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Dryfire question


MisterPlink

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When you are doing dryfire how much front sight movement is acceptable? Should it remain completely motionless, as if the gun is locked in a vise? Or is a small amount of wiggle  acceptable? I find it nearly impossible to hold it motionless for rapid fire.

My skill level is absolute beginner.

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When you are doing dryfire how much front sight movement is acceptable? Should it remain completely motionless, as if the gun is locked in a vise? Or is a small amount of wiggle  acceptable? I find it nearly impossible to hold it motionless for rapid fire.

My skill level is absolute beginner.

7 yards or less on easy targets hammer away.

7-15 yards with No shoots or hard cover get a still, clear sight picture.

15 yards or more get that still sight picture.

In dry fire you can push a wobbly sight picture but understand that depending on difficulty of shot in LIVE FIRE you'll need a stable sight picture with an efficient TRIGGER PULL

Sent from my SM-N950U using Tapatalk

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I strive to hold the gun and manipulate the trigger in a manner that keeps the gun as still as possible.  

 

I understand that perfectly still may not be possible.  

 

I accept any alignment or movement that would still give me the desired result in my target area.  

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The answer to this question is to learn how misaligned your sights can be and still hit the target you are aiming at.

 

An experienced shooter can put the front post at maximum misalignment inside the notch (but still visible) and shoot a 6” group at 7 yds because the gun holds that position as he works the trigger.

 

A novice has the gun aligned perfectly the shoots 8” low because he moves the gun as it fires. Flinches, or tightens all other fingers as the index finger pulls.

 

You need two things:

 

1. Learn to grip the gun hard. Firmly enough to make someone you’re giving a handshake to very uncomfortable. You can’t push it around as much with your trigger pull, and the sights will snap right back after you shoot. Squeeze til it shakes, then back off a little.

 

Dryfiring should make your forearms burn with the effort, at first.

 

2. Learn to work the trigger FAST without moving the sights much. For a novice, I’d say keeping the front post within the center 50% of the notch is a good goal to start. Pulling it slowly it should stay stationary. Gripping hard with the weak hand will help with this. But in a match and on the street you’re not going to slowly squeeze shots off, you’re going to rip them off. Work on that too.

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4 hours ago, MemphisMechanic said:

The answer to this question is to learn how misaligned your sights can be and still hit the target you are aiming at.

 

An experienced shooter can put the front post at maximum misalignment inside the notch (but still visible) and shoot a 6” group at 7 yds because the gun holds that position as he works the trigger.

 

A novice has the gun aligned perfectly the shoots 8” low because he moves the gun as it fires. Flinches, or tightens all other fingers as the index finger pulls.

 

You need two things:

 

1. Learn to grip the gun hard. Firmly enough to make someone you’re giving a handshake to very uncomfortable. You can’t push it around as much with your trigger pull, and the sights will snap right back after you shoot. Squeeze til it shakes, then back off a little.

 

Dryfiring should make your forearms burn with the effort, at first.

 

2. Learn to work the trigger FAST without moving the sights much. For a novice, I’d say keeping the front post within the center 50% of the notch is a good goal to start. Pulling it slowly it should stay stationary. Gripping hard with the weak hand will help with this. But in a match and on the street you’re not going to slowly squeeze shots off, you’re going to rip them off. Work on that too.

Excellent! That’s just the kind of answer I was looking for.

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I don’t t think of it as trying to hold the sights motionless but rather it’s more like floating the sights on the target you’re trying to hit. Accept the wiggle or wobble, as long as you know and confirm in live fire what is an acceptable hit then you’re ok. One thing I also found out is it’s better to be deliberate and slow in dry fire than to go to pushing speed. Also your muscles don’t know the difference from forward or reverse so be deliberate in your draw or movement when going back to resting/starting position. 

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There is a basic "fast trigger pull" drill - align sights on a target and on beep fire as fast as you can without missing. You should be at 0.2 seconds or below to consider yourself being able to "pull the trigger fast without disturbing the sight picture." Now, find out the smallest target where you're at around 0.2 seconds with this drill. You'll notice that very small targets require you to use the "benchrest press" technique since small disturbance will make you miss, so there will be a limit on the target size that you can hit with "fast trigger pull." Anything smaller and you'll have to use much more static technique. This will be your "action shooting accuracy" limit. 

 

When this limit becomes significantly smaller than the area covered by your "front sight while still within the notch of the rear sight," only then can you start using "front sight within the rear notch" as your gauge for "accurate enough" shooting. Until then, you have to work on your technique, primarily grip and trigger pull. 

 

The problem with newer shooters is that even if they see the correct (acceptable) sight picture, many won't hit the target because they don't have refined enough trigger pull. So, it seems as if they are not seeing what they need to see, yet the problem is not in seeing the sights, but in pulling the trigger. You need to get to the point where your limit is not the trigger pull, but the sight picture. That's why you absolutely must confirm your dry fire with live fire quite often, and you have to compare sight pictures that you consider acceptable in dry fire with the hits you get in live fire. Once you have mastered this, dry fire becomes much more productive because you can push the limit and know that you will get hits in live fire since you know that you have good trigger pull that will not disturb the sight picture that you worked so hard to acquire at speed. 

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  • 3 weeks later...

I have noticed significant improvements in my trigger presses by doing 'trigger press at speed' in dryfire. basically you hold the unloaded and ready to fire pistol on target with your finger off or just barely on the trigger (no trigger prep), when the buzzer goes off, you press the trigger and drop the hammer. this will teach you 2 things.

 

1. how much/little pressure you need to apply to the trigger to make it go bang.

2. how to keep the signs from moving when you press the trigger.

 

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On 1/23/2019 at 3:09 PM, beta1759 said:

I have noticed significant improvements in my trigger presses by doing 'trigger press at speed' in dryfire. basically you hold the unloaded and ready to fire pistol on target with your finger off or just barely on the trigger (no trigger prep), when the buzzer goes off, you press the trigger and drop the hammer. this will teach you 2 things.

 

1. how much/little pressure you need to apply to the trigger to make it go bang.

2. how to keep the signs from moving when you press the trigger.

 

This is a good drill.  With your finger just barely on the trigger, you're essentially "slapping" the trigger when the buzzer goes off.  The only thing I can add is similar to what MemphisMechanic said.  Your forearm(s), especially your left forearm, should burn during dryfire.  Keep a gorilla grip on the gun with your left (support) hand and work on keeping the dot (front sight) still when you "slap" the trigger.  Working on this made a big difference for me.

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18 hours ago, mvmojo said:

This is a good drill.  With your finger just barely on the trigger, you're essentially "slapping" the trigger when the buzzer goes off.  The only thing I can add is similar to what MemphisMechanic said.  Your forearm(s), especially your left forearm, should burn during dryfire.  Keep a gorilla grip on the gun with your left (support) hand and work on keeping the dot (front sight) still when you "slap" the trigger.  Working on this made a big difference for me.

great point! Proper grip in dryfire is CRITICAL!

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If you mount a laser you'll be having target focus instead of sight focus, so generally it's not the proper training for iron sights divisions. Of course, you can always find some very specific drills where it would be helpful, e.g., you need to diagnose a specific problem and want to confirm what your muzzle is doing.

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  • 2 weeks later...
On 2/1/2019 at 1:25 PM, MisterPlink said:

My dryfire gun has a rail. Is mounting a laser useful or is the MantisX better?

MantisX and select "Compressed Surprise Break"

i am at mid/low 90 % at .16s  on a mostly stock Glock 34 with that usual sweep left 9 Oclock error 

 

the work continues,.....

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  • 4 weeks later...

For beginner, I think you better do 100% perfect sights alingment and no movement at all. That will help you to 1 build your Index and 2 learn call shots in dry fire , 3 improve trigger control

Edited by highhope
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  • 2 weeks later...

My goal during dryfire is to find that balance in a great grip VS Sight movement.  Then continue the repetition over and over.  I find that working my grip on the draw causes the majority of my sight movement.  So I practice that...  Every time I dryfire, as it is a quick drill that can be replicated at a match in the safe area to get my mindset correct and ready for a match

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