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Thaunk

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I’m  not sure this counts as a shooting technique but it’s like shooting adjacent.  I can’t seem to run during a stage.  No matter what I think I’m doing it’s an inelegant trot at it’s fastest.  When the 35 year old loses a stage to the senior citizen with two bad knees it’s time to start asking questions.  So I’m summary what did you do, if anything, to get comfortable running with a pistol?

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I’m  not sure this counts as a shooting technique but it’s like shooting adjacent.  I can’t seem to run during a stage.  No matter what I think I’m doing it’s an inelegant trot at it’s fastest.  When the 35 year old loses a stage to the senior citizen with two bad knees it’s time to start asking questions.  So I’m summary what did you do, if anything, to get comfortable running with a pistol?
you're scared of running with a loaded gun and getting a DQ. We've all been there at some point in the beginning.

At home in dry fire, practice keeping the gun at face level pointed down range. Keeping the gun in your visual periphery will alleviate worrying about where the muzzle is pointed.

Then step it up to live fire practice and keep the loaded gun at face level, practice running and driving it back out on target. Be confident and keep that finger off the trigger when moving.

Sent from my SM-N950U using Tapatalk

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I agree with the comments above and would add, you might set up some exercise drills with orange cones (moving side to side and back/forth) along with a hand stopwatch (record the times).  Depending on comfort level, you might try running them with an empty gun to develop those skills of moving while carrying.  As you begin to see improvements (you may need to do some jogging or walking, etc. along the way), then incorporate some targets along the way and work on pointing/transitioning (dry and ultimately live fire), and  keep up with the data.  Personally, I calculate the hit factor for all my runs and may be something worth trying as well.      

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9 hours ago, Thaunk said:

 what did you do to get comfortable running with a LOADED pistol?

 

I had hunted with a loaded rifle and/or pistol for decades before USPSA.

 

You will feel much more comfortable running with a loaded pistol in

your hand, iff you make sure your finger is out of the trigger guard (as

a matter of fact, you will NOT get a DQ if you do that).     :) 

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Practice running with scissors I guess. IMHO, if you're not moving fast when the stage absolutely requires a good bit of movement to get to the next position, my guess is you're not leaving the first position hard enough. A quick explosion out of the first position will set you up for quick movement. Breaking the last shot, slowly dismounting the gun, and easing in the direction is just setting you up for slow movement. Likewise on the other end of the spectrum. Having the gun up and ready to fire the instant you have a decent sight picture is a must. I would work on running but also on entry / exits. 

 

Planning the the stage to take targets while moving when possible will also naturally cut down on distance. Speaking of plans, are you programming and visualizing the stage in advance, or trying to "think" your way through the stage. I know you've seen someone fire their last shot in a position and have that brief hesitation with that "where do I go now" look on their face. Then they remember and start moving slowly. Also shot calling practice. Calling your last shot allows you to get moving faster. 

 

It's very easy to practice these in dry fire. Just always be aware of muzzle direction and trigger discipline. Even in your walkthroughs, simulate having the gun down range and finger off the trigger when not engaging targets. As far as being completely comfortable running with a hot pistol, I'm not sure I'll ever get there. A little respect is a good thing and will help keep you out of Dairy Queen's drive through. 

 

All common knowledge here I know. But sometimes we can't see the forrest for the trees. Just things that have helped me and still all a work in progress. 

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Practice running with scissors I guess. IMHO, if you're not moving fast when the stage absolutely requires a good bit of movement to get to the next position, my guess is you're not leaving the first position hard enough. A quick explosion out of the first position will set you up for quick movement. Breaking the last shot, slowly dismounting the gun, and easing in the direction is just setting you up for slow movement. Likewise on the other end of the spectrum. Having the gun up and ready to fire the instant you have a decent sight picture is a must. I would work on running but also on entry / exits. 
 
Planning the the stage to take targets while moving when possible will also naturally cut down on distance. Speaking of plans, are you programming and visualizing the stage in advance, or trying to "think" your way through the stage. I know you've seen someone fire their last shot in a position and have that brief hesitation with that "where do I go now" look on their face. Then they remember and start moving slowly. Also shot calling practice. Calling your last shot allows you to get moving faster. 
 
It's very easy to practice these in dry fire. Just always be aware of muzzle direction and trigger discipline. Even in your walkthroughs, simulate having the gun down range and finger off the trigger when not engaging targets. As far as being completely comfortable running with a hot pistol, I'm not sure I'll ever get there. A little respect is a good thing and will help keep you out of Dairy Queen's drive through. 
 
All common knowledge here I know. But sometimes we can't see the forrest for the trees. Just things that have helped me and still all a work in progress. 
great tips!

Sent from my SM-N950U using Tapatalk

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I'm sure it took me a while to get used to moving quickly with a handgun in my hand. Dry firing surely helped with making it instinctive to get the trigger finger up on the gun frame when not shooting. Also dry fire mixed with movement in various directions - while ensuring that the gun is pointed in the safe direction at all times. Those things become more or less instinctive with enough repetitions.

 

Knowing you will be safe increases confidence. It is easier to go fast when you are confident.

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this may sound obvious, but I would practice running with a gun if I were you. make it normal.  Set up dryfire positions 5-8 yards apart and run between them. 

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A lot of folks that don't run still lay down ok times, they do it by leaving immediately, shooting as soon as possible, not adding positions, not stopping unless necessary, not slowing down to reload, and not stopping short, or over running.

 

Running with a gun doesn't bother me, never has. If I'm leaving slow, or not running with maximum effort it's probably because my planning/memorization sucked. You have to figure out why you're not getting in gear and fix that, if it is running with a gun that bothers you, you need a practice range you can do that at safely and get after it. Steve Anderson's Drag Race or Call and Leave it drills are great for short runs between positions.

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Set up a "hoser stage", say 5 targets down the left side of a 25 yard long bay - 1 every 4 yards or so. Make them easy, say 3 yards away... and practice running down the stage, shooting each one twice, but never stopping.  That should help you get more comfortable shooting easy targets on the move AND more comfortable moving with your pistol.

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2 hours ago, motosapiens said:

this may sound obvious, but I would practice running with a gun if I were you. make it normal.  Set up dryfire positions 5-8 yards apart and run between them. 

 

This.

 

Dryfire. Not live fire. Strip it down to focusing on one skill. Start with the gun up on one target, run down your longest hallway at home, and take a sight picture at another.

 

Confirm your finger is straight along the frame, push off, then pump the arms agressively - don’t be afraid to swing the hand with the gun in it.

 

Prop your cellphone up to record your movement and review it. The video is important; It will feel like youre running when you’re trotting. It’ll feel like you’re at breakneck speed before you’re actually moving fast.

 

Most of us haven’t run at more than 50% of our  maximum possible speed since high school P.E. class. Your literally have no what fast movement feels like.

 

The only thing I focused on in this stage was my foot speed, and I know I’m only at 80% of what I should be:

 

 

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12 hours ago, Part_time_redneck said:

Practice running with scissors I guess. IMHO, if you're not moving fast when the stage absolutely requires a good bit of movement to get to the next position, my guess is you're not leaving the first position hard enough. A quick explosion out of the first position will set you up for quick movement. Breaking the last shot, slowly dismounting the gun, and easing in the direction is just setting you up for slow movement. Likewise on the other end of the spectrum. Having the gun up and ready to fire the instant you have a decent sight picture is a must. I would work on running but also on entry / exits. 

 

Planning the the stage to take targets while moving when possible will also naturally cut down on distance. Speaking of plans, are you programming and visualizing the stage in advance, or trying to "think" your way through the stage. I know you've seen someone fire their last shot in a position and have that brief hesitation with that "where do I go now" look on their face. Then they remember and start moving slowly. Also shot calling practice. Calling your last shot allows you to get moving faster. 

 

It's very easy to practice these in dry fire. Just always be aware of muzzle direction and trigger discipline. Even in your walkthroughs, simulate having the gun down range and finger off the trigger when not engaging targets. As far as being completely comfortable running with a hot pistol, I'm not sure I'll ever get there. A little respect is a good thing and will help keep you out of Dairy Queen's drive through. 

 

All common knowledge here I know. But sometimes we can't see the forrest for the trees. Just things that have helped me and still all a work in progress. 

 

A good friend of mine diagnosed that same thing.  I’m not pushing off hard enough and I do apparently have a very very pregnant pause before I get moving.  I feel like I’m got good planning for a stage but it doesn’t seem to stick in my head.  My current style is post and blast to try and remove some of the movement in a stage.

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Trail running shoes Help with running on funky terrain. As well, Hwansik Kim was a guest on Fire Arms Nation podcast a few weeks back and got super descriptive about explosive movement.

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I was working on increasing my speed and like you felt I was hauling ass but the video proved otherwise. 

It took watching some videos on instagram and seeing guys drop their support hand and even pump their strong hand some while running to see what the real speed looks like. It is intimidating to feel like you’re giving up some control of the gun but the reality is your finger is just as off the trigger and the muzzle is just as down range as if you were taking baby steps. 

Steve Anderson’s exercise of facing uprange and pivoting your body and drawing on a target behind you  without moving your feet further illustrated to me that you can do ‘odd’ things with your gun in hand and still be safe. 

As stated above exits and entries are where the time is but that longest yard between them can be pushed hard with some practice 

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I'm working on similar stuff-

If you are slow to get moving out of position, then you are probably like me and not low enough while shooting.  You have to kind of tip forward slowly in order to get going if you standing tall.  A drop step can help but its way better to just start shooting low like a tennis player waiting for a return. Dang its a hard habit to break, the whole slowly-straightening-the-legs thing as I finish out an array.  

I actually do run between positions but I want to do it faster.  I currently run with the pistol high and flat like I'm trying not to spill a glass of water. You can only run so fast like that.  If I want to run at my actual top speed, I'm going to need to start pumping BOTH arms, like you see our top guys doing.  That's going to take some practice to avoid an actual or perceived 180 dq.  If you are going to learn to run with the gun, learn to do it the best & fastest way.  

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On 11/1/2018 at 2:24 PM, MemphisMechanic said:

 

 

 

 

 

Hmmmm, wonder if shaving my legs would help?

 

:)

 

I need to ask a friend to video me at a match or two, confirm that my perceptions of gaps are the real gaps that I need to put 1st priority on.

 

Suspect that the o.p. might be in the same boat. 

 

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17 minutes ago, IHAVEGAS said:

 

 

Hmmmm, wonder if shaving my legs would help?

 

:)

 

No idea. Never done it! :D 

Edited by MemphisMechanic

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On 11/3/2018 at 9:00 AM, highhope said:

run with a gun at home

 

Sounds simple, but effective.


I live in a cramped suburban neighborhood but I have a fenced yard, so I try all kinds of drills outside. I'm in a VERY anti-gun state, so it felt weird at first...

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Muzzle discipline is a must.  Also, It helps to focus on stopping points during a walk through.  Focus on getting to those points efficiently instead of walking/jogging towards targets.  The stopping points should allow targets to appear as long as your footwork is correct.  

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It took me a while to get comfortable with it. Started with a brisk walk, lol. What made me “gun shy” was losing a few magazines one time. Having a quality belt helps with that.

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Im gonna say its not foot speed youre missing but efficiency of movement.  You can brute force speed your way thru a stage but if youre not efficient the old guy with so so knees & recent back surgery will have a better score....

Explosive movements are important but top speed isnt as critical as efficiency.... imho

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You occasionally come across a stage where there's enough distance for "brute speed" to matter too, but yes, efficiency is important. Just yesterday, I set up a little drill with two "boxes" a couple of meters apart: draw and shoot one, move to the other box and shoot one. I discovered that I was taking forever to shoot, once I got to the other box. Unfortunately, I was out of ammo when I realized it. I need to remember there's a target there, and set up for it, well before arriving at the next location.

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Here is my take. Make sure you start running as soon as you fire the last shot in the array. Trigger breaks, sight lifts, you start running as hard as you can immediately with that finger off the trigger. Also make sure that you are not standing straight up while you are shooting. Knees should be bent when you are shooting so you can push off immediately with as much force as possible going to the next position.

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