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hlpressley

Why not more SBR in PCC?

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No matter what length you shoot, I would at least try the support arm slightly bent and see how you like it. It makes the gun easier to shoulder/un-shoulder. If you watch Max he pulls the gun in a lot when moving. This is harder to do quick when your arm is stretched out. The stock tends to grab your shoulder because you cant push it out slightly.

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1 hour ago, jlo86cj said:

I have tried different support hand positions and the outstretched arm was always uncomfortable to me. There is a lot more tension in my arm than I like. I have tried from 16” to 8” MPX setups and finally settled on 10.5”. The balance is perfect for me. This is a 10.5” ILWT barrel, Tooth & Nail comp and custom length Isler handguard at 11”.
59f3a405aaae77ff734799042e91d452.jpg

 

Further proof SBRs are wrong.  Lefties use them!  (fellow member of the club)  🙂  

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12 minutes ago, Neomet said:

 

Further proof SBRs are wrong.  Lefties use them!  (fellow member of the club)  🙂  

Yeah, the only thing worse than a PCC shooter is a left handed one:D

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An SBR gas gun is a whole different thing. I could see benefits to that over a blow back. Nice!

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After owning an AR15 SBR lower, I love the flexibility. My favorite configuration for most matches has been a 14.5" middy. I also have a 12.5" that is fun. I change muzzle devices and stuff and don't want anything welded. It's worth every dime of 200$ to me.

 

My PCC is a 16", but would love to cut it down to 12"-13". Doesn't need to be 16". The extra barrel gives me nothing. So I might get a stamp at some point.

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Also, with very lightweight barrels out there like the Taccom ULW's/Tensioned and BSF Carbon Fibers, doesn't it essentially achieve the same thing as SBR's in terms of handling characteristics while still being 16" ?  I know that when I had my Taccom tensioned Carbon Fiber (before I bent it 😫...long story), the gun swung really fast and all the weight was noticeably farther back.  That was a 13.5" tensioned/carbon fiber wrap with an aluminum comp welded to make 16" total.

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44 minutes ago, MoRivera said:

Also, with very lightweight barrels out there like the Taccom ULW's/Tensioned and BSF Carbon Fibers, doesn't it essentially achieve the same thing as SBR's in terms of handling characteristics while still being 16" ?  I know that when I had my Taccom tensioned Carbon Fiber (before I bent it 😫...long story), the gun swung really fast and all the weight was noticeably farther back.  That was a 13.5" tensioned/carbon fiber wrap with an aluminum comp welded to make 16" total.

 

Kind of. 

 

The big benefit of an SBR isn't necessarily the weight distribution, but the compactness in a tight COF. I have both a 6" MPX bbl w/ taccom extension and an 8" bbl. The taccom/CF barrels you get all the up (or down)sides without the shorter OAL. 

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Yeah I can see that.  Sometimes I shoot courses that have doors/window frames and such, and you have to really pull the gun back over your shoulder when moving in/around them.  Be nice to shoot those stages with something like an 8" barreled MP5.

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https://www.rainierarms.com/blog/atf-form-1-creating-or-manufacturing-your-own-sbr-faq/

 

Been reading online about process to build an SBR...  It seems pretty complicated...  The web page linked above seems to help...  Is there a better SBR resource?

 

I've seen lawyers at gun shows with signs saying that they are experts in Gun Trusts...  How is a gun trust different from a 'regular' trust?  I asked a lawyer friend if he could prepare a gun trust and he asked what was the difference between a gun trust and a regular trust...  I have no idea...  Is a special gun trust lawyer required?

 

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It’s not really that complicated. You can file as an individual instead of using a trust. There are pros and cons of each. I do know that in my paper application for my AR15 SBR (individual instead of using a trust), my application got approved a little bit quicker compared to a trust. When I e-filed for my MPX, I did it again as an individual and it came approved after 17 calendar days.

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George 16:

CLEO question on Efile Form 1.

I just finished the form and will send copy to CLEO. Do i do that now, or when it comes back approved. Can the CLEO block it?

I've got a lot of NFA but this is my first run with the new rules.

TIA

jon

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I shot one match with a mag well adapter and my SBR... the bolt hold open broke after the second lock back....

 

I do use a 10" .22lr CMMG upper/conversion on my SBR for Steel Challenge.... Vortex Venom on it and the PCC

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57 minutes ago, Les Snyder said:

I shot one match with a mag well adapter and my SBR... the bolt hold open broke after the second lock back....

 

I do use a 10" .22lr CMMG upper/conversion on my SBR for Steel Challenge.... Vortex Venom on it and the PCC

You should never need the BHO in a free state where mag limits do not exist but If you want this function to work use spacers to limit the bolt travel just beyond the catch (1/4"). If the bolt gets a running start it will break the catch easily. 

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5 hours ago, p7fl said:

George 16:

CLEO question on Efile Form 1.

I just finished the form and will send copy to CLEO. Do i do that now, or when it comes back approved. Can the CLEO block it?

I've got a lot of NFA but this is my first run with the new rules.

TIA

jon

 

It's just notification. If CLEO wants to block it, they take it up w/ the ATF/FBI, but they need a DAMN good reason to keep you from your constitutional right under Federal law. Something like it not being legal to own in your state comes to mind. 

13 hours ago, RaylanGivens said:

https://www.rainierarms.com/blog/atf-form-1-creating-or-manufacturing-your-own-sbr-faq/

 

Been reading online about process to build an SBR...  It seems pretty complicated...  The web page linked above seems to help...  Is there a better SBR resource?

 

I've seen lawyers at gun shows with signs saying that they are experts in Gun Trusts...  How is a gun trust different from a 'regular' trust?  I asked a lawyer friend if he could prepare a gun trust and he asked what was the difference between a gun trust and a regular trust...  I have no idea...  Is a special gun trust lawyer required?

 

 

I started with a trust, but under the new regs it makes sense just to file as an individual outside of some very specific circumstances. E-filing a Form 1 online as an individual is intimidating, but actually very easy and approval times are back to 2-3 weeks. The 'hard' part is getting your lower engraved. ($35-ish)

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7 hours ago, p7fl said:

George 16:

CLEO question on Efile Form 1.

I just finished the form and will send copy to CLEO. Do i do that now, or when it comes back approved. Can the CLEO block it?

I've got a lot of NFA but this is my first run with the new rules.

TIA

jon

Do the e file- that's all you have to do- ATF will  send the CLO the copies -

Mine took like 14 days I think--

 

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24 minutes ago, Rolex said:

Do the e file- that's all you have to do- ATF will  send the CLO the copies -

Mine took like 14 days I think--

 

This is how I did mine as well. Just fill out the form fully with the CLEO name and contact info. Then don't forget to go get fingerprints and send them in within a few days.

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14 hours ago, p7fl said:

George 16:

CLEO question on Efile Form 1.

I just finished the form and will send copy to CLEO. Do i do that now, or when it comes back approved. Can the CLEO block it?

I've got a lot of NFA but this is my first run with the new rules.

TIA

jon

Everything goes to the ATF since it electronically saved into their system. They will inform your CLEO about your application.

 

Once you finished all the paperwork, a different window will pop open (make sure your computer allows cookies) for payment via cc or debit. Once this is done, the system will send you a receipt via email and also another email with an attachment containing the cover page to be sent with your fingerprints. The address to send your fingerprints will be in this cover letter too. You have 10 working days from submitting your form 1 to submit your fingerprints.

 

 

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12 hours ago, George16 said:

Once this is done, the system will send you a receipt via email and also another email with an attachment containing the cover page to be sent with your fingerprints. The address to send your fingerprints will be in this cover letter too. You have 10 working days from submitting your form 1 to submit your fingerprints.

 

 

Those who are considering this do your fingerprints before you do submit in efile (FYI you will also need to upload a passport photo). ATF's system auto generates the response with the cover letter for fingerprints. If you do them ahead of time you can mail them out the same day you submit your form 1 and it will cut the turnaround time down. The last one I submitted was on at Saturday and still had a turnaround time of 12 calendar days. 

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2 hours ago, bwikel said:

Those who are considering this do your fingerprints before you do submit in efile (FYI you will also need to upload a passport photo). ATF's system auto generates the response with the cover letter for fingerprints. If you do them ahead of time you can mail them out the same day you submit your form 1 and it will cut the turnaround time down. The last one I submitted was on at Saturday and still had a turnaround time of 12 calendar days. 

 

2 hours ago, bwikel said:

Those who are considering this do your fingerprints before you do submit in efile (FYI you will also need to upload a passport photo). ATF's system auto generates the response with the cover letter for fingerprints. If you do them ahead of time you can mail them out the same day you submit your form 1 and it will cut the turnaround time down. The last one I submitted was on at Saturday and still had a turnaround time of 12 calendar days. 

 

This is exactly what I did. I was in the LGS and they had an electronic fingerprinter that they used for extra money from their CCW class.

Picture was from cell phone.  Once I figured out CLEO was not me (duh 🙂 )  everything was easy.

FYI: their system runs slow. Like two hours for the form to update correctly and move to the next screen. It is not like BE.com etc.  Patience was the hardest part.

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I was in the military and was fingerprinted for a CWP...  Will I need to submit new fingerprints for the SBR?

 

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22 minutes ago, RaylanGivens said:

I was in the military and was fingerprinted for a CWP...  Will I need to submit new fingerprints for the SBR?

 

 

Yes, every time you want to get a stamp.  Was told by LGS on last transfer, 6 month time from when fingerprints are taken to when they will be accepted.  Beyond that, you need new cards with recent dates.

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1 minute ago, bishop414 said:

 

Yes, every time you want to get a stamp.  Was told by LGS on last transfer, 6 month time from when fingerprints are taken to when they will be accepted.  Beyond that, you need new cards with recent dates.

 

Thanks...  Where's the best place to get your fingerprints printed?

 

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Call you local PD or Sheriff office would be cheapest.  We have a lot of 3rd party "safety" type retail places.  A lot of professions need fingerprint cards, not hard to find, just need to shop for prices.  $8/card is cheap, $20/card sucks, but common.

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28 minutes ago, RaylanGivens said:

 

Thanks...  Where's the best place to get your fingerprints printed?

 

I went to the nearest sheriffs office and asked them for a fingerprint and they were very accommodating (most were retired military too). They charged me $5 each so $10 for two cards. They provided and did everything.

 

Cheapest and convenient since it’s only about 3 miles from my house.

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Bwikel... my PCC is a Glock format 16" with 31+ Taylor Freelance and no bolt hold open.... also a NFA bumper and Enidine hydraulic... my comment referred to the first time I used a mag well adapter with Colt style magazines (at the time I was not aware of anyone making a mag well adapter for Glock mags)... on a 10" 9mm....I was surprised that the bolt hold open did not last longer than that...

 

the 10" .22lr on the SBR is extremely fast in transitioning, unfortunately I'm old and can't take advantage... regards

Les L747

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