DQ event

[HCH]

10 hours ago, pskys2 said:

Shouldn't DQ after the COF is run.  If it's an offense worthy of the DQ you must stop them then.

 

Had a situation at a local IDPA match, shooter shot at the 180 line in a COF.  The assistant SO (IPAD Scoring) reacted to some in the peanut gallery of a 180 infraction and yelled stop.  I informed the 2 SO's to discuss what they saw and decide what was right, it's not the peanut galleries job.  The SO was positive there was no infraction and the Assistant wasn't sure so the shooter got a re-shoot. 

 

Sure you should. I was working a level 2 match as scorekeeper. The stage had a V shape, which required the shooter to go back uprange. I had a shooter break 180 while retreating. I yell “STOP” as I’m looking down the barrel of a SV 38 super. Shooter doesn’t hear me, rounds the corner, finishes the stage, while I keep yelling stop. At ULSC, I told the RO and shooter about the infraction, and the shooter got to get a Blizzard on the way home. 

[Chili]

3 hours ago, tkheard said:

There have been several examples in this thread. I don’t mean to pick nits, but the command is ‘Make Ready’. Think about what happens in an unloaded start...

 

You want to "pick nits" this was an IPSC match so the command is Load And Make Ready, unless it is an unloaded start.

[adamge]

3 hours ago, Chili said:

I normally just ask the shooter to cross his arms across his chest while the person goes down range.  I also am ready the moment the range is clear and once again issue the Load and Make ready command so there would be no chance of the gun coming out prior to my command.  @adamge  did Martin challenge the DQ to the CRO/RM? I would suspect they would have a hard time citing the rule to up hold the DQ but now I am curious.  Brings up another other issue is we routinely run two stages hot during our indoor season here, never had an issue (short of one dropped loaded gun) but I could see it being a potential for issues as well since it is not explicitly spelled out in the rule book.

 

I don't know the answer there. I was on a squad that didn't contain either the shooter in question or MD, I didn't even hear about this until well after match had finished and everyone had left range.

[adamge]

Duplicate

Edited April 22, 2019 by adamge

[driver8M3]

4 hours ago, Chili said:

I normally just ask the shooter to cross his arms across his chest while the person goes down range.  I also am ready the moment the range is clear and once again issue the Load and Make ready command so there would be no chance of the gun coming out prior to my command.  @adamge  did Martin challenge the DQ to the CRO/RM? I would suspect they would have a hard time citing the rule to up hold the DQ but now I am curious.  Brings up another other issue is we routinely run two stages hot during our indoor season here, never had an issue (short of one dropped loaded gun) but I could see it being a potential for issues as well since it is not explicitly spelled out in the rule book.

 

I don't know about the IPSC rulebook, but the USPSA rulebook seems to cover this well enough:

 

8.3.6.1 When conducting Standard Exercises, Range Officials may issue other interim commands on completion of the first string, in order to prepare the competitor for the second and subsequent strings. (e.g. “Reload if required”). This option may also be applied when two or more courses of fire share a common shooting bay or area.

[Chili]

9 hours ago, driver8M3 said:

 

I don't know about the IPSC rulebook, but the USPSA rulebook seems to cover this well enough:

 

8.3.6.1 When conducting Standard Exercises, Range Officials may issue other interim commands on completion of the first string, in order to prepare the competitor for the second and subsequent strings. (e.g. “Reload if required”). This option may also be applied when two or more courses of fire share a common shooting bay or area.

 

Thanks, used some of that as a search term and found the same rule verbatim in the IPSC rule book, just missed it on my previous search.

[Mcfoto]

On first reading this, my first thought was the RO was violating the "don't be a d**k" rule. After re-reading and the subsequent comments, my conclusion is because there was no "Stop" or any other legal command, the shooter was still under the initial "make ready" ready command, therefore unholstering and checking his dot was legal (USPSA). My opinion, no DQ.

 

BTW, the matches I shoot, (ICORE and USPSA) the hands on head thing is common courtesy to ease the mind of the volunteer who goes downrange to fix a target. I've never heard anyone object. And I'm pretty sure, the RO's start over at "make ready" when things are good to go again.

[pskys2]

15 hours ago, HCH said:

 

Sure you should. I was working a level 2 match as scorekeeper. The stage had a V shape, which required the shooter to go back uprange. I had a shooter break 180 while retreating. I yell “STOP” as I’m looking down the barrel of a SV 38 super. Shooter doesn’t hear me, rounds the corner, finishes the stage, while I keep yelling stop. At ULSC, I told the RO and shooter about the infraction, and the shooter got to get a Blizzard on the way home. 

Totally different, I agree you don't stop trying to stop the shooter if there is a DQ offense.  My point on OP was you don't instigate the stop after the COF is done, if you, or your assistant, didn't see the offence at the time you don't score the targets and then DQ.  I'm sure there would be some odd circumstances that may require that, but it's not common.  Kind of it is or isn't if you have to reflect on it it's too late or too liitle.

[pskys2]

2 hours ago, Mcfoto said:

On first reading this, my first thought was the RO was violating the "don't be a d**k" rule. After re-reading and the subsequent comments, my conclusion is because there was no "Stop" or any other legal command, the shooter was still under the initial "make ready" ready command, therefore unholstering and checking his dot was legal (USPSA). My opinion, no DQ.

 

BTW, the matches I shoot, (ICORE and USPSA) the hands on head thing is common courtesy to ease the mind of the volunteer who goes downrange to fix a target. I've never heard anyone object. And I'm pretty sure, the RO's start over at "make ready" when things are good to go again.

Personally I tuck my hands under my armpits and as an RO I stand if front of the shooter and to one side so I can see both the taper/worker and the shooter.

But the proper way would be to ULASC, then LAMR afterwards again.

[tkheard]

 
You want to "pick nits" this was an IPSC match so the command is Load And Make Ready, unless it is an unloaded start.

I apologize. I glossed right over the IPSC designation in the original post..
I stand corrected.

[Joe4d]

well USPSA rules arnt pointless, in this discussion.. I mean they could be but probably arnt. , I  would guess VAST majority of folks on this page are like me and know USPSA and not IPSC. Big reason I replied with the USPSA caveat. I admit, not sure if IPSC is different, and also know IPSC has a few different rules. So really invite discussion on how IPSC is different so I can educate myself.
That being said.
I was a CRO, did some area matches many moons ago. IMO STOP ! is right command. At that point I am a big boy and can figure out if I have positive control of the situation. I have RO'd foreign speakers and even a couple deaf shooters. No issues. STOP ! obvious gringo looks at me sees what the problem is,,,  holsters,, raises hands,,  I have no issue with sending a taper down range... If I had an issue I would issue ULSC... not that big a deal...
Sorry but ur RO needs some remideial training.
Take it with grain of salt I got remedial from Todd Jarret at a club match, when I screwed up range commands at a club match ,  which was great,, as it was practice for him and me for a major. Very professional,, talked about it after the run.