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B_RAD

Intersting observation (mixed brass/9major)

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I was working up some loads and I noticed that some brass has more room inside the case than others. I took a pic. 

 

All brass is range pick up. All have been processed on my 650. 

 

Powder is 10.0 gr AA7

Left to right (Hornady, Speer, Win, Xtreme)

Screenshot_20190120-194529_Gallery.thumb.jpg.8aca10c02229eb5a0886179602a55aa1.jpg

 

Basically, Hornady has more room than most and Xtreme has the least. All the other brands seem to be about the same. 

 

Loading 7.0 WAC and there's no problem. If I want to load AA7 I guess I'll need to sort brass.  

 

Unfortunately, the last box of mixed brass I got was full of Xtreme!

 

I measured the length of these cases and they all were around the same. I guess it's due to case thickness?

Edited by B_RAD

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Is the Xtreme case have a step inside it like these?

The swage / backer station on my 1050 catches stepped brass & I toss them.

 

No worries - that case is not too full to load. I'm running 10.8 under 115's. AA7 is slow & forgiving.

Might be slightly compressed, but not a problem. After using 3N38, that still looks like a partial drop :)

 

 

 

 

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10 minutes ago, racer-x said:

Is the Xtreme case have a step inside it like these?

The swage / backer station on my 1050 catches stepped brass & I toss them.

 

No worries - that case is not too full to load. I'm running 10.8 under 115's. AA7 is slow & forgiving.

Might be slightly compressed, but not a problem. After using 3N38, that still looks like a partial drop :)

 

 

 

 

I'm not seeing any of the extreme to be stepped. 

 

 

 

Edited by B_RAD

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I got tons of extreme brass without the step. Extreme also make freedom . Fm head stamp. As long as the extreme head stamp doesn’t have st on head stamp your good. The st is steel with brass wash. An I’m loading 10.55 aa7 an loaded tons of extreme. You be fine if u are loading long

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X-treme/Frontier stopped making stepped brass a while ago.  The smallest case capacity is Blazer Brass.  It's made worse if you use a U-die.

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X-treme brass is pretty good, but definitely reduced case capacity.   I sort my brass and put the Win, PMC, CCI, Speer, Blazer, FC and R-P headstamp in my 9major box, and everything else that doesnt have a step into my 9 minor box.   Anything with a step gets a light load, then left at the rage during winter shooting. 

Edited by chevrofreak

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This topic is interesting because I have been sorting brass for precision handgun reloading.  Just sorting a whole bunch of brass by neck thickness (Mitutoyo digital ball micrometer) I found relatively good consistency within each headstamp but between the different brands, of the 9 brands that I measured, neck thickness ranged between 10.25 to 15.48 thousands - that is a 50% difference which is huge and could be at least partially responsible for what the OP is seeing.

 

One other interesting difference is consistent difference in case weight AND volume within a headstamp - Federal.  It appears that most are around 60 grains but about 1/3 are around 55 grain which again is a huge difference (~~10%).  No step in FC of course and that clearly will also affect volume.

 

Coming from Precision rifle, I can tell you that case volume affect pressure.  The less the volume, the more pressure.  More pressure apart for safety affects MV.

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I find that the gun tracks differently with these different case volumes. 

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The powder in the brass that you photographed - was it measured by

a powder measure on a reloader ?   Or was it weighed on a high quality

scale ?

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38 minutes ago, Hi-Power Jack said:

The powder in the brass that you photographed - was it measured by

a powder measure on a reloader ?   Or was it weighed on a high quality

scale ?

Good question. It was all done using my RCBS Chargemaster 1500. 

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Interesting thread.

I'm new to open division and have been sorting range brass for the past couple days. I've been sticking to the major brands, like Chev mentioned above. The rest will be used for minor loads. I have been scraping the X-treme brass for two reasons. First I believe the stuff I picked up was one fired, but saw several split cases (which is usually a bad sign). Second the machining inside the case is horrible, so my conclusion it's that it is crap.

So with that being said, are any of you using it for major and is it holding up?

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I have loaded quite a few X-treme cases for 9major and they did fine, but they didnt like having 9.4gr of 3n38 in them, which is why I sort them out. 

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3 hours ago, AdamM said:

Interesting thread.

I'm new to open division and have been sorting range brass for the past couple days. I've been sticking to the major brands, like Chev mentioned above. The rest will be used for minor loads. I have been scraping the X-treme brass for two reasons. First I believe the stuff I picked up was one fired, but saw several split cases (which is usually a bad sign). Second the machining inside the case is horrible, so my conclusion it's that it is crap.

So with that being said, are any of you using it for major and is it holding up?

I use all  range brass. All head stamp. I case gage an roll size or use u die. Never rack my two open gats. 

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8 hours ago, B_RAD said:

 . It was all done using my RCBS Chargemaster 1500. 

 

Since you'll get some variation with the Chargemaster, I would think

that it would be

more accurate to take one load, and photograph it in the various

cases - that way it's exactly the same amount of powder in each

case.     :) 

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4 hours ago, Hi-Power Jack said:

 

Since you'll get some variation with the Chargemaster, I would think

that it would be

more accurate to take one load, and photograph it in the various

cases - that way it's exactly the same amount of powder in each

case.     :) 

Maybe a tenth of a grain variation. You can't see the difference between a tenth. I loaded up 400 rounds of ammo last night. As I was doing it, I could tell which case was a Hornady and which was a Xtreme. Just by looking. 

 

 

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On 1/22/2019 at 5:33 AM, Hi-Power Jack said:

I would think

that it would be

more accurate to take one load, and photograph it in the various

cases - that way it's exactly the same amount of powder in each

case.

 

No really.  You cannot just pour powder in and expect it to settle to the same level as it does when dropped in at the press.  As an example, take a lower capacity 9mm case and try pouring 9.4gr 3N38 in it.  It doesn't fit.  You have to pour some, tamp, pour more, tamp and then put in the rest.  If you drop the same 9.4gr from the press, it all fits into the case with just a smidge of brass above the powder. 

 

That's why I'm either going to sell the 12 lbs. of 3N38 I have, or use it for minor loads.

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6 minutes ago, zzt said:

 

No really.  You cannot just pour powder in and expect it to settle to the same level as it does when dropped in at the press.  As an example, take a lower capacity 9mm case and try pouring 9.4gr 3N38 in it.  It doesn't fit.  You have to pour some, tamp, pour more, tamp and then put in the rest.  If you drop the same 9.4gr from the press, it all fits into the case with just a smidge of brass above the powder. 

 

That's why I'm either going to sell the 12 lbs. of 3N38 I have, or use it for minor loads.

Correct. I use 8 grains of AutoComp and it meter pretty smooth. Sometimes I’ll see a case that I would swear is under or over charged. Pull it out and weigh it and right on the money. I quit worrying about it

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1 hour ago, Sarge said:

  I use 8 grains of AutoComp 

 

That's a 115 grain bullet, I hope.     :surprise:

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3 hours ago, Hi-Power Jack said:

 

That's a 115 grain bullet, I hope.     :surprise:

Yeah. 115 PD JHP. Actually 8.1

Oddly MG 115 JHP only needs 7.8 to do the same thing.

About 173 PF

Edited by Sarge

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On 1/21/2019 at 9:59 PM, AdamM said:

Interesting thread.

I'm new to open division and have been sorting range brass for the past couple days. I've been sticking to the major brands, like Chev mentioned above. The rest will be used for minor loads. I have been scraping the X-treme brass for two reasons. First I believe the stuff I picked up was one fired, but saw several split cases (which is usually a bad sign). Second the machining inside the case is horrible, so my conclusion it's that it is crap.

So with that being said, are any of you using it for major and is it holding up?

I ended up with a bunch of it new. I shoot it and keep it all together. It definitely has less case volume so the charge I use is 0.2 or so less. It works fine. 

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On 1/26/2019 at 3:52 PM, Hi-Power Jack said:

 

That's a 115 grain bullet, I hope.     :surprise:

I was thinking the same, as I show ~6.5 for 124gr

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