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Jess409

Is vvn320 worth the extra cost

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I’m currently using titegroup for my 9 minor and 40 major loads. The titegroup load is recent and seems to be working fine. I’m using 5.1 gr, 180 Berry’s fp, mixed brass, 1.185” oacl, PF 171. My question is. Is it worth the extra cost to get vvn320? And are the differences noticeable? If so, what are the differences that justified the extra cost of using vvn320? Thank you.

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yes, definitely worth it.

especially for 9 minor.  

N320 takes up more volume, meters better, and is way cleaner burning.

load wise, its a little behind  titegroup, you'll need about 5-10% more by weight to make the same PF.

 

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My opinion...not really.  It's a fine powder and there's nothing I don't like about it, but it's not worth twice the price of other powders that do 98% of what it does.  That said, I really don't like TG.  Yes, it works.  Yes, it's cheap.  Yes, it seems to deliver acceptable accuracy without much effort.  It's also pretty dirty, smoky, and gets the pistol really hot really fast.  I don't like cleaning guns, so anything that runs really dirty is an issue for me ;)

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I've never used N320, but WW231 is definitely worth it - been using it for decades

 

for both 9mm and .45.       :wub:

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Prima SV for 40cal and Prima V for 9m is a Great alternative to N320.. ,.very reasonably priced.. 

W231 also good.. 

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If you are looking for a softer round then N320 is worth the difference. It is cleaner burning, cooler and gives enough percieved recoil reduction that there is a definate measurable difference. That said, Sport Pistol is N320's twin brother. It gives the soft recoil, is cooler burning, cleaner burning and has the versitilty to be used with coated bullets for a fairly good sized reduction in smoke.  It costs the same or less than TG and is spot on lot to lot  I have found in the 14 guns i have tried SP in to be more accurate than N320 at lower power factors. At Major only a slight edge to SP.  Buy a bottle of N320 and SP and compare, then let us know what you think. I believe you will find either a step up.

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To bowenbuilt. Do you have a pet load for the SP (40 major)? And what would be a good start load? I’m shooting a STI EDGE Benny Hill custom with a 5” KKM Bull barrel. I will load to 1.185 oacl. And how does it meter? I have a Dillon xl650.

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I am only using N320 for now. I don't shoot as much as before so I am not picky about the price. What I like about it is consistency. It meters really well, +/- 10fps. 

 

Should I be shooting over 1k a month, I'd go with W231 (same charge, finer powder),  or BA 9.5.

 

4.7gr N320, 200gr Zero, 1.175", 5" kkm, 174PF.

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I'm down to my last few pounds of N-320 after using it exclusively for several years.  Right now it's readily available but that was not the case several years ago when I ran out.

 

Based on favorable comments here on the forum, I plan on giving Sport Pistol a try.  If I like it and its nearly as clean as N-320 then I'm saving around $15 per pound.  If not, I'll once again stock up on N-320.

 

Looking at the big picture, paying an extra $15 every 2000 rds or so is not a big deal.

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Current N320 user here for 9 minor.  I find tight group to be flawed in a number of ways.  With its high nitroglycerin content, its temp sensitive and gets the gun hot.  It is not bulky and is easier to double charge a case and blow up a pistol but it is cheap.  I found N320 to be bulkier, more consistent, cleaner, and softer but it is much more expensive.

 

I recently evaluated Alliant Sport Pistol and basically found it to be the twin of N320 charge and velocity wise.  Its temp stable, meters better, and has less smoke than N320 and Titegroup.  It is a little less bulky than N320 so a minor adjustment on the powder measure is needed. There is a noteworthy amount of loading data appropriate for what we do for 9 and 40 including 160 grain 9mm bullets and 200 grain 40 bullets, lead bullets, plated and maybe coated.  

 

I am switching over to Sport Pistol picking up my first 8 pounds this weekend.  Its going to be  lot easier to put 32 pounds of Sport Pistol aside for the next democrat in the Whitehouse than it would be for N320.  N320 is now my second choice and I find it superior to Titegroup.

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Thank you all for the replies. I just ordered 4lbs of Sport Pistol and am goin to work up some loads. I’ll let you know my results if any of you are interested. After quite a bit of research I have yet to hear anything negative about SP. 

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On 10/4/2018 at 7:18 PM, Jess409 said:

Thank you all for the replies. I just ordered 4lbs of Sport Pistol and am goin to work up some loads. I’ll let you know my results if any of you are interested. After quite a bit of research I have yet to hear anything negative about SP. 

 

Results please. I am just getting started with reloading that this is the first time I've heard of Sport Pistol.

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I like N320 as it runs super clean. I run 5.3 behind a MG, CCI primers and mixed brass. I love the powder. Haven’t used tite group before. All I can say is I enjoy shooting VV. Gun is rarely dirty and smoke is not a problem. 

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I've used it. I like it. The cost of powder is the cheapest part of reloading. So, if you like it, and it works for you, then I'd say it's gtg. However, I choose others because I think they're just as good, clean, accurate, meter just as good. 

 

So,... Why not save a few bucks.  

 

 

 

 

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I normally use WST for my normal loads but recently got some N320 to try out. So far, I really like it. Has a soft recoil pulse but very similar to WST. Plan on using WST for practice and N320 for matches.

 

Still need to do more testing but I load about the same for both powders at 170(ish) pf

4.7gr 180gr Blue Bullet @1.18", 5" Schuemann

4.2gr 200gr Blue Bullet, @1.18", 5" Schuemann  

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On 11/3/2018 at 10:50 PM, Novagunner said:

I normally use WST for my normal loads but recently got some N320 to try out. So far, I really like it. Has a soft recoil pulse but very similar to WST. Plan on using WST for practice and N320 for matches.

 

Still need to do more testing but I load about the same for both powders at 170(ish) pf

4.7gr 180gr Blue Bullet @1.18", 5" Schuemann

4.2gr 200gr Blue Bullet, @1.18", 5" Schuemann  

Hey Nova - Do you notice the N320 being significantly cleaner ? Your WST loads are similar to what I run and haven't had a reason to want to switch it up but you never know 😎😎

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I have only shot  about 500 rounds of it. So far It does seem a little less sooty than WST.   I'm mainly trying it out because a buddy of mine who shoots n320 said that he doesn't see much of a  velocity swing with temperature fluctuation. I end up bumping WST up .1 when I have to chrono in hotter weather just want to dial in a consistent light load so that I don't have to keep track of it. 

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On 10/2/2018 at 10:25 PM, Jess409 said:

I’m currently using titegroup for my 9 minor and 40 major loads. The titegroup load is recent and seems to be working fine. I’m using 5.1 gr, 180 Berry’s fp, mixed brass, 1.185” oacl, PF 171. My question is. Is it worth the extra cost to get vvn320? And are the differences noticeable? If so, what are the differences that justified the extra cost of using vvn320? Thank you.

 

The question I have is why?

 

Don't we reload to shoot, so if your loads meet PF and your happy with them why change? 

 

Here’s an article on actually measured recoil force of 9 mm powders, including TG. 

https://www.ssusa.org/articles/2017/6/19/gunpowder-selection-for-controlling-recoil/

 

I believe much of our “felt” recoil results from powders is more based on personal feel than measurable data. 

 

I personally tried WST, X700 and TG in 40 Major loads and could not tell an difference in cleanliness, smoke or recoil. Gun TF limited, PD 180 Gr FMJ HP.

 

I decided to load both 9mm and 40 with TG to keep it simple, just one powder. 

 

BTW, WST metered well, X700 didn’t. 

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57 minutes ago, HesedTech said:

 

The question I have is why?

(...)

I personally tried WST, X700 and TG in 40 Major loads and could not tell an difference in cleanliness, smoke or recoil. Gun TF limited, PD 180 Gr FMJ HP.

 

I decided to load both 9mm and 40 with TG to keep it simple, just one powder. 

 

BTW, WST metered well, X700 didn’t. 

 

You've tried a few different powders but not N320. There's no harm in trying some powders to see if there's one  that works best for you.

 

N320 is another powder that works great for 9mm Minor and .40 Major. I use it for .45ACP Major, too, but it is a little on the slow side there, at least with 230 grain bullets.

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320 is a good powder, I used it for 40 major and liked it. When it got hard or impossible to find I switched to TG and never saw a good reason to go back.---------------Larry

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6 hours ago, perttime said:

 

You've tried a few different powders but not N320. There's no harm in trying some powders to see if there's one  that works best for you.

 

 

Yes there’s no harm in trying anything and that’s the beauty of the loading side of the shooting sports hobby. 

 

The OPs question is, “... is it worth the cost..” Like him I considered N320 and perused the Internet for an answer. What I found was that for almost double the cost no one had a compellingly reason for me to give it a try. 

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I looked into these powders after seeing a lot of people talk about how great they are. But man, the price difference is insane. 45 bucks for 1lb, and I thought regular powders were starting to get expensive at 27 dollars. 

 

Im gonna keep using titegroup. I see absolutely no downsides to it. 

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1 hour ago, Jfitz427 said:

I looked into these powders after seeing a lot of people talk about how great they are. But man, the price difference is insane. 45 bucks for 1lb, and I thought regular powders were starting to get expensive at 27 dollars. 

 

Im gonna keep using titegroup. I see absolutely no downsides to it. 

PowderValley has 4lb jugs of VV N320 for $142.50 shipped, which includes hazmat fee. That breaks down to $35.62 a pound. Buy 8lbs and it drops the price to $32.36 per lb. Buy 16lbs and it drops the price to $30.36 per lb.

 

If you are buying powder in your local GS, you are doing it wrong.

 

By comparison, PowderValley has Titegroup for $293.80 for 16lbs...which breaks down to $18.36 per lb.

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31 minutes ago, GrumpyOne said:

PowderValley has 4lb jugs of VV N320 for $142.50 shipped, which includes hazmat fee. That breaks down to $35.62 a pound. Buy 8lbs and it drops the price to $32.36 per lb. Buy 16lbs and it drops the price to $30.36 per lb.

 

If you are buying powder in your local GS, you are doing it wrong.

 

By comparison, PowderValley has Titegroup for $293.80 for 16lbs...which breaks down to $18.36 per lb.

Ya, maybe i should start buying in greater bulk. I guess that offsets the s#!tty hazmat charge. 

 

I’ve settled on hs6 for 9 major, and  titegroup for 9 minor and 40. 

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