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Chacam

9mm light loads

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I would like to load some 9mm loads for my wife with light recoil.  What would be a minimum charge of titegroup using 115 gr lrn bullets that would be light enough for her and still have enough to eject and reload?  How about for 147gr bullets?  Thanks

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I load 115 gr light loads for my wife and her Glock 19. 

Acme 115 gr RN over 3.7 gr Titegroup @ 1.13" OAL cycles fine most of the time, but about 1 in 40 will not eject properly.  PF = 118. 

Acme 115 gr RN over 3.8 gr Titegroup @ 1.12" OAL has cycled fine all the time, but will only lock back the slide about half the time.  PF = 120.  As would be expected, accuracy suffers a little d/t the lower velocity and I can only get 4" or 5" groups at 25 yd.

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Felt recoil may be less using heavier grain bullets such as 147s. It’s generally perceived as less snappy and softer feeling

For minimum PF I use 3.2 titegroup with 147s. That’s about 130PF. You may be be able to go down to about 2.9 for even lighter loads that should still cycle most slides.

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1 hour ago, Chacam said:

I would like to load some 9mm loads for my wife with light recoil.  

 

If you're NOT trying to hit a minimum PF, I'd go with the 115 gr bullets

and very light charge of powder - I have never used TG, but have used

3 gr Red Dot, WW231 and a few other powders and have hit as low

as PF 110.

 

These light loads work in my Kel-Tec P-11, but are too light to work

in my S&W M&P Compact.

 

You'll have to experiment with your wife's gun, and springs, to see how

low you can go - or change to a lighter spring.    :) 

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124 gr fmj or coated bullet over 3.8 gr hp38. Even 4.0 is light. 1.150

Edited by Adrenaline

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2 hours ago, yukonjon said:

Felt recoil may be less using heavier grain bullets such as 147s. It’s generally perceived as less snappy and softer feeling

This is true when the heavy bullets and lighter bullets are loaded to a similar power factor.  The heavy bullet is perceived to have a softer recoil. 

If PF isn't in play then this isn't true, you go with lighter bullets loaded as soft as will reliably operate your gun if soft recoil is the goal.  You see it in some guys who are all in on Steel Challenge; light bullet, weak load, reduced springs, very low PF.  You can load a 95 or 100 gr .380 projectile in a 9mm casing and push it at 1050 to 1100 fps with reduced springs and it's stupid soft.  PF just over 100 or so.

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Hello: Try some 147gr with 3.0gr Tite Group. If you have a lighter recoil spring this will put a smile on her face. 1911/2011's you can use a 8 or 9lb and for a Glock 17/34 use a 13lb. Thanks, Eric

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If you are using light loads I would recommend seating the bullets fairly deeply, 1.100" or less depending on how the bullet sits in the case.  It will help increase pressure, which helps titegroup burn cleaner. 

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This is true when the heavy bullets and lighter bullets are loaded to a similar power factor.  The heavy bullet is perceived to have a softer recoil. 
If PF isn't in play then this isn't true, you go with lighter bullets loaded as soft as will reliably operate your gun if soft recoil is the goal.  You see it in some guys who are all in on Steel Challenge; light bullet, weak load, reduced springs, very low PF.  You can load a 95 or 100 gr .380 projectile in a 9mm casing and push it at 1050 to 1100 fps with reduced springs and it's stupid soft.  PF just over 100 or so.

Makes sense. I have not dabbled in those loads as I have used PF as my minimum requirement. Now that you mention it, I think I will try some test loads too see how it feels.

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Heavy gun, light bullet, high speed to cycle slide. This is good for actual recoil but perceived recoil it can go the other way, heavy bullet at slow speeds - but this can be hard to fine tune where it will cycle the slide in 9mm. I find newbies who don't like a standard 9mm's snappiness are perfectly happy shooting full power .45 ACP.

 

For maximum centerfire softness you need a revolver. I've loaded 38 SPL down to 450 fps, you can easily see the bullet in flight. It still punches a hole in targets but has a lot of trouble dropping a plate rack. Kicks like a 22 LR.

 

Side note for reloading fun, a 31 grain wooden bullet fired at 3,200 fps is not powerful enough to cycle the slide on a 1911 with an 8lb recoil spring.

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You'll have to experiment with the gun.  I've loaded some pretty light Titegroup loads.  

Here's the load data one for a 16" PCC and the other for my M&P Pro

PSA 9mm AR Bullet Brand Everglades   M&P Pro Bullet Brand Everglades
Bullet Type Round nose   Bullet Type Round nose
Bullet Weight 147gr   Bullet Weight 147gr
Powder Name Titegroup   Powder Name Titegroup
Powder Weight 2.5gr   Powder Weight 2.5gr
Primer Federal   Primer Federal
COL 1.130-1.135   COL 1.130-1.135
Average Chronograph Speed 908.7   Average Chronograph Speed 778.1
Standard Deviation 26.7   Standard Deviation 9.62
Chronograph Speed Low/High 863 961   Chronograph Speed Low/High 759 794
Power Factor 133   Power Factor 114

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Ditch the 115 LRN and go 147 plated.

 

My load is:-

147gr plated

3.9gr/Unique

Mixed brass and any primer that's not Winchester

OAL = 1.15"

PF 137000

 

My friends wife had wrist problems  and stopped shooting.  I gave him a couple of boxes of my ammo for them to try, and as they say, the rest is history.  That is now all that he uses.

 

It is a soft, straight back recoil.  I have found that 3.2gr TiteGroup snappier.

Edited by RePete

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I know you specified Titegroup, but the softest load I've encountered was a minimum charge of Bullseye under a coated 147gr bullet.

Can't remember what the charge weight was, but I did get it from a manual(I'm thinking the Lyman lead book...), seems like it was 2.8 or 3.0gr of Bullseye.

It was smokey, and probably dirty(didn't run enough rounds through to be sure), but recoil was so soft that I was surprised that it cycled the slide.

Can't recall the accuracy without consulting my notebook, but it was probably decent. I'll try to update with real data later if I can remember.

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this works well in my daughters steel challenge XDM 5.25 and a Glock 34

2.8 grains of TG

147 Blue Bullets 

1.150 OAL

i also use this in my 2011 for 3 gun 

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Looking at my notes, 2.8-3.0 gr of Bullseye or Titegroup behind a coated 147gr bullet makes for a soft load, but accuracy wasn't as good as with full power stuff.

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You gotta use 147s for the wife. I had a super soft shooting 147g load, but being cheap, I didn’t want to pay for 147s for her. It’s like 75 bucks for 1000 147 blues and 80 for for 1300 115s. So I figured I could save some money and work up a light load for her. Think i used 4.5g of unique, which I believe is below the starting load in the books for 115 9mm loads, I think the range goes all the way up to 6.3 or so, do it was a really light charge. Anyways she hated them. Way to snappy. Even with a super light, under book load it still wasn’t anywhere near as tame as 3g of titegroup. Her favorite now is 3.5g unique with a 147g blue. I really think the 3g titegroup is the softest, but I load what she tells me to. I think titegroup is one of the softest powders, so maybe a soft recoiling load with 115s could be worked up. But I’d skip it and go to the 147s. There’s a reason everyone shoots them with titegroup for soft recoil. I’ve even gone down to 2.8 grains and it cycled a g34. No problems what so ever. I could probably go down to 2.5 in my wife’s little sig p320sc. I may try it soon. 

Edited by Jfitz427

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On 2/6/2019 at 7:37 AM, RePete said:

Ditch the 115 LRN and go 147 plated.

 

My load is:-

147gr plated

3.9gr/Unique

Mixed brass and any primer that's not Winchester

OAL = 1.15"

PF 137000

 

My friends wife had wrist problems  and stopped shooting.  I gave him a couple of boxes of my ammo for them to try, and as they say, the rest is history.  That is now all that he uses.

 

It is a soft, straight back recoil.  I have found that 3.2gr TiteGroup snappier.

Interesting. I always felt thd 3-3.2g titegroup was softer. But my wife says that 3.8g unique with 147g is softer. Unique is more of a push, whereas titrgroup is snappy. Either are plenty soft imo. But I’ll be sticking with unique from now on for her 

Edited by Jfitz427

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Less felt recoil with heavier bullets is only true if you are trying to achieve a certain PF, for all other scenarios a lighter bullet will recoil less.

Try the 115 grain with any fast powder and find out how much you need to cycle reliably.

 

For really soft loads try a 95/100 grain bullet with 3.8 ish grain of a fast powder. (Check your manual to be safe )

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Not Titegroup so disregard if that is important.

 

I did some download experimenting with Sport Pistol and a Ruger LC9s for a bug gun match.

No chrono data but the following experience:

 

RMR 124 Plated RN (I don't know if they produce these anymore; I think they are moving to jacketed)

OAL was 1.120/1.125

 

3.2 grains: Gun cycled for me but not for my wife. I assume limp wristing for her issues.

3.3 grains: Gun cycled for me and better but not 100% for my wife.

 

I used the 3.3 grain load for the match and had no problems. I think it even knocked steel over.

I might try 3.2 next time.

 

I'm going to WAG the power factor at about 110 to 115; I'd be curious to see if anybody had any hard data in this range.

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3.3 Sport pistol 125 sns rn coated  out of glock 34 .       120+/- power factor

so out of your gun probably less than 100 PF

takes 3.8 to make 130 PF in my Glock.

IF not trying to make PF suggest increase your load  to 3.5 should be more reliable for the both of you.

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1 hour ago, AHI said:

3.3 Sport pistol 125 sns rn coated  out of glock 34 .       120+/- power factor

so out of your gun probably less than 100 PF

takes 3.8 to make 130 PF in my Glock.

IF not trying to make PF suggest increase your load  to 3.5 should be more reliable for the both of you.

 

Thanks for the data. 

(and it just needs to work for me; she has a Shield with her own load)

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On February 4, 2019 at 8:03 PM, Aircooled6racer said:

Hello: Try some 147gr with 3.0gr Tite Group. If you have a lighter recoil spring this will put a smile on her face. 1911/2011's you can use a 8 or 9lb and for a Glock 17/34 use a 13lb. Thanks, Eric

I have a 34 I play with in CO occasionally. 13lb recoil. 147's w 3.2 Titegroup. When the wife shoots it she has to stop and giggle after about 4 rounds. Then a few more shots / giggle. Rinse & repeat. Same loads through my GMR 15 and a lot more giggling. 

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