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Snausages32

3 Gun Trigger Upgrade?

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Posted (edited)

Hello,

 

While I'm still relatively new at this sport, I'm starting to fall out of love for my Timney 3 pound competition trigger.  It's great and all, but I've recently noticed the dumbest thing...  on my double taps, I'm pulling the trigger on the second shot before the trigger has reset.  I'm pretty sure it's just me not letting it reset, but I'm wondering if possibly another trigger would just be a better fit.  It seems like the reset takes forever and needs to travel a mile...  If I just need to practice with it more, so be it.  However I was wondering if anyone has some decent comparative experience with a possible replacement.

 

I'm only considering single stage triggers, something that has minimal take up, travel to break, overtravel, and reset.  Basically I'm looking for something to break like glass, move 1mm, and reset 1mm.

 

I've narrowed it down to the Elftmann 3 Gun, the Hiperfire 24c, Hiperfire Eclipse, and Timney Calvin Elite, or keep the Timney I have and just practice more.  The Calvin Elite 1.5 pound pull sounds a little light for my preference, but who knows.

 

Thoughts?

 

Thank you!

Edited by Snausages32
Added Hiperfire Eclipse

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Posted (edited)
10 minutes ago, Blockader said:

Get the best Hiperfire you can afford. 

What's your reasoning?  All 3 of those are around  $270-ish.  Price isn't the issue - it's 100% need for function.

 

Also, here's some data I've found.  Using the Timney Skeletonized as the comparison to the Competition (same trigger, just skeletonized)

 

Triggers-Stats.thumb.jpg.f4acb2f8606be4a4b23c0947525d457b.jpg

Edited by Snausages32

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The Hiperfire hammer hits harder than anything else and it has the fastest lock time. The trigger pull quality is about the same across the very top tier triggers, I don't believe any minute differences between them are noticeable in a match setting, only when pulling them slowly at home. So the added reliability of the Hiperfire does it for me. Elftmann would be my second choice, though. These are my personal opinions based on trial and error and what I see happen at matches, ie light strikes. 

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J. P. Would be my choice....but it's not on your list.

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I'd say Hiperfire.  As far as single-stage triggers, I have a Timney MPX, Timney Competition, and Hiperfire.  Out of the three, the Hiperfire is the only one I do not occasionally outrun as you are describing, therefore it is my preferred trigger for fast, close-medium distance shooting.  At the end of the day, tables don't tell you as much as hands-on experience.

 

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Posted (edited)

I have the Calvin Elite and love it over some 3lb+ triggers. The 1.5lb pull weight does sound uncomfortably light to some, but in using it I doubt you would ever light one off unintentionally. I can't say that it makes much difference at all in my performance though.

 

Splits don't matter that much when compared with target transitions. Stance, technique, and knowing how to build a stable position on longer shots are more important than having a hair trigger. 

 

My advice would be the boring keep what you have and practice. I've since stopped chasing gear in favor of live fire practice and classes. 

Edited by Adamj

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After reading everything and watching all the videos here: https://www.pewpewtactical.com/best-ar-15-triggers/...  That guy's splits don't mean anything to me, but watching the trigger pulls and reset offer an apples to apples view.

 

I think I'm looking more at the Elftmann 3 Gun and the Hiperfire Eclipse, or just keeping what I have.  Anyone else have thoughts here?  Thanks for the input above!

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I've been using a Timney competition in 2 different rifles for a couple years now and never missed a reset. 

I guess I just release my finger a little farther than you do. I dunno. 

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Posted (edited)
10 hours ago, kurtm said:

J. P. Would be my choice....but it's not on your list.

 

Agree, a JP can be set up to be super crisp, as in no takeup, minimal to imperceptible travel and no overtravel, reset is about .03".

Plus with hardened components, does not change over time. Does take some time to install and adjust. 

Edited by mpom

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I have time on all 3 triggers listed, and own the Calvin Elite and Hiperfire 24C. All 3 are top tier triggers and you will never see a difference in scores between them, so everything I say from here out is personal preference, not really related to a measurable performance advantage.

 

The CE is hands down the lightest and best for precision, and theoretically splits (more on that later), barely perceptible take up and short but kind of weak reset. Downsides are that I have managed to bumpfire it on long range shots when in awkward positions that make good shoulder to buttpad contact difficult, and the weaker reset seems to need more deliberate finger let off to get those fast splits.

 

The 24C feels kinda terrible next to the CE but its still better than most. The take up is long and squishy, the 2.5lb weight is great till you try the CE, the reset distance is longer. But my favorite thing about it is the very strong reset that does half the work of fast splits for you. Install is a little weird at first. 

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AR Gold also left off list and excellent!

 

Of the few you mentioned, agree that CE is nicest feel.

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I've never had the experience of pulling the trigger before it resets.

 

Hyperfire ECL and ELF definitely have strong resets 

I ran an ECL for a long time and loved it

Then I saw the Timney CE and got one ... that's been the one for me. I feel like it helped my long range also.

 

I'd add KE-Arms SLT1 or SLT2 to this list if you want a fast trigger. I use it on my PCC and it's got a great reset and can outrun my trigger finger.

https://www.facebook.com/KEArmsOfficial/posts/frank-proctor-shooting-running-the-slt-trigger-in-this-pcc-i-am-really-digging-t/1540253402771774/ 

 

Many of the gun shops around here have a lot of triggers on display - see if you can find a shop that has some of these triggers and go squeeze them.

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I have both the Elf and Hiperfire. I have also played around with the Calvin Elite.  The Elf trigger has the crispest, glass rod break off the 3. It also has very minimal over travel and reset.

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I also have the Elf, and love it.  As heiny said, great break and very positive reset, plus adjustable down to "oh s#!t that's too light."  I have mine set at around two pounds.

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Not on your list but AR Gold is still my favorite (very 1911-like, if that's something you want in a long gun) when properly adjusted and has a good fit with the safety.

 

For a stouter reset and a no take-up (aka no creep), a Wilson Combat TTU single stage fits the bill for me.

 

JP is great too when properly fitted.  Maybe a little less crisp than the Wilson, but it still feels very nice.

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Another vote for the Hiperfire triggers. Their the hardest hitting light weight trigger pull. 

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Posted (edited)

I'm open to the AR Gold

 

Considering most of these will have the same break (except the gold of course), I'm more interested in the reset distance/speed

 

Just now learning that they're adjustable - those of you who have it, how have you adjusted it?  (I'm having a tough time finding anything concrete on that - 1, 2, or some sites have said 3 different adjustments)

 

Thanks!

 

Also, this was sent to me recently:

Hiperfire 24C vs AR Gold

 

Edited by Snausages32

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If your missing the reset the Gold is unlikely to help improve this situation. In my experience it has the least perceptible reset of the triggers we are discussing, when I switch from the Gold to the CE the reset is much more definitive and when I go from there to an ELF or hyperfire its even more distinct. So if preventing trigger reset failures is your goal I would look at those.  I shoot the CE and the Gold because I am now accustomed to shooting all of my rifles <2lbs and those are currently my best options for those pull weights.  I have had to learn the AR gold the CE is a bit more intuitive for fast splits.

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It's not so much missing the reset, it's more the reset distance.  That's the best way I can describe it.  The AR Gold looks like it has virtually no reset travel, and that's what I'm looking for.

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Posted (edited)

I'm putting my AR Gold up for sale as soon as I get around to taking some pictures if you're interested in saving some money vs new/retail. Feel free to send me a DM. I've sold a CMC trigger to someone on here before also, and that went smoothly.

The AR Gold was my favorite trigger until I tried the new TriggerTech Diamond. The reset on both of them is pretty quiet/weak, but also extremely short... more short than anything else I've tried. They also can be set to about the same pull weight. I just like the roller design of the Diamond & the click adjustment for setting the pull weight. Plus, it has a taller than normal hammer, which allows it to work in my 9mm PCC with normal 9mm bolts, whereas the AR Gold doesn't (they have a separate version for AR10s and are working on a separate version for 9mm PCC ARs). I'd happily use either of them, but I'm willing to lose a bit of money to convert over all my ARs to use the Diamond just so I can have exactly the same trigger in all of them. I mostly like them both because they can be adjusted to be very light & they have the shortest reset vs any others I've tried. To me, a 1.5 - 2 lbs. trigger is much nicer than a 2.5 - 3.5 lb. trigger, which is where most of the market is.

I have an Elftmann (9mm version) also, and I think it's the nicest I've tried of the no take up/immediate wall single stage style triggers, like Hiperfire, etc. (much nicer than the drop-in CMC trigger, IMO), but it can't get as light or have as short of a reset as the above 2 triggers, and I think I like the 1911/2011 style really light initial take up of the AR Gold & TT Diamond a little more. To me, that 1911/2011 style can be just as fast (short reset), but is also better for precision since you can use that initial take up to prep for a shot.

Edited by avastcosmicarena

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Posted (edited)

 

Quote

Just now learning that they're adjustable - those of you who have it, how have you adjusted it?  (I'm having a tough time finding anything concrete on that - 1, 2, or some sites have said 3 different adjustments)


The top small hex screw on the back of the trigger is for pull weight adjustment. Clockwise increases spring tension on the sear. Counter-clockwise reduces it. You can adjust it while it's installed in a lower.

Edited by avastcosmicarena

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I've got an AR Gold flat-face, Geissele SSA-E, POF, Timney MPX, and Hiperfire Eclipse, and by far the Hiperfire Eclipse s the best trigger. The extra springs are powerful enough to force your finger forward and reset the trigger faster than the others, with a break as crisp or crisper than the others. The AR Gold is nice, but the reset feels perceptively weaker than the Hiperfire. 

 

The Geissele feels like a really nice duty trigger, and the POF and Timney, while nice, feel stiffer/grittier. 

 

Hiperfire goes on sale fairly regularly on Brownells, and I ended up snagging the Eclipse for only $200 from them. Having said that, I also wouldn't hesitate buying another one for any future build. 

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I went with the new Hyperfire Competition, (old 24C), on both my PCC and AR. Could not be happier, crisp, clean, and I don't think I'd feel the different resets under recoil, at my shooting level. Like the fine tuning of the finger pad and the positive repeat finger placement it gives.

 

Hope this helps.

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Triggertech Diamond is adjustable down to 1.5 lb total pull weight with clean, crisp break and positive reset.  Also 100% reliable. The one listed in the chart above is the old style, non-adjustable trigger, not the Diamond.

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