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ahub3101

Broken barrel link

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Barrel link in my very well used 9mm Trojan broke yesterday. Usually shoot the standard 147/3.2 Titegroup load but was shooting aluminum case Federal 115s because I hate picking brass out of snow. Not cold enough to be an issue, 20 degrees F. Coincidence? I think if it was bad fit it would have broken long ago? Should I just replace the link or send it to STI? Thanks.

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I would send it to STI. Maybe they'll look the gun over while its there and address any other potential issues

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Just replace the link, look for any problems and keep shooting.

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It'll take months to get it back from std's oh sorry sti.

 

It'll take minutes to replace the link

Edited by jcc7x7

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standard size is #3 .(mine# 3 not marked)

but i have spare #4  that i can fit to my 2011 barrel.

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If you are really worried Schuemann Barrels had a Timing Kit, and the procedure to check the timing is still on their website.

Might be after 50,000 rounds or so it might need a different sized link.

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When you replace the link you can easily test it to see if the barrel is bottoming out on the frame when fully unlocked (as it should) or if its bottoming out on the link (which it shouldn't). This can easily be tested by taking the slide stop pin out, then reinstalling it so the pin portion is installed properly in the frame and link, but the lever portion is hanging down towards the trigger guard. Then place the tip of the barrel against a solid object, like a bench, then push the gun forward until it stops and hold it in that position. This will generate the correct barrel unlock & bottom out position scenario. While holding the gun forward firmly in the unlock & bottom out position, rotate the slide stop pin by pushing the "Lever" portion front to back. If the barrel has been fit to the frame properly, there should be ZERO resistance while moving the lever portion of the slide stop front to back. If there is resistance while moving the slide stop lever and that resistance corresponds to how much forward pressure you push the gun into the bench, then the barrel is bottoming out on the barrel link instead of the frame. The barrel bottoming out on the link in this scenario is the #1 reason why barrel links break.

 

To fix this issue you need to weld more material to either the barrel or frame where they should bottom out against one another. Sometimes this isn't possible and a new barrel or new frame is needed to fix the issue and both parts must be fit properly to one another. 

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I had one break in my edge. It was a number 4. I replaced it myself and called STI, and they sent me a replacement link.

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Once again, if you are breaking barrel links, the barrel to frame fit wasn't done correctly. Feeding guns that break barrel links more links isn't a good long term solution. Its a band aid for a significant build quality issue.

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43 minutes ago, CHA-LEE said:

Once again, if you are breaking barrel links, the barrel to frame fit wasn't done correctly. Feeding guns that break barrel links more links isn't a good long term solution. Its a band aid for a significant build quality issue.

i think that link and leaf spring is trouble makers parts. i removed them from my 2011😀

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1 hour ago, CHA-LEE said:

When you replace the link you can easily test it to see if the barrel is bottoming out on the frame when fully unlocked (as it should) or if its bottoming out on the link (which it shouldn't). This can easily be tested by taking the slide stop pin out, then reinstalling it so the pin portion is installed properly in the frame and link, but the lever portion is hanging down towards the trigger guard. Then place the tip of the barrel against a solid object, like a bench, then push the gun forward until it stops and hold it in that position. This will generate the correct barrel unlock & bottom out position scenario. While holding the gun forward firmly in the unlock & bottom out position, rotate the slide stop pin by pushing the "Lever" portion front to back. If the barrel has been fit to the frame properly, there should be ZERO resistance while moving the lever portion of the slide stop front to back. If there is resistance while moving the slide stop lever and that resistance corresponds to how much forward pressure you push the gun into the bench, then the barrel is bottoming out on the barrel link instead of the frame. The barrel bottoming out on the link in this scenario is the #1 reason why barrel links break.

 

To fix this issue you need to weld more material to either the barrel or frame where they should bottom out against one another. Sometimes this isn't possible and a new barrel or new frame is needed to fix the issue and both parts must be fit properly to one another. 

 

That is what justifies reading gun forums. 

 

Thank you. 

 

FWIW, I've had 2 2011's that broke links & 1 1911 that broke link pins. All 3 required new barrels to be fitted. 

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1 hour ago, yigal said:

i think that link and leaf spring is trouble makers parts. i removed them from my 2011😀

 

I knew you had some invetion with the spring but what did you do with the barrel link?

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The sad thing about these 1911/2011 pistols that are built incorrectly and break barrel links is that it happens WAY more than it should. Fitting a barrel or cutting a frame properly so it unlocks and bottoms out on the frame instead of the link should be gunsmithing basics. But this error during the build happens A LOT more often than it should. I think the majority of the time they get away with it because the barrel links are actually very tough and last quite a long time getting abused. Not many casual shooting "plinkers" will shoot enough ammo through the gun to break a link when that stuff is fit incorrectly.

 

Any time I look at buying a new or used gun I perform the barrel unlock/bottom out test I listed above while checking it out. If it fails that test I will refuse to buy the gun because it can turn into an expensive fix to resolve the issue properly. Surprisingly not many people know how important that test is so they don't do it when buying 1911/2011 pistols. Test this stuff out the next time you are looking to buy a 1911/2011.   

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5 hours ago, CHA-LEE said:

When you replace the link you can easily test it to see if the barrel is bottoming out on the frame when fully unlocked (as it should) or if its bottoming out on the link (which it shouldn't). This can easily be tested by taking the slide stop pin out, then reinstalling it so the pin portion is installed properly in the frame and link, but the lever portion is hanging down towards the trigger guard. Then place the tip of the barrel against a solid object, like a bench, then push the gun forward until it stops and hold it in that position. This will generate the correct barrel unlock & bottom out position scenario. While holding the gun forward firmly in the unlock & bottom out position, rotate the slide stop pin by pushing the "Lever" portion front to back. If the barrel has been fit to the frame properly, there should be ZERO resistance while moving the lever portion of the slide stop front to back. If there is resistance while moving the slide stop lever and that resistance corresponds to how much forward pressure you push the gun into the bench, then the barrel is bottoming out on the barrel link instead of the frame. The barrel bottoming out on the link in this scenario is the #1 reason why barrel links break.

 

To fix this issue you need to weld more material to either the barrel or frame where they should bottom out against one another. Sometimes this isn't possible and a new barrel or new frame is needed to fix the issue and both parts must be fit properly to one another. 

I just checked both of my 1911s... My RRA  has zero resistance when following your instructions but my Trojan definitely has some. thanks for ruining my views on what I thought was a great pistol LOL

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7 hours ago, CHA-LEE said:

The sad thing about these 1911/2011 pistols that are built incorrectly and break barrel links is that it happens WAY more than it should. Fitting a barrel or cutting a frame properly so it unlocks and bottoms out on the frame instead of the link should be gunsmithing basics. But this error during the build happens A LOT more often than it should. I think the majority of the time they get away with it because the barrel links are actually very tough and last quite a long time getting abused. Not many casual shooting "plinkers" will shoot enough ammo through the gun to break a link when that stuff is fit incorrectly.

 

Any time I look at buying a new or used gun I perform the barrel unlock/bottom out test I listed above while checking it out. If it fails that test I will refuse to buy the gun because it can turn into an expensive fix to resolve the issue properly. Surprisingly not many people know how important that test is so they don't do it when buying 1911/2011 pistols. Test this stuff out the next time you are looking to buy a 1911/2011.   

it's the first thing that i do when i take from somebody his 1911/2011gun .only  ones i find this on old "custom" para gun.

in properly ( 2021 models 😀)  fitted barrels  this part  don't has  main function like on old 1911 guns that suffers from bad fitted barrels.

Edited by yigal

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16 hours ago, CHA-LEE said:

The sad thing about these 1911/2011 pistols that are built incorrectly and break barrel links is that it happens WAY more than it should. Fitting a barrel or cutting a frame properly so it unlocks and bottoms out on the frame instead of the link should be gunsmithing basics. But this error during the build happens A LOT more often than it should. I think the majority of the time they get away with it because the barrel links are actually very tough and last quite a long time getting abused. Not many casual shooting "plinkers" will shoot enough ammo through the gun to break a link when that stuff is fit incorrectly.

 

Any time I look at buying a new or used gun I perform the barrel unlock/bottom out test I listed above while checking it out. If it fails that test I will refuse to buy the gun because it can turn into an expensive fix to resolve the issue properly. Surprisingly not many people know how important that test is so they don't do it when buying 1911/2011 pistols. Test this stuff out the next time you are looking to buy a 1911/2011.   

How does the bad fit effect the gun?

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2 hours ago, dmshozer1 said:

How does the bad fit effect the gun?

 

The 1911/2011 platform wasn't designed so that the full force of the barrel unlock and drop down force is slammed into the barrel link and slide stop pin. The most common and easiest "Bad Effect" produced is excessively worn or broken barrel links. The less commonly found issue is the gradual ovaling of the slide stop pin hole in the frame because excessive front to back force is slammed into the slide stop pin every time you fire the gun.

 

You can build stuff with bubble gum and bailing wire and it will "Work". But does that justify building it that way? NOPE!!! If you are spending a decent amount of money on a 1911/2011 pistol its up to you to DEMAND that its been built correctly.

 

For what its worth, I have performed this test on many guns over the years and seen it fail the test on an alarming amount of guns from a wide range of manufactures and custom gun builders. I don't want to turn this into a mud slinging thread calling out specific brands or builders. All I am trying to do is give people a simple test to perform so they can verify the build quality of the barrel fit. KNOW the quality of build in the pistol you are buying by verifying this stuff up front. To me doing that is no different then test driving a car before you buy it to ensure that there are no glaring issues with it.

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8 minutes ago, CHA-LEE said:

 

The 1911/2011 platform wasn't designed so that the full force of the barrel unlock and drop down force is slammed into the barrel link and slide stop pin. The most common and easiest "Bad Effect" produced is excessively worn or broken barrel links. The less commonly found issue is the gradual ovaling of the slide stop pin hole in the frame because excessive front to back force is slammed into the slide stop pin every time you fire the gun.

 

You can build stuff with bubble gum and bailing wire and it will "Work". But does that justify building it that way? NOPE!!! If you are spending a decent amount of money on a 1911/2011 pistol its up to you to DEMAND that its been built correctly.

 

For what its worth, I have performed this test on many guns over the years and seen it fail the test on an alarming amount of guns from a wide range of manufactures and custom gun builders. I don't want to turn this into a mud slinging thread calling out specific brands or builders. All I am trying to do is give people a simple test to perform so they can verify the build quality of the barrel fit. KNOW the quality of build in the pistol you are buying by verifying this stuff up front. To me doing that is no different then test driving a car before you buy it to ensure that there are no glaring issues with it.

Got it,

Thanks

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OP, you need to check other things besides the link size.  If everything is fitted together PERFECTLY, a #3 link can be used, but it may have to be elongated a little to let the barrel sit on the barrel rest.  Perfectly is not generally the case with STI and Trojans.   A friend had his slide stop break on his 9mm Trojan.  The replacement STI sent didn't fit, as in it literally could not be pushed in.  He asked me to help.  I looked at the gun and the broken slide stop.  STI had literally sanded down one side of the slide stop so it would work with the installed link.  I told my friend to send it back to STI and have them fix it correctly.

 

I'd recommend you bring it to a local gunsmith and have it checked out.  Then you can decide how to proceede. 

Edited by zzt

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