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Rudukai13

Laugo Arms Alien approved for IPSC Production

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Sights do not lift much since push is backwards not upwards... Sightpicture you have to get used to... But... liked it lot's and most did!!

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A production gun for the cost of an open gun? No thanks. 

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40 minutes ago, Matt1911 said:

A production gun for the cost of an open gun? No thanks. 

 

Wait until they license the design to a larger manufacturer like they did with the Scorpion EVO. Mass production by a company capable of it will bring the price down to be competitive with the Shadow 2, Q5 SF, Tanfoglio, and other competition-specific metal-frame production guns.

 

At least if they’re smart they’ll license the design to another manufacturer. I’m sure plenty would jump at the chance. The negative bore-axis and non-reciprocating sight rail represents the next true leap forward in handgun design philosophy.

 

Particularly as it concerns the sights; Non-reciprocating red dots are the near future of both competition and defensive pistols, I guarantee it

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1 hour ago, Rudukai13 said:

 

Non-reciprocating red dots are the near future of both competition and defensive pistols, I guarantee it

They have done pretty well for the last 29 years... 😉

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38 minutes ago, ChuckS said:

They have done pretty well for the last 29 years... 😉

 

I should’ve been more clear - I know frame-mounted optics have dominated in Open division competition for a very long time now. What I was implying was that I firmly believe non-reciprocating optics will be the next design component/philosophy to make the jump from competition pistols to more defensive/duty/carry-oriented handguns

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On 7/14/2019 at 5:38 PM, Fasthenk65 said:

Tested it in Czech... Liked it!!! Much.

Can you please elaborate on this?  What did you like, didn't you like, what was different, could you compare the feel or recoil to anything?

 

Thanks!

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9 hours ago, Snausages32 said:

Can you please elaborate on this?  What did you like, didn't you like, what was different, could you compare the feel or recoil to anything?

 

Thanks!

Pff already some time back, I try.

 

Gun recalls with a push instead of muzzle going up. This is the most remarkable thing.

 

I was able to shoot a Xmas tree faster then ever before (though I had to get used to sight picture, fs looks low is you are used to Shadow 2 etc.) this was with factory S&B 124 gn ammo so quite hard..

 

+ Grip is amongst the best ever, liked it, lot's

 

+ Trigger is good and was set at 3 lbs for production class (factory can make it lighter / heavier) break was crisp, liked it.

 

Most shooters who tried it cam back from training area with a big smile.

 

Hope this helps.

regards

 

 

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As stated above, if licensed o a company with resources the price will get down to 2k or less. The technology is not new in any regard. The gas system predates the HK P7. The top mounted hammer and mid mounted barrel with top-rib-mounted sights was were features of the Russian IZH35M Olympic target pistol, and several others that copied it. The features have been proven. Hopefully the gun has an effective heat sink to keep heat from the gas chamber away from the grip, trigger guard, and trigger in sustained fire on hot days. That is an issue in the P7,somewhat corrected the P8, P13.

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I didn't notice any improvement compared to my Shadow2, but I tried it with factory rounds, and it may be a huge difference (it was for me). I normally shoot 130/135 PF rounds (124 grains)

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The feature that IPSC, and probably USPSA, hangs their hat on to justify approving the Alien for Production Division is the Trigger Safety.  It has to move before any other ignition part moves, which the officials deem as being "Double Action".  The Springfield XD line of pistols are striker fired, but fully "cocked', unlike a Glock which is only partially cocked, but because the XD has a little trigger safety that has to move ever so slightly first, it was deemed to be Double Action, and thus approved for Production.  So the Alien won't be the first Single Action Only pistol approved for Production Division.  I will purchase one the day one lands in the USA, and will shoot it in L10 until it's approved for Production Division.

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12 hours ago, GlockJockey said:

The feature that IPSC, and probably USPSA, hangs their hat on to justify approving the Alien for Production Division is the Trigger Safety.  It has to move before any other ignition part moves, which the officials deem as being "Double Action".  The Springfield XD line of pistols are striker fired, but fully "cocked', unlike a Glock which is only partially cocked, but because the XD has a little trigger safety that has to move ever so slightly first, it was deemed to be Double Action, and thus approved for Production.  So the Alien won't be the first Single Action Only pistol approved for Production Division.  I will purchase one the day one lands in the USA, and will shoot it in L10 until it's approved for Production Division.

 

Somebody should design a 2011 trigger with a hinged tab then. “What? It’s double-action now!”

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ATF considers the XD to be 'single action', FWIW.

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14 hours ago, GlockJockey said:

The feature that IPSC, and probably USPSA, hangs their hat on to justify approving the Alien for Production Division is the Trigger Safety.  It has to move before any other ignition part moves, which the officials deem as being "Double Action".  The Springfield XD line of pistols are striker fired, but fully "cocked', unlike a Glock which is only partially cocked, but because the XD has a little trigger safety that has to move ever so slightly first, it was deemed to be Double Action, and thus approved for Production.  So the Alien won't be the first Single Action Only pistol approved for Production Division.  I will purchase one the day one lands in the USA, and will shoot it in L10 until it's approved for Production Division.

 

I don’t think this is the reason, or at least it isn’t what I’d heard before. I’ve read that USPSA and IPSC are allowing it in Production because the manufacturer calls it “striker fired”, and (in USPSA at least) striker fired guns are specifically allowed in Production in addition to DA/SA and DA guns. 

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The USPSA rulebook states "Only Double Action, Double Action/Single Action, and Safe Action/Striker Fired handguns are allowed" under the special conditions section of appendix D4. That's why guns like the XD are allowed, they're striker fired so doesn't matter that it's single action.

 

The Alien is hammer fired so I don't know how it could be production legal, but I wouldn't be at all surprised if it's approved anyway...

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1 hour ago, Southpaw said:

The USPSA rulebook states "Only Double Action, Double Action/Single Action, and Safe Action/Striker Fired handguns are allowed" under the special conditions section of appendix D4. That's why guns like the XD are allowed, they're striker fired so doesn't matter that it's single action.

 

The Alien is hammer fired so I don't know how it could be production legal, but I wouldn't be at all surprised if it's approved anyway...

 

For what it’s worth, the Alien is hammer fired by normal people’s definitions, but referred to as “striker fired” by the manufacturer. They even call what looks an awful lot like an internal hammer a “striker”. 

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35 minutes ago, DKorn said:

 

For what it’s worth, the Alien is hammer fired by normal people’s definitions, but referred to as “striker fired” by the manufacturer. They even call what looks an awful lot like an internal hammer a “striker”. 

 

Gamers gonna game

 

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1 hour ago, DKorn said:

 

For what it’s worth, the Alien is hammer fired by normal people’s definitions, but referred to as “striker fired” by the manufacturer. They even call what looks an awful lot like an internal hammer a “striker”. 

 

So if Leupold starts referring to the Deltapoint as an iron sight I can then use it on my Production gun? 🙄

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Posted (edited)

As far as I've understood the IPSC rules, only 2 types of guns are defined, external hammer, and everything else.

from the prod appendix in rulebook

Quote

15. The minimum trigger pull must either be 2.27kg (5lbs.) for the first shot fired and no restriction for subsequent shots fired, or 1.36kg (3lbs.) for every shot fired.

Quote

16. Handguns with external hammers must be fully decocked (see Rule 8.1.2.5), at the Start Signal. First shot attempted must be double action. Competitors in this Division who, after the issuance of the Start Signal and prior to attempting the first shot, cock the hammer on a handgun which has a loaded chamber, will incur one procedural penalty per occurrence. Note that a procedural penalty will not be assessed in respect of courses of fire where the ready condition requires the competitor to prepare the handgun with an empty chamber. In these cases, the competitor may fire the first shot single action.

 

The alien doesnt have an external hammer, it has an internal hammer, therefore it doesnt have to be decocked. but is limited to 1.36kg SA trigger pull, while the DA guns can go as low as possible.

Edited by Meatpukk
grammar

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