Inconsistent 650 powder drop

[ChemistShooter]

I had a weirdness with my 650 the other day.

 

If you let it sit for a minute---the powder went up about 0.3 grain. But if you maintained a steady rhythm, it would stay at 5.5 grains +/- 0.1 grain (Power Pistol), which is normal behavior.

 

I have a powder check die I have set for maximum sensitivity. A detector is at its most sensitive when it is right on the edge of going off. I've got mine set so that it "chirps" just a little with every round. That way I know the battery is good and everything's working. I have tested it and it will go off if the charge is 0.3-0.4 gr too high. I've had it this way for thousands and thousands of rounds and it hasn't gone off even once.

 

The other day it went off on the first round of the day, be-e-e-e-e-p! My first inclination was I had messed the detector up somehow, because it had just passed the ten-throw quality control check. But I checked the powder weight first.

 

Sure enough, it was 0.3 gr high.

 

This set off a circus. If I maintained a steady rhythm, everything was fine. I let it sit for ten minutes, the first drop was high. This was a repeatable thing.

 

I did a 100-round run. Every once in a while the powder-check detector would go off, and sure enough the charge would be 0.3-0.4 grains too high. This is NOT normal behavior. Something flaky is wrong with powder-drop system.

 

So I have stopped making bullets until I know what the hell is going on.

 

Maintenance: At the end of every run I will dis-assemble and clean the powder bar with isopropyl alcohol (rubbing alcohol). I do NOT clean the funnel, and maybe this is the mistake.

 

Conditions: It was raining, so humidity may have been a factor. My temperature/humidity meter was reporting 72F/75 per cent relative humidity.

 

Thoughts, opinions? TIA.

[Sarge]

If you do a search you will find this is normal with Dillon Powder Measures. Mine has done it from day one out of the box. My guess is powder settles and compacts a little. But not 100% sure. 

  I start every loading session by cycling the press a few times before throwing ten for average then just keep up a steady rhythm.

[noylj]

I prefer NOT to clean my powder measure, but to let the graphite on some of the powders coat it and lube it..

If you have been successful for thousands of rounds and this is new, I am not sure what the problem could be unless you can tell what you are doing differently? Is the charge bar/metering assembly moving all the way forward and back? No binding or sticking?

You can call Dillon and there is a worn part (maybe from cleaning too much?).

For general powder measure treatment:

When new, do the following:

Disassemble and degrease all parts.

Wash plastic parts in warm soapy water and let air dry (do not rinse)

Degrease metal parts with any good degreaser. I prefer, if still being made, Hornady's One Shot degreaser and dry lube. Do not wipe off the part, let air dry so dry lube remains on parts.

Reassemble and ensure the the correct charge bar is being used for the powder weight being thrown. So many have found that their problem was nothing more than the wrong charge bar/metering assembly being used.

Fill hopper with graphitized powder (Bullseye, Unique, and others) and cycle all of this powder through the measure. If you don't have or know if you have graphitized powder, buy some powdered graphite and meter it through the measure.

 

When ready to start loading, do the following:

Fill hopper with correct powder. Verify.

Gently shake the hopper to settle the powder.

Throw at least 10 random charges and throw back in hopper. For measure mounted on the press, use a case with spent primer to drop the charge into so press is being cycled and normal vibrations are occurring.

Now, adjust the metering assembly to get the target charge weight, still using the case with spent primer and throwing charge, after weighing, back in the hopper.

When you get the target weight being dropped, throw 10 more charges in a row to establish weight spread. If too much (+/-  0.2gn is OK, +/- 0.1 gn is great), repeat the shaking of the measure to further settle the powder and repeat the above steps.

If you can't get things going, switch to another powder measure (my measure tend to have days when they just won't work, so I switch to another measure and things are great again--I know inanimate objects have no feelings, but it amazes me how often a temperamental powder measure will work great the NEXT day). In desperation, get an aquarium pump or very small vibrator and strap it to the hopper.

Finally, forget the whole thing and get an RCBS ChargeMaster, a Lee expander and powder through die, and a Lee funnel that goes in the "powder pour" cap of the die.

You can use the remaining graphite powder to dip the case mouth into when you go crazy with case cleaning and find the case is sticking HARD to the expander because you removed the dry lubricant soot.

[ChemistShooter]

If I cann

On 4/22/2019 at 5:30 PM, noylj said:

I prefer NOT to clean my powder measure, but to let the graphite on some of the powders coat it and lube it..

If you have been successful for thousands of rounds and this is new, I am not sure what the problem could be unless you can tell what you are doing differently? Is the charge bar/metering assembly moving all the way forward and back? No binding or sticking?

You can call Dillon and there is a worn part (maybe from cleaning too much?).

For general powder measure treatment:

When new, do the following:

Disassemble and degrease all parts.

Wash plastic parts in warm soapy water and let air dry (do not rinse)

Degrease metal parts with any good degreaser. I prefer, if still being made, Hornady's One Shot degreaser and dry lube. Do not wipe off the part, let air dry so dry lube remains on parts.

Reassemble and ensure the the correct charge bar is being used for the powder weight being thrown. So many have found that their problem was nothing more than the wrong charge bar/metering assembly being used.

Fill hopper with graphitized powder (Bullseye, Unique, and others) and cycle all of this powder through the measure. If you don't have or know if you have graphitized powder, buy some powdered graphite and meter it through the measure.

 

When ready to start loading, do the following:

Fill hopper with correct powder. Verify.

Gently shake the hopper to settle the powder.

Throw at least 10 random charges and throw back in hopper. For measure mounted on the press, use a case with spent primer to drop the charge into so press is being cycled and normal vibrations are occurring.

Now, adjust the metering assembly to get the target charge weight, still using the case with spent primer and throwing charge, after weighing, back in the hopper.

When you get the target weight being dropped, throw 10 more charges in a row to establish weight spread. If too much (+/-  0.2gn is OK, +/- 0.1 gn is great), repeat the shaking of the measure to further settle the powder and repeat the above steps.

If you can't get things going, switch to another powder measure (my measure tend to have days when they just won't work, so I switch to another measure and things are great again--I know inanimate objects have no feelings, but it amazes me how often a temperamental powder measure will work great the NEXT day). In desperation, get an aquarium pump or very small vibrator and strap it to the hopper.

Finally, forget the whole thing and get an RCBS ChargeMaster, a Lee expander and powder through die, and a Lee funnel that goes in the "powder pour" cap of the die.

You can use the remaining graphite powder to dip the case mouth into when you go crazy with case cleaning and find the case is sticking HARD to the expander because you removed the dry lubricant soot.

If I cannot get this thing working right, it WILL be replaced. My guess is at the moment One-Shot has built up and causing stickiness. I am going to clean the entire thing with rubbing alcohol and see if that fixes it.

[noylj]

One Shot CASE LUBE or dry lubricant and degreaser?

Should NEVER use any oil or grease on powder measure.

 

 

[OPENB]

I had this going on last week. I found an old thread where Brian suggested to make sure the spring at the bottom of the powder measure fail safe rod gets compressed at least half its length on the up stroke to ensure the measure slide travels as far as possible. Makes the powder drop more consistent. Worked for me. 

[Sarge]

So, are we still talking about just the first drop being high after sitting idle? Or are we now talking about inconsistencies across the loading session? Seems to have drifted to the latter. 

[cecil]

I always dump the first 3 powder drops back into the hopper when starting or re-starting a loading session ..  .. then I check the accuracy about ever 50 rounds or so... my Dillon powder measure has always been very consistent .. 

[OPENB]

I’ve noticed the first load to be a couple tenths heavy. I dump it back in the hopper, then finish with the leftover primed case at the end. 

[CHARLES D]

Agree with OPENB. I had The same issue last year at NAZC. Fortunately there was some folks from Dillon shooting the match. They told

 me to check the tension in the spring plus make sure the collar wasn't cracked. Sure enough the collar was cracked. Replaced it as well as the spring and nut. Solved my problem

 

 

 

[ChemistShooter]

Fixed it. Damn thing was just dirty.

 

Took it apart, cleaned the funnel with acetone inside and out.

 

Paper towels and and Q-tips came out BLACK the first pass.

 

Ya know, I don't think it was case lube. I think it was the powder itself. Very, very fine grains sticking to the funnel.

 

Went back to +/-0.1 grains after cleaning.

 

Learn something new every day.

 

Hmm, you know what the best possible powder funnel would be?

 

Glass-lined. Or better, solid glass.

You listening, Dillon? Hint, hint.

Edited May 6, 2019 by ChemistShooter
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