9mm Major Data-Shooters World Major Pistol Powder

[iflyskyhigh]

I also shot the same bullets that day with 6.4 gr. of N350 and got a velocity of 1291 FPS which is only 9 FPS slower than VV's published data for that load. My load length was .018 longer than theirs but I don't think my chrono is too far off. I have a shout out to a buddy to see if I can borrow his chrono to double check mine. Both loads were loaded with the same two scales  (I double check with both)) which had  calibrated. The two lots of SWMP I have purchased have had very different chrono results.

Which are the different lots you have again? And which lot gave you which results?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Dwbsig]

5 hours ago, zzt said:

 

About 10' really is okay. One foot either way will only add or subtract 6fps according to ballistic calculators.  The real problem is flight path.  If you consistently aim at the same spot when chronoing, you get a valid SD.  However, you do not necessarily know the actual velocity.  Any bullet path that is not directly down the long axis and parallel to the sensors is longer.  Since it is longer it takes more time to cross both sensors, resulting in a lower reported velocity.  The more off the correct path, the slower the velocity reported.  It varies by a surprising amount, and that may be why a lot of you are using more powder than others.

 

I rediscovered this while chronoing at my home club.  One of the pistol lanes is set up for accuracy testing with a Ransom rest.  Removing the rest leaves a solid pedestal.  I placed an 8' plank between the shooting table and the pedestal, set the chrono at the far end and wooden rests.  The height of the rest was set so that placing the bottom of the frame directly on the rest, the bullet path was correct.  This worked perfectly.  I had 6' between the muzzle and the first screen, and it was simple to correct to 10'.

 

One day I was testing a batch of ammo that should have been identical to the previous batches.  It wasn't.  WTH?  Why are these slower?  Well, my frame mount had loosened.  Instead of hitting where I was aiming at 25 yards they were 9" right and 12" high.  That accounted for the lost velocity.  So I decided to test.  With the mount tightened and everything set up properly.  I shot a string while intentionally aiming along a line from 2" left to 2" right.  Velocity was lower and SD was higher.  So even seemingly small variations make a difference.

 

As I mentioned earlier, I do chrono at 10' for PF, because I want to know what to expect at the chrono station at a major match.

    Thanks for this information very informative I always thought some the things you talked about had and influence on the numbers.  I thought it was probably insignificant but you have shed some light on the subject.

[mstewart]

The lot number was 514 and 8 lb. jug was mislabeled. I didn't record the lot number of the 1 lb, canister I first purchased.  But it was much faster than this lot. With 115 gr. CMJs it took .8 of a gr. more to reach the same velocities as lot 514. When I spoke to SW they tested the lot and said it was fine but they were using 124 gr. bullets for the data they sent. I did not have a 124 gr. bullets until later. Which were the results I posted earlier. Just seems their product has quite different performance lot to lot.

[mstewart]

1 minute ago, mstewart said:

The lot number was 514 and 8 lb. jug was mislabeled. I didn't record the lot number of the 1 lb, canister I first purchased.  But it was much faster than this lot. With 115 gr. CMJs it took .8 of a gr. more to reach the same velocities as lot 514. When I spoke to SW they tested the lot and said it was fine but they were using 124 gr. bullets for the data they sent. I did not have a 124 gr. bullets until later. Which were the results I posted earlier. Just seems their product has quite different performance lot to lot.

Sorry. I meant to say it took .8 of a grain more of lot 514 to reach the same velocity of the 1 lb. can I bought earlier.

[aandabooks]

I was out testing again today with a new open gun.  I loaded up a batch of 100 124gr RN Everglades over 10.0gr of SWMP.  The bottle I'm working with is from November of last year.  Just opened the first of 2 8lb jugs I bought a couple months ago.  

 

With my Czechmate 2 poppel holes I'm getting 1420FPS average 176 PF.  With the Carne 2 poppel holes I'm getting 1410FPS average 174.8 PF.  

 

I'm thinking about backing down to 9.8gr but the recoil and flatness of both guns feels pretty good right where they are.  

[iflyskyhigh]

Sorry. I meant to say it took .8 of a grain more of lot 514 to reach the same velocity of the 1 lb. can I bought earlier.

Seems like there are many different date stamps with the same lot number.

I take it the lot number is what makes the difference and not the date????


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[mstewart]

1 hour ago, iflyskyhigh said:

Seems like there are many different date stamps with the same lot number.

I take it the lot number is what makes the difference and not the date????


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

The lot number was what they referenced on their testing. But they were testing 124 gr. bullets and all I had was data on 115 gr. So it didn't mean much to me.

[TANFARM]

I had a reply from  Lovex on the lot 514 of Major Pistol and was told there were several jugs mislabeled Rifle and that’s the story.

I admit some relief considering the number of MP jugs in the basement!

[kamber]

Just got my recent order from Powder Valley placed in early April. 6x 8LB jugs; lot number 021120 314.

 

I believe previous know-slow batches ranged from October to January manufacture dates with lot number ending in 514.

Edited April 18, 2020 by kamber

[iflyskyhigh]

Just got my recent order from Powder Valley placed in early April. 6x 8LB jugs; lot number 021120 314.
 
I believe previous know-slow batches ranged from October to January manufacture dates with lot number ending in 514.

Has everyone with a 514 lot number had issues?

That’s what I was sent.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[SeattleDude]

I have couple 8LB jugs coming from Powder Valley too. I hope there is no issues with Super Slow speed. 

 

I am down to 6lb of singles that were purchased from Midsouth and they didnt have any issues.

[hurley326]

Has everyone with a 514 lot number had issues?

That’s what I was sent.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

No mine is fine same lot


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

[SeattleDude]

My batch of 10x 1LB cans with  514 lot number is right on point. I hope one that is now in route from PV will be same or close to same.

[Jamese35]

My 514 lot has been great and easier than i thought it was going to be to make power factor in my V10 tanfo. I'm at 10.3 grains on a 124 grain DGbullet with a over all length of 1.190. This is giving me a average of 174 power factor. I have all so gotten the same results out of a different lot number. My lowest power factor was a 173 and my highest is a 175. These numbers have been taken through a 30 round test through the crono.

[kamber]

Solid info. Looks like "514" isn't indicative of anything. Seem as though the slow lots were confined to a few particular dates-of-manufacture in Oct/Nov 2019.

Edited April 21, 2020 by kamber

[iflyskyhigh]

Solid info. Looks like "514" isn't indicative of anything. Seem as though the slow lots were confined to a few particular dates-of-manufacture in Oct/Nov 2019.

Great I have a 514 Lot from 11/22/19. Hope I didn’t get a lemon.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[kamber]

5 minutes ago, iflyskyhigh said:

Great I have a 514 Lot from 11/22/19. Hope I didn’t get a lemon.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

I think you're the only who one has posted about having the 11/22/2019 DOM lot so far, so hopefully you're good to go!

 

Multiple users reported slower-than-usual powder from the previous month's 10/22/2019 DOM lot ending in "314".

 

I believe @mstewart posted that he had a slower-than-usual lot ending in "514" that was coincidentally also mislabeled as "Major Rifle", but did not specify the DOM for that lot, only that it was purchased some months ago.

[iflyskyhigh]

[emoji1695]

I’ll let ya know. It’s gonna be awhile before I can work up some loads.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[SeattleDude]

just got couple of 8lb jugs of SWMP from Powder Valley.

 

Lot # 04 08 20  314

 

Hoping to test this weekend. I hope I didnt get the slow batch.

[SeattleDude]

After load development and bunch of testing with Montana Gold JHP 115gr and 124 grain bullets it was pretty clear that 314 lot is slower.

 

I was able to get to Major PF, but it took more powder. I worked with Shooters World support on lots 514 and 314.

 

I wanted to share with everyone that Shooters World support and communication was solid and they stand behind their product.

 

Please go to  www.shootersworldpowder.com   and toward bottom of the page you will find an official Lot 314 Letter from Karen and Ken.

 

Here is direct link to the Lot 314 Fix Letter. Click HERE for Official Letter

 

 

 

 

[Furrly]

Thanks for informing us!!! 

[Silent]

Chrono’d some loads today to make sure they were good before matches start again. This powder comes out of an 8 lbs jug labeled “Rifle” that I purchased last year. Can’t read the lot number because the label is faded for some reason.

 

124 gr. Everglades

1.16” OAL

9.7 gr. 
Atlas Choas

 

CCI Pistol Primers

168.5 PF

 

CCI Rifle Primers

170 PF

 

It was 90ish degrees here in AZ. Mainly did that to see how much, it at all, the primers would matter. 
 

 

[SeattleDude]

1 hour ago, Silent said:

Chrono’d some loads today to make sure they were good before matches start again. This powder comes out of an 8 lbs jug labeled “Rifle” that I purchased last year. Can’t read the lot number because the label is faded for some reason.

 

124 gr. Everglades

1.16” OAL

9.7 gr. 
Atlas Choas

 

CCI Pistol Primers

168.5 PF

 

CCI Rifle Primers

170 PF

 

It was 90ish degrees here in AZ. Mainly did that to see how much, it at all, the primers would matter. 
 

 

 

Looks like you have Lot 514 (fast lot)

[kamber]

I find it interesting that there are slow lots of 314 being produced, with normal lots of 514 in between.

 

Example:

A bunch of users reported slow 314 lots from Oct '19. There were then users who purchased lots ending in "514" with Nov '19 dates of manufacture (no reports yet on if these were slow or normal). Now we're seeing some 314 lots again with February '20 and April '20 dates of manufacture.

 

If SWMP is one distinct product formulation, then why are there two "lots" being produced in alternate months? If the issue is confined to only 314 lots, what exactly is different about the 514 lot? Two different manufacturing plants attempting to produce the same formulation? Certainly, it can't shouldn't be an intentionally different formulation.

 

Is my understanding of the term "lot" simply incorrect? I've always assumed the term "lot" to be somewhat synonymous with "distinct batch". I'm curious as to what the "314" and "514" actually indicates or what the difference is between the two, because it certainly isn't a distinct number assigned to a particular production batch if we are seeing both 314 and 514 lots alternating throughout 8+ manufacture dates. This isn't a case of one particular date-of-manufacture being slow either, since SW is acknowledging that the last three digits define the lot number and that multiple lots ending with 314 have been discovered to exhibit slower burn rate.

 

I must be missing or misunderstanding something; going to shoot SW an e-mail and report back with any findings.

[AHI]

have them explain ther 12 digit "lot number"if you can get them to answer. you may  learn it has more to do with when it was bottled not manufactured.

Shooters World only bottles the powder they dont make any thing. Its only a matter when  not if they put clean shot in a bottle labeled major or rifle.

       Been holding that one back too long. I know the guys that invested in SW they know there is a Quality control issue and it may get worse before it gets better.

Test every bottle never just start loading.

Edited May 10, 2020 by AHI