World Shoot Points Tally

[rowdyb]

looks like there are about 60 empty spots for pistol worlds and 14 for pcc nats as of noon sunday the 28th.

 

it will be interesting if that's only how deep they'll get into waiting lists. though i think pcc is actually open open for those slots....

[Dutchman195]

On 7/28/2019 at 3:40 PM, rowdyb said:

looks like there are about 60 empty spots for pistol worlds and 14 for pcc nats as of noon sunday the 28th.

 

it will be interesting if that's only how deep they'll get into waiting lists. though i think pcc is actually open open for those slots....

I know they approved some more people last Thursday, looks like they squaded. 

Would be nice to know where we are on the list

[JonathanH]

I got an email from IDPA saying I had been approved for the match and to log on then pay. I go to Practiscore and it says I have been withdrawn from the match, I go back to my email and there is a second email stating there had been a technical error and all applicants had been mistakenly approved. Talk about going from a high to a low in the blink of an eye.

[Dutchman195]

2 hours ago, JonathanH said:

I got an email from IDPA saying I had been approved for the match and to log on then pay. I go to Practiscore and it says I have been withdrawn from the match, I go back to my email and there is a second email stating there had been a technical error and all applicants had been mistakenly approved. Talk about going from a high to a low in the blink of an eye.

I would like to know how they are maintaining the integrity of the wait-list when from the outside looking in it appears as if this is a monkey screwing a coconut.

 

What a absolute cluster. I'm surprised they chose to withdraw shooters, instead of just calling PS and somehow make PS click a undo button. 

[JonathanH]

It really is a cluster. I still don't get how The IDPA "World Championship" was limited to 400 entries yet the USPSA Area 6 match a couple of months ago had just over 400 participants. Hell I looked up the numbers from the USPSA Nationals which were held over a week down in Fl. and they had as many entries in the Production division as the IDPA World Championship does in all divisions.

[Racinready300ex]

46 minutes ago, JonathanH said:

It really is a cluster. I still don't get how The IDPA "World Championship" was limited to 400 entries yet the USPSA Area 6 match a couple of months ago had just over 400 participants. Hell I looked up the numbers from the USPSA Nationals which were held over a week down in Fl. and they had as many entries in the Production division as the IDPA World Championship does in all divisions.

 

yeah the 400 number seemed low to me too. Area 8 has over 500 registered and it'll be held in 4 days vs IDPA's 5 days. You'll shoot just as many stages with higher round counts and you'll get it all done in one day instead of two. Really it's 3 because you need to be there a day earlier for the safety video. I can think of ways they could bumped that number up, but my guess is they didn't think they'd be able to fill it up if they made it big.

[rowdyb]

If they were gonna have a limited number of entries for a world thing the slots should have started at MA and worked their way down in classification. 

[Dutchman195]

4 hours ago, rowdyb said:

If they were gonna have a limited number of entries for a world thing the slots should have started at MA and worked their way down in classification. 

Why not DM?

[MemphisMechanic]

8 minutes ago, Dutchman195 said:

Why not DM?

 

Because he’s not a DM?

[MemphisMechanic]

19 hours ago, JonathanH said:

I got an email from IDPA saying I had been approved for the match and to log on then pay. I go to Practiscore and it says I have been withdrawn from the match, I go back to my email and there is a second email stating there had been a technical error and all applicants had been mistakenly approved. Talk about going from a high to a low in the blink of an eye.

 

 

[Racinready300ex]

5 hours ago, rowdyb said:

If they were gonna have a limited number of entries for a world thing the slots should have started at MA and worked their way down in classification. 

 

I wouldn't do that, but IMO they should give extra points to those that win whether  you win SS or MA or DC shouldn't matter. Number of competitors you beat in your division would probably be better. For example Rev DC shouldn't get the same points as the ESP DC. They could still do the participation points for everyone just make win points a bonus.

 

The problem with this would be that sandbagging is a big thing in IDPA. Basically everyone I know shoots a division until they win and get a match bump then switch and repeat until they get all their bumps. So you start as a MM in everything, win matches as MM get bumped to SS in all the divisions you can. Then repeat that by winning as a SS and get all your divisions up to EX. Then repeat and start working on MA. I know several guys who have done this and are now EX in all division and MA in maybe one and working on the rest. The last thing you want to do in IDPA is classify as a MA with out a bunch of lower class wins. I can only imagine the stacks of wood they have at home. But under a system like I suggest above this would only further encourage that behavior.

 

I guess that is a benefit to your method is it would encourage guys to get to MA as fast as possible and reduce sandbagging to some extent. It's really not hard to make MA in IDPA.

 

[rowdyb]

When I put in my points I did mention which times I was DC. Right now getting into the "world championship " is a participation reward. I'd like to see it be skill based. Best of the best overall.

 

Not some ss who lived in a geographically advantageous area to get match points. 

[JonathanH]

2 hours ago, rowdyb said:

When I put in my points I did mention which times I was DC. Right now getting into the "world championship " is a participation reward. I'd like to see it be skill based. Best of the best overall.

 

Not some ss who lived in a geographically advantageous area to get match points. 

I agree with this, I know of a couple of people who have a lot of time on their hands and the means to travel who shoot a lot of matches yet are still ranked SS and never even place in their classification at a points match. I think match results should factor into getting a slot for the big events ( Nationals, World) then when there are slots left fill them.

[Racinready300ex]

2 hours ago, rowdyb said:

When I put in my points I did mention which times I was DC. Right now getting into the "world championship " is a participation reward. I'd like to see it be skill based. Best of the best overall.

 

Not some ss who lived in a geographically advantageous area to get match points. 

 

I agree completely. Some form of performance based system would be better for a "Championship" especially when it's so limited in the number of shooters. But I know that kind of goes against the principle of IDPA. No performance based prizes.

 

I live in a great area to hit up level 2 and above matches. I got in with 14 points this year and 8 majors i shot to get those points I didn't fly once and I didn't stay over night in a hotel any either. I did crash with family once, and drove 4 hours each way to another. Currently I think there are 17 shooters from my local club that are in the match with more on the wait-list. Most of those guys have way more points than I do.

 

I know a guy who's DM in SSP and can't get in. I think he won Nat's last year and can't defend that this year. Seems silly to me.

[Dutchman195]

2 hours ago, Racinready300ex said:

 

I know a guy who's DM in SSP and can't get in. I think he won Nat's last year and can't defend that this year. Seems silly to me.

 

The the problem,

 

The Guys that dont shoot alot but are really good cant get in. 

[GlockCanMan]

I got into Worlds with 14 points.  A lot of money was spent on hotels and flights to qualify for this.  They did announce in advance that it would be on the points system, and I wanted to make sure I would make it.  While I don't didn't get any trophies, I made it possible for others to come in 1st place. 

[rowdyb]

It would be nice if the points system rewarded finish as well as participation. There is too much a coincidence of geography to get 14 points. Or count points for more than one year as well, count all the years in between World shoots. (which I think is how they did it last time....)

[GlockCanMan]

7 hours ago, rowdyb said:

It would be nice if the points system rewarded finish as well as participation. There is too much a coincidence of geography to get 14 points. Or count points for more than one year as well, count all the years in between World shoots. (which I think is how they did it last time....)

 

I actually had to fly half way across the country multiple times to get all these points.  geography coincidence had nothing to do with it. 

[rowdyb]

44 minutes ago, GlockCanMan said:

 

I actually had to fly half way across the country multiple times to get all these points.  geography coincidence had nothing to do with it. 

I didn't mean you specifically. But I remember living in a state myself where a couple years there was 1 match a year within a 5 hour drive time. One match a year to get points. 2 matches if you'd drive 7 hours one way.

 

I've had years myself where I spent 20 grand flying to matches. So I think I understand the issue completely. 

[Racinready300ex]

On 8/18/2019 at 5:13 PM, GlockCanMan said:

 

I actually had to fly half way across the country multiple times to get all these points.  geography coincidence had nothing to do with it. 

 

I mentioned above, I live in a really good area for IDPA. I managed to get 14 points without staying in a hotel once, and my longest drive was only about 4 hours each way. I could of gotten more without needing to fly anywhere but I would of needed a hotel. This is what Rowdy was talking about. There is no way I could spend the 20k he did traveling to IDPA matches. I had plans to travel farther, but my son came 8 weeks before his due date. So plans changed.

 

I think my count has over 20 guys from this area getting into the match, some are staff, one probably got a sponsor slot (or they make room for jr's no way he had the points). There are several more guys who could of easily gotten in had they wanted too. While I'm happy I got in, I still don't really like the system. I'm not really sure what a better system would be. Even if you gave more points for winning, people around here would still have more opportunity to win, giving us a advantage.
 

[rowdyb]

Start at DM and work your way down in the applications. Want to shoot the premier event? Get better.

[Racinready300ex]

18 hours ago, rowdyb said:

Start at DM and work your way down in the applications. Want to shoot the premier event? Get better.

 

I don't know if I'd go for that or not. I get it, but I'm not sure how well it would work out in reality. They want this to be for the people who actually shoot IDPA, doing that would allow better people to just go to Nat's and never shoot IDPA anywhere else. I can see wanting to discourage that, certainly from a business stand point.

 

Here is a idea I have, keep the points system but also give the AC's some slots to hand out to winners at matches. Then the AC could advertise that the winners of each classification of a particular division at a high level match will get spots for nationals. This would hopefully help fill the match, and put more heat in that division for all classifications so everyone has to earn it. Then do it again for a different division, at a different match. On top of that I'd say DM's should be offered a spot.

 

That could make the guys happy who want the better shooters at the championship. While still giving opportunity for even MM to earn their way in based on their performance. It could make a lot of people happy.

[rowdyb]

19 hours ago, Racinready300ex said:

 

I don't know if I'd go for that or not. I get it, but I'm not sure how well it would work out in reality. They want this to be for the people who actually shoot IDPA, doing that would allow better people to just go to Nat's and never shoot IDPA anywhere else. I can see wanting to discourage that, certainly from a business stand point.

 

Here is a idea I have, keep the points system but also give the AC's some slots to hand out to winners at matches. Then the AC could advertise that the winners of each classification of a particular division at a high level match will get spots for nationals. This would hopefully help fill the match, and put more heat in that division for all classifications so everyone has to earn it. Then do it again for a different division, at a different match. On top of that I'd say DM's should be offered a spot.

 

That could make the guys happy who want the better shooters at the championship. While still giving opportunity for even MM to earn their way in based on their performance. It could make a lot of people happy.

It does sound like sour grapes coming from me as I only got into pcc nats and not pistol worlds. So I can accept that judgement of my motives hahaha.

 

But to me, for something titles a World championship I'd want the very best people in there for sure. Take Elias' example. Crazy what went on there! Have two column system of applications. One based on points and one based on performance or classification. Take a name alternately from each list until match is full. You could submit either a "points" application or a "classification" entry.

 

While I would like to see the slot selection process changed from (supposedly) purely attendance based to one even 50/50 on performance and attendance I think the real root cause is they just as an organization don't have the capability to run a 700 person match. Which is what Worlds should be.

[Racinready300ex]

On 9/6/2019 at 8:59 AM, rowdyb said:

It does sound like sour grapes coming from me as I only got into pcc nats and not pistol worlds. So I can accept that judgement of my motives hahaha.

 

But to me, for something titles a World championship I'd want the very best people in there for sure. Take Elias' example. Crazy what went on there! Have two column system of applications. One based on points and one based on performance or classification. Take a name alternately from each list until match is full. You could submit either a "points" application or a "classification" entry.

 

While I would like to see the slot selection process changed from (supposedly) purely attendance based to one even 50/50 on performance and attendance I think the real root cause is they just as an organization don't have the capability to run a 700 person match. Which is what Worlds should be.

 

Really, they only had like 700 applicants, seems like they could of made the match big enough to handle that many people so everyone got in. As it is, Area matches typically support more shooters then thiw "world championship"

 

The guy who won SSP last year didn't get in to try defending his title. That's lame. Strictly participation based is certainly not the way to go for a "championship" that is for sure.

 

 

[TDF]

On 8/2/2019 at 8:07 AM, rowdyb said:

When I put in my points I did mention which times I was DC. Right now getting into the "world championship " is a participation reward. I'd like to see it be skill based. Best of the best overall.

 

Not some ss who lived in a geographically advantageous area to get match points. 

I know this is late to be bringing this up again but I completely agree! I tried to get in with 8 points and did not have a chance.