Jump to content
Brian Enos's Forums... Maku mozo!

Recommended Posts

Guess I was drunk when I took the survey? I seem to remember thinking that it was the same power factor as IDPA.

 

If only ICORE had this information posted ANYWHERE other than a survey that you can no longer access once you answer it.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
6 minutes ago, alecmc said:

 

No, it was an opinion on adding L6 Major division.  Scoring is the same as L6 and every other division, only difference between L6 and L6 major would be the power factor. 

OK then ... Thanks!!

I certainly misunderstood that one ... If there is no scoring benefit then yes ... uh ... no comment. :blink: 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The Survey needed more details.

I said no to L6 major even without knowing that the scoring was the same. 

 

I said yes to rimfire because there have been shooters ask about shooting rimfire at the local ICORE matches(when we used to have them😞).

I commented on the survey that while steel is a problem that can be addressed by any hit in say the circle of a pepper popper would count lots of clubs use swingers and other targets that are activated by falling steel this would be a problem.

 

Said yes to snubby but also commented on survey that what is the definition of a snubby?

A J frame shooting against a N frame 8 shot will not be popular.

 

Needed more info to make a decision and a thread like this to discuss it before the survey was sent.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
9 minutes ago, Bosshoss said:

The Survey needed more details.

> snip <

Said yes to snubby but also commented on survey that what is the definition of a snubby?

> snip <

Needed more info to make a decision and a thread like this to discuss it before the survey was sent.

Eggzactly!! 😐

When you read the question it was like something smacked you in the back of the head and made  you think ... "Hmmm ... why am I feeling they might NOT be talking about 5 shot J frames." 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, pete627 said:

Eggzactly!! 😐

When you read the question it was like something smacked you in the back of the head and made  you think ... "Hmmm ... why am I feeling they might NOT be talking about 5 shot J frames." 

 

I'm going to campaign for a 2" 627 with a dot. Shooting major. Because reasons.

Edited by matteekay
I forgot major!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I’d like to see a Magnum division,  44 mag and up!

 

not that I’d shoot it but it would be fun to watch (from a distance)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I used my 629 in USPSA a bit. It was fun, until one match when the classifier was "Can You Count" (2 strings of 5 shots, reload, 5 shots into close targets). Ouch.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
20 minutes ago, matteekay said:

I used my 629 in USPSA a bit. It was fun, until one match when the classifier was "Can You Count" (2 strings of 5 shots, reload, 5 shots into close targets). Ouch.

 

I'm getting to my happy place shooting an 8-shot in USPSA until last weekend where there were two stages with 3 pers and long stretches of movement. Afterward I was de-mooning lots of clips with two rounds left in them...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
6 hours ago, MikeyScuba said:

Looks like L6 is the way to go if you want a plaque at the next major ICORE match.

Probably, because we added that division when our numbers were thin and it’s just another way to divide up who we do have. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
6 hours ago, pete627 said:

I think a 627 w/ the 2.625 barrel would be perfect for this category (or 686 ... 66 ... no real advantage for an 8 shot in ICORE these days).

 

Since it seems such a rare occurrence to see a stage where there is an advantage to have an 8 shot revolver (except for saving a reload because of a mis-fire) ... the major scoring would be a game changer for the 625s ...

Anyone w/ a small caliber gun would have to kick up to longer 357 cases to make major and those are a pita w/ moonclips.

 

 

?

 

There is a huge advantage to 8 over 6, especially in icore. In fact that’s the largest difference the game has ever seen. We’ve talked about this 1000 times: from 2 shooters the same level, 6 round guns don’t have a chance against 8s. 

 

No one is saying L6 would become major, this survey is to add a 5th, 6th and 7th division. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The 6 shot guns at the IRC didn’t make up 25% of the match. Why would we want to add another? Or even two more divisions? Because someone already has the gun for it? 

 

Is anyone going to go out and buy a 625 that doesn’t own one to shoot this division? I highly doubt it. So we are talking about adding a dying division?

 

Snub? If someone wanted to go shoot 200+ rounds at the IRC why don’t they do it? Or a club match? Again, no one is going to spend 1k$+.  Shooting a 3” 627 minor or a 686 is literally no different than shooting a 4 or 5 inch gun. It’s not slower, it’s not harder, it’s the exact same thing with less sight radius- which has almost no bearing under 30 yards. 

 

Rimfire would be fine if people wanted to shoot it at club level. But they should have to take misses on activated targets that don’t activate. Hits in steel could be called fine- but if it becomes a full on division and they get credit for taking paint off a plate and it doesn’t fall, then you bet I want credit for it too. 

 

Icore needs members, not divisions. After members it needs MDs and fresh clubs. After that it needs those fresh clubs and hungry MDs to host majors. Focus on bringing in the people first, not trying to dig junk out of the back of our safes. 

 

The formula isnt isn’t hard to bring more shooters and bigger matches, just look around the country and the world, plenty of successful places doing it. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, MWP said:

?

 

There is a huge advantage to 8 over 6, especially in icore. In fact that’s the largest difference the game has ever seen. We’ve talked about this 1000 times: from 2 shooters the same level, 6 round guns don’t have a chance against 8s. 

 

No one is saying L6 would become major, this survey is to add a 5th, 6th and 7th division. 

Well ... some of what I said was in jest .. but ... I have a 5 inch 627 and I love shooting it ... AND ... it gets real frustrating when so often ... all you see at matches are the silly setups that go out of their way to over compensate for 6 round guns. 

The 6 target ... triple tap ... limited shot arrays ... stuff like that. 

At my last match one of the stages had you starting in a box in front of two targets (about 5 feet away) ... you had to put three rounds on each ... Then you ran about 10 yards and stood in another box and had to put three rounds on two targets. From the second position you "could have" put a pair on some targets in the next shooting area ... BUT ... you had to be "in that shooting area" to engage any of those targets (per stage description). 

The whole match they pretty much locked you down (by stage design) to keep the extra shots (in your 8 shot revolver) from being anything more than insurance for a "fail to fire",

That's what I see at ICORE ... Am I an exception??

Not the case in USPSA ... 8 shot is the way to go there (IMHO) ...  

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, pete627 said:

Well ... some of what I said was in jest .. but ... I have a 5 inch 627 and I love shooting it ... AND ... it gets real frustrating when so often ... all you see at matches are the silly setups that go out of their way to over compensate for 6 round guns. 

The 6 target ... triple tap ... limited shot arrays ... stuff like that. 

At my last match one of the stages had you starting in a box in front of two targets (about 5 feet away) ... you had to put three rounds on each ... Then you ran about 10 yards and stood in another box and had to put three rounds on two targets. From the second position you "could have" put a pair on some targets in the next shooting area ... BUT ... you had to be "in that shooting area" to engage any of those targets (per stage description). 

The whole match they pretty much locked you down (by stage design) to keep the extra shots (in your 8 shot revolver) from being anything more than insurance for a "fail to fire",

That's what I see at ICORE ... Am I an exception??

Not the case in USPSA ... 8 shot is the way to go there (IMHO) ...  

If I shot a match like that I would fee the same. But look at it from a completely competitive stand point- you can go full speed on all those arrays and have make ups in the gun. That IS the 8 shot advantage on those stages. 

 

“Fail to fire insurence” is also know as “my gun isn’t properly setup.”

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
The 6 shot guns at the IRC didn’t make up 25% of the match. Why would we want to add another? Or even two more divisions? Because someone already has the gun for it? 
 
Is anyone going to go out and buy a 625 that doesn’t own one to shoot this division? I highly doubt it. So we are talking about adding a dying division?
 
Snub? If someone wanted to go shoot 200+ rounds at the IRC why don’t they do it? Or a club match? Again, no one is going to spend 1k$+.  Shooting a 3” 627 minor or a 686 is literally no different than shooting a 4 or 5 inch gun. It’s not slower, it’s not harder, it’s the exact same thing with less sight radius- which has almost no bearing under 30 yards. 
 
Rimfire would be fine if people wanted to shoot it at club level. But they should have to take misses on activated targets that don’t activate. Hits in steel could be called fine- but if it becomes a full on division and they get credit for taking paint off a plate and it doesn’t fall, then you bet I want credit for it too. 
 
Icore needs members, not divisions. After members it needs MDs and fresh clubs. After that it needs those fresh clubs and hungry MDs to host majors. Focus on bringing in the people first, not trying to dig junk out of the back of our safes. 
 
The formula isnt isn’t hard to bring more shooters and bigger matches, just look around the country and the world, plenty of successful places doing it. 



+1


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Back in the beginning of the IRC they had Snubby class and most shot Open Snubby. Not a lot but some. I was going to shoot it as a second gun and built a 586 l-comp with a first generation Bushnell Holosight. The sight was as long as the barrel. Then it along with the original format and the shoot off went by the wayside. 

To make all these a new division would not be in the best interest but to make them classes to be recognized and only shot as a second gun could be fun.  

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
9 hours ago, MWP said:

The 6 shot guns at the IRC didn’t make up 25% of the match. Why would we want to add another? Or even two more divisions? Because someone already has the gun for it? 

 

Is anyone going to go out and buy a 625 that doesn’t own one to shoot this division? I highly doubt it. So we are talking about adding a dying division?

 

Snub? If someone wanted to go shoot 200+ rounds at the IRC why don’t they do it? Or a club match? Again, no one is going to spend 1k$+.  Shooting a 3” 627 minor or a 686 is literally no different than shooting a 4 or 5 inch gun. It’s not slower, it’s not harder, it’s the exact same thing with less sight radius- which has almost no bearing under 30 yards. 

 

Rimfire would be fine if people wanted to shoot it at club level. But they should have to take misses on activated targets that don’t activate. Hits in steel could be called fine- but if it becomes a full on division and they get credit for taking paint off a plate and it doesn’t fall, then you bet I want credit for it too. 

 

Icore needs members, not divisions. After members it needs MDs and fresh clubs. After that it needs those fresh clubs and hungry MDs to host majors. Focus on bringing in the people first, not trying to dig junk out of the back of our safes. 

 

The formula isnt isn’t hard to bring more shooters and bigger matches, just look around the country and the world, plenty of successful places doing it. 

This makes sense to me.  What are the components to the formula to grow ICORE?  

The growth is really the point, right.

Jason

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 5/3/2019 at 4:34 AM, Makicjf said:

This makes sense to me.  What are the components to the formula to grow ICORE?  

The growth is really the point, right.

Jason

Well, let me start with a question: What would make you travel to a big match?

 

Have you traveled to the IRC? Why or why not? 

 

If everyone one you ever met raves about the stages and location and the prizes they brought home from it, would that make you go?  

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Well, let me start with a question: What would make you travel to a big match?
 
Have you traveled to the IRC? Why or why not? 
 
If everyone one you ever met raves about the stages and location and the prizes they brought home from it, would that make you go?  
I've driven to a number of level 2 and level 3 USPSA matches. I generally limit my travel time to a one day drive from Colorado. I've never flown to a match.

For a number of years, the IRC was in California. I will not travel to California with firearms.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
52 minutes ago, PatJones said:

I've driven to a number of level 2 and level 3 USPSA matches. I generally limit my travel time to a one day drive from Colorado. I've never flown to a match.

For a number of years, the IRC was in California. I will not travel to California with firearms.

Why? Not a single law against it. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted (edited)
15 hours ago, MWP said:

Well, let me start with a question: What would make you travel to a big match?

 

Have you traveled to the IRC? Why or why not? 

 

If everyone one you ever met raves about the stages and location and the prizes they brought home from it, would that make you go?  

I've got a story for you!

    I decided last August I'd be attending the 2018 IRC:  I signed up, snail mailed my ICORE renewal, bought my plane tickets and reserved a room.  I was really excited, as I'd never attended any major match, let alone one dedicated to revolvers!   I upped my dry fire time, and attended every local match I could locate (USPSA, IDPA wild cat USPSAish). Late in August I broke 95% hi average for USPSA.  One of my personal goals met, I was stoked to go compete with other revo shooters!  

  September 12, while working on the right hind foot of a sedated Fresian mare, she snapped awake, exploded and kicked me in my right lateral chest.  I simply could not breathe.  The ER radiographed my ribs and stuck me in a CT machine.  My ribs were badly bruised and my diaphragm had gone spastic, but the CT revealed a 5 centimeter renal cell carcinoma in my right kidney.  Once the shock wore off, we scheduled a nephrectomy for Oct 12....so I could attend the IRC.  Me and my short breathed, bruised ribbed, cancerous kidneyed self kept preparing, though a bit more gingerly.  The Sunday before I flew out, on the 5th stage of the day, my yoke "v" notched and simply fell out of the revolver during a reload...  I discovered that the yoke form my 610 would work.  The cylinder required a hammer to open it, the alignment was off, and my revolver was now a lead spitting pattern shooter, but I boarded the plane.  I honestly expected to crash.

   I survived the flight, but the combination of short winded, bruised ribbed, psychologically shocked with a revolver which wouldn't open and shot unpredictably ( about 6 inches at 15 yards offhand) resulted in a predictably mediocre shooting performance.  However, the experience of shooting with passionate and like minded individuals was all I could have hoped ! 

I'd place prizes pretty low on the list.  However, I'm pretty self motivated to meet my own imposed goals.   The greatest benefit of the IRC, IMO, is shooting with other revo shooters and getting to share the range with the best of the best.   That is why I would, did and will continue to attend!

Jason

 

Edited by Makicjf
spelling

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
6 hours ago, Makicjf said:

I've got a story for you!

    I decided last August I'd be attending the 2018 IRC:  I signed up, snail mailed my ICORE renewal, bought my plane tickets and reserved a room.  I was really excited, as I'd never attended any major match, let alone one dedicated to revolvers!   I upped my dry fire time, and attended every local match I could locate (USPSA, IDPA wild cat USPSAish). Late in August I broke 95% hi average for USPSA.  One of my personal goals met, I was stoked to go compete with other revo shooters!  

  September 12, while working on the right hind foot of a sedated Fresian mare, she snapped awake, exploded and kicked me in my right lateral chest.  I simply could not breathe.  The ER radiographed my ribs and stuck me in a CT machine.  My ribs were badly bruised and my diaphragm had gone spastic, but the CT revealed a 5 centimeter renal cell carcinoma in my right kidney.  Once the shock wore off, we scheduled a nephrectomy for Oct 12....so I could attend the IRC.  Me and my short breathed, bruised ribbed, cancerous kidneyed self kept preparing, though a bit more gingerly.  The Sunday before I flew out, on the 5th stage of the day, my yoke "v" notched and simply fell out of the revolver during a reload...  I discovered that the yoke form my 610 would work.  The cylinder required a hammer to open it, the alignment was off, and my revolver was now a lead spitting pattern shooter, but I boarded the plane.  I honestly expected to crash.

   I survived the flight, but the combination of short winded, bruised ribbed, psychologically shocked with a revolver which wouldn't open and shot unpredictably ( about 6 inches at 15 yards offhand) resulted in a predictably mediocre shooting performance.  However, the experience of shooting with passionate and like minded individuals was all I could have hoped ! 

I'd place prizes pretty low on the list.  However, I'm pretty self motivated to meet my own imposed goals.   The greatest benefit of the IRC, IMO, is shooting with other revo shooters and getting to share the range with the best of the best.   That is why I would, did and will continue to attend!

Jason

 

Hope the chest has healed and the Kidneys are flushing again.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, pskys2 said:

Hope the chest has healed and the Kidneys are flushing again.

Thanks!  That horse saved my life.Yes sir, my ribs are much better.  The kidney, and the tumor which resided within are gone, as well.  

My 627 is operational, with a "spare" in the works

Registering for the IRC this week!

Jason

Edited by Makicjf

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On ‎5‎/‎2‎/‎2019 at 8:26 PM, MWP said:

Probably, because we added that division when our numbers were thin and it’s just another way to divide up who we do have. 

 

Actually, L6 was added purely to accommodate ditching the old "6-round neutral" requirement for stage design.  I was part of the board's conversation at the time, and although I had no particular desire to split the participants further, I was strongly in favor of allowing broader course design.  ICORE matches no longer require 6-round neutral stages, and match directors who continue in the old ways are missing the boat.  

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
15 hours ago, Carmoney said:

 

Actually, L6 was added purely to accommodate ditching the old "6-round neutral" requirement for stage design.  I was part of the board's conversation at the time, and although I had no particular desire to split the participants further, I was strongly in favor of allowing broader course design.  ICORE matches no longer require 6-round neutral stages, and match directors who continue in the old ways are missing the boat.  

 

I’m in favor of ditching the 6 round neutral rule. 

 

But it to be honest, if you knowingly showed up to a match with a limited gun that only had 6 rounds you knew you were at a disadvantage. 

 

Hey guys don’t get me wrong, I’m 100% for bringing more revolvers out to play, I just think we should protect what we have first, then grow our membership before we start to look at more divisions. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.


×
×
  • Create New...