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Is Single Stack Dead?

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Combining SS minor with Production would result in SS race guns dominating the division the same way that 2011s dominate Glocks or SA/DA steel guns in Open. And for all the same reasons. 

 

Worse, Production, unlike any other division, has a dual role. One is a playground for those who choose it as their primary division, but another is to have new or occasional shooters compete in relatively stock division. Having Production be dominated by raced up 1911s would kill this second role. We might as well put new shooters straight into Limited or Open - many of us wouldn't care if we were starting today, but there are many more out there who would. I see it all the time with new shooters who feel intimidated by all the gear, then relax once they are told that they would be in a stock division. Even though it has no effect on their performance, they do feel better about it and are more inclined to give it a try and stick around. 

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As for what to do with SS, some combination with L10 would make a lot of sense. This is coming from an L10 shooter in a commie state. 

 

Since 1911 vs. 2011 is mostly a wash when capacity is restricted (SS already allows magwells, even if they are not as wide), and since SS rules are being loosened anyways (new rules allow DOH holsters and the silly "front strap above the top of the belt" high-riding holster is gone), the two divisions are already almost there - for all intents and purposes, the difference is now just "two rounds in major," "race holsters" and "location of magazine pouches." Besides, quite a few guys shoot their .45 1911s in L10 by just using extended magazines. 

 

Merging L10 and SS into one division would make sense. We, the poor saps in states such as CA get our "Commie Limited" division, 1911 purists get a division where they are competitive and Limited guys get a division where they can practice reloading on every move. Win - win. 

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I do not see 1911 dominating if combined with production. It's a less(relatively) reliable platform and a deep water to get into.

Now with Walther's Q5 match steel frame introduced, this is going to be interesting. Had I not started and stuck with 1911, I would probably start with this Walther, and stop worrying all the debates among different brands of 1911.

My opinion is same as before, a division L10minor/L8major, any gun.

 

 

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Noticed in the "equipment surveys" for SS Nats that minor looked to be used around 50%.  

 

Trend?

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5 hours ago, quliming said:

I do not see 1911 dominating if combined with production. It's a less(relatively) reliable platform and a deep water to get into.

Now with Walther's Q5 match steel frame introduced, this is going to be interesting. Had I not started and stuck with 1911, I would probably start with this Walther, and stop worrying all the debates among different brands of 1911.

My opinion is same as before, a division L10minor/L8major, any gun.

 

 

About a decade ago, I wrote about a match: Mid  Coast Duel Championship; SS and Production.  Dave S crushed Taran, simply because he had two extra rounds and could take more risk. 

 

A year or so ago, I wrote about a few top shooters using SS minor in an Area match, not because it was faster but the way the stages were designed, the two extra rounds mitigated some of the risk.

 

You can have a $5K SS and a $500 Production gun.  Different platforms.  Both do what they were designed to do.

 

I see no need to combine them.

 

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No 500 dollar gun won Production Nationals.

 

I can design stages that are 8 round friendly and make Production shooters reload just as often as SS.  That's not a challenge at all.

 

In fact, I can make those stages Major friendly and force the Minor shooters take more time to be more accurate. Hoser targets at even 15-20 yards can make a Minor shooter drop a ton of points and use up those extra rounds.

 

Of course putting 8 small poppers in a view is going to allow someone with 10 rounds to be much more aggressive.

 

The 2016 World Shoot was won by a guy shooting major in SS, and the Production guy had just as money in his gun.

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Would a tiered approach work for USPSA matches? 

Example is for level 1 matches all divisions stay current.

                          level 2 matches reduce divisions by one or two.  

                          level 3 matches reduce divisions by two or three

                          

This way the majority won't be affected, most don't go to bigger matches and less shooters get "stung".  As to which divisions get reduced I would think that would be best left up to the match director/jurisdiction where the match is held.  This could be an option too as opposed to being mandatory.                                                         

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I have shot most of the divisions.

Now I am getting back to classic/SS division. Mainly due to I am in Canada and can't use full cap mag....

28-30 rounds mags are fun...... No reload most stages. But not in Canada

 

Classic is the only division that I can use same setup to any country (Not US)

What I see in my area, classic and Open division are both growing.

Bad eyes go to open, slow legs go to classic. Ha ha!

Yes, we are all over 40

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On 1/4/2019 at 1:03 PM, quliming said:

I do not see 1911 dominating if combined with production. It's a less(relatively) reliable platform and a deep water to get into.

.

 

 

I’m not saying you’re wrong, but I think you may be surprised. I know all clubs are different, but some of the single stack guys local to me seriously bring the heat and typically are top 5 overall, ahead of the production guys. I know it’s not that way everywhere, and that not every club has single stack shooters at all, but just some food for thought.

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Our club has GM's in Single Stack minor and GM's in Production.  Some that shoot both.   The pistol matters just about never where they finish in the combined at the end of the day.  Regardless, there will be some perceived advantage, real or not, so throw in a 2.5lb trigger limit on minorSS-in-PD or something to even it out and see how that goes.

 

FWIW, I shot SS minor at Area matches and Nationals and Worlds.  It was slightly to somewhat of a loser compared to SS Major at all of them.  The speed difference is minimal because you can't afford C's and the few places going to 10 helps doesn't offset points dropped everywhere else, especially with lots of partial or moving targets.  People thought 10-rd SS might do better at Nationals because it was combined with a 10-round division, and it wasn't at PASA but it didn't, especially with so many SHO/WHO classifiers.

 

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