Balakay]

5 minutes ago, B_RAD said:

Ok.... Warning! Incoherent rambling ahead. I'm combining multiple thoughts into one thread but I feel like I might kinda answer the question?

 

I'd ask some other questions first. Because you're going to get a lot of suggestions for other paltforms. 

 

1. Is there a better option than the 2011 style open gun?

 

1.a. If not, how much better is the 2011 platform?

 

1.b. Are you willing to run a gun that's less advantages to save some money?

 

IMO, none of the other options are equal to the 2011 platform. The cz/tanfo guns are not equals to the 2011.  Why doesn't anyone here in the US run the non-2011 at the top level?  I don't know what anyone outside the US is doing but I'd guess the cz/tanfo is more popular. Is that because the 2011's are more expensive/difficult to get?

 

I've shot the checzmate and it's not on the same level as the 2011, IMO. I'd expect I'd feel the same about the tanfo model.  The Glock option is a joke.  

 

So, again I'd ask the OP if he's willing to accept a platform that's not gonna be as good to save money?

 

Once you decide what option you want to go with, then you gotta decide if you want to spend the cash. This may be backwards but you gotta decide.  

 

 

Now, to answer your question.  No. There is not an affordable option. Not when considering what you'd get if you went with the "budget" option. Thats like asking if you can build an affordable drag car?  I mean, you could buy Jetta and head out to the tracks but your gonna be disappointed! 

 

The top level shooters are shooting tricked out steel grip 2011's. Yes, most are sponsored and get free or deals on pricing. Though, they'd get the same deal on a plastic grip 2011's so, it seems to indicate they're choosing the options they like the best. My observations seem that steel gripped, middy/shorties with holes are common. I don't think the cheaper optioned 2011 open guns are on the same level as the steel gripped ones. These style guns are very pricey and are not what I'd consider affordable. 

 

Just my opinion. 

^This.

 

Buy once, cry once.  

 

Affordable = Welfare Open = Carry optics.  

[Explosiveo]

Ok.... Warning! Incoherent rambling ahead. I'm combining multiple thoughts into one thread but I feel like I might kinda answer the question?
 
I'd ask some other questions first. Because you're going to get a lot of suggestions for other paltforms. 
 
1. Is there a better option than the 2011 style open gun?
 
1.a. If not, how much better is the 2011 platform?
 
1.b. Are you willing to run a gun that's less advantages to save some money?
 
IMO, none of the other options are equal to the 2011 platform. The cz/tanfo guns are not equals to the 2011.  Why doesn't anyone here in the US run the non-2011 at the top level?  I don't know what anyone outside the US is doing but I'd guess the cz/tanfo is more popular. Is that because the 2011's are more expensive/difficult to get?
 
I've shot the checzmate and it's not on the same level as the 2011, IMO. I'd expect I'd feel the same about the tanfo model.  The Glock option is a joke.  
 
So, again I'd ask the OP if he's willing to accept a platform that's not gonna be as good to save money?
 
Once you decide what option you want to go with, then you gotta decide if you want to spend the cash. This may be backwards but you gotta decide.  
 
 
Now, to answer your question.  No. There is not an affordable option. Not when considering what you'd get if you went with the "budget" option. Thats like asking if you can build an affordable drag car?  I mean, you could buy Jetta and head out to the tracks but your gonna be disappointed! 
 
The top level shooters are shooting tricked out steel grip 2011's. Yes, most are sponsored and get free or deals on pricing. Though, they'd get the same deal on a plastic grip 2011's so, it seems to indicate they're choosing the options they like the best. My observations seem that steel gripped, middy/shorties with holes are common. I don't think the cheaper optioned 2011 open guns are on the same level as the steel gripped ones. These style guns are very pricey and are not what I'd consider affordable. 
 
Just my opinion. 

Preach brother. Couldn't have said it better.

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[MikeBurgess]

18 minutes ago, B_RAD said:

Ok.... Warning! Incoherent rambling ahead. I'm combining multiple thoughts into one thread but I feel like I might kinda answer the question?

 

I'd ask some other questions first. Because you're going to get a lot of suggestions for other paltforms. 

 

1. Is there a better option than the 2011 style open gun?

 

1.a. If not, how much better is the 2011 platform?

 

1.b. Are you willing to run a gun that's less advantages to save some money?

 

IMO, none of the other options are equal to the 2011 platform. The cz/tanfo guns are not equals to the 2011.  Why doesn't anyone here in the US run the non-2011 at the top level?  I don't know what anyone outside the US is doing but I'd guess the cz/tanfo is more popular. Is that because the 2011's are more expensive/difficult to get?

 

I've shot the checzmate and it's not on the same level as the 2011, IMO. I'd expect I'd feel the same about the tanfo model.  The Glock option is a joke.  

 

So, again I'd ask the OP if he's willing to accept a platform that's not gonna be as good to save money?

 

Once you decide what option you want to go with, then you gotta decide if you want to spend the cash. This may be backwards but you gotta decide.  

 

 

Now, to answer your question.  No. There is not an affordable option. Not when considering what you'd get if you went with the "budget" option. Thats like asking if you can build an affordable drag car?  I mean, you could buy Jetta and head out to the tracks but your gonna be disappointed! 

 

The top level shooters are shooting tricked out steel grip 2011's. While I'm not mentioning the top level shooters to just follow the crowd but I feel it indicates slot about what might be better gear.  Yes, most are sponsored and get free or deals on pricing. Though, they'd get the same deal on a plastic grip 2011's so, it seems to indicate they're choosing the options they like the best. My observations seem that steel gripped, middy/shorties with holes are common. I don't think the cheaper optioned 2011 open guns are on the same level as the steel gripped ones. These style guns are very pricey and are not what I'd consider affordable. 

 

Just my opinion. 

I agree with a couple small exceptions,  metal grips (steel or aluminum) are nice and they feel better in the hand than the plain square plastic STI grips, most are doing a decent job of fitting the hand as well as a CZ/Tanfo grip, that said nice and performance gain are not he same thing, I would be willing to bet that a timer won't show a metal gripped 2011 is faster or more accurate than a plastic gripped one, you may like it better (and I do like them better) but I don't think if your not winning with a plastic grip changing to a metal one will change that.