New XL650 - 5.56 Prep & Reloading Questions

[LowBoost]

I just got an XL650 to bulk prep my 9mm brass (which is loaded on an S1050).

I realized since it is so easy to do caliber changes with the 650, that I would get one to prep my 5.56LC brass and also reload it.

 

I am looking for validation on the process / gear I believe I should use.

 

1) Caliber conversion kit - $80

2) Quick change - $117

3) Casefeed plate (Small Rifle)  - $40

4) Rapid Trim/Size Die  -  Should I go with carbide or steel?

3) Additional toolhead (Alum) One for brass prep, one for reloading) - $35

 

-- 5.56 Prep Tool Head—

1) Mighty Armory Decap/Resize Die 

2) Swage IT (Need to remove priming unit when preparing brass / re-install for reloading)

3) Dillon RT1500 

4) Lyman M Die (To remove Inside burr in cases)

 

 

-- 5.56 Reloading Tool Head -- (Here's where I have doubts)

1) Do I need a resizing die here or can I skip since I already did when preparing the brass? (I have a Redding I can use in this toolhead)

2) Priming

3) Power Die/Measure

4) Seating Die

6) Crimp Die

 

 

Edited September 13, 2018 by LowBoost

[stick]

If you already have a 1050 why would you prep/load on a 650?  the 1050 is far superior for 223 prep than the 650.  The 1050 has a built in swage, where the swage-it on the 650 is aftermarket and doesn't compare to the one in the 1050.

I only have a 650, so I prep and load on the same press.  BTW, I'm always having to tighten the screws on my Swage-it.  They come loose after 100 rounds or so.  The RT1500 is pretty awesome, just hook a vacuum up to it.

[Glock021]

If I had a 1050 then I would prep with it just for the swager.

 

Here's how I am set up for the 650.

 

Prep

1)  Universal decapping die

2)  Empty

3)  RT1200

4)  Empty

5)  Lyman M die

 

I remove the crimps off press and chamfer/debur if necessary.  With the M die it usually isn't required.

 

Load

1)  Empty

2)  Prime and Powder

3)  Empty (I hope to have a bullet feeder here some day)

4)  Seat

5)  Crimp

 

 

 

 

 

[RiggerJJ]

Why do you need to prep 9mm? You can swaged it on your 1050 if it's mil brass, and it should not need trimming. Just clean it and run it thru the 1050, it's got more than enough die spots for one pass. I just do one pass on all my pistol ammo.

 

As for 556, glock021 has the answer above...don't forget to use lube on the 1st pass and tumble/remove it before the 2nd pass...

Edited September 13, 2018 by RiggerJJ

[LowBoost]

Answers to all questions (so far).

 

Q. If you already have a 1050 why would you prep/load on a 650?

A. I am reloading a decent amount amount of 9mm (Four of us shooting makes 2,500+ a month). I simply don't want to touch my S1050 as it is pretty much dialed in.

 

Q. Why do you need to prep 9mm?

A. I would not call it 9mm brass prep as there is no trimming, but I will process thousands of brass a month and unlike many that enjoy (and can spend lots of time) taking care of the brass processing, time is the one thing I don't have (or can buy, pun intended). As mentioned in my initial post, the main purpose of the 650 is to decap and re-size bulk brass, then wet tumble / dry and have it ready for loading in the 1050. (I don't want to decap / re-size dirty brass in my 1050! Yes, I am OCD and I know it!)

 

Since it is so easy/quick to make a caliber change in the 650, I saw an opportunity to do volume loading for 5.56 instead of using a single stage. I just wanted to validate the required die configuration before moving ahead. The Swage-IT is to have the entire 5.56 brass prep cycle complete in a single pass. This will allow me to process more brass and get to spend more time with the family!

 

Glock021 - Thanks for the setup validation. I completely forgot about station #3 for a bullet feeder in the future. I appreciate everyone's comments and suggestions.

                     I already ran a test batch (9mm) and the 650 with the upgrades runs really smooth. 

 

Now I need to update my sale thread and add the new Trim Mate case prep center I have as well!

New Reloading Gear For Sale!

Edited September 13, 2018 by LowBoost

[RiggerJJ]

Nevermind...

[AHI]

Sell the 650 buy second 1050. Just a guess ether you just got the 1050 or you have,t been reloading very long.

 option 2 buy some 9mm brass so you can load 8 to 10k at a time. once tool heads are set up changing to the next caliber only takes 15 or so min. 

When I got my 1050 it took a while to get it "dialed in" there for I did't wot to touch anything for quit a while.Then I througed the dillon dies out installed

Redding dies and all my problems went away.

[LowBoost]

Well... You guys win. I had a nice chat with Dillon support.

I am returning the XL650 and exchanging for an S1050!

 

Thanks for the help and steering me in the right direction.

 

Edited September 14, 2018 by LowBoost

[RiggerJJ]

Cool, I think you will like it.

 

Disclamer; I'm not saying I am the end all for reloading, I just have been doing it for a while and have  been there, done that on a lot of stuff. You are the ultimate decision  maker for your set up...

 

That being said, I for one don't think you need another press, even with the volume you do. I do similar volumes of 9mm, 40, 45, 223, and 308 on one 1050, and have gotten good at reducing press time. I am not automated and don't have a bullet feeder...

 

Now let's look at your process, again, you can do what you want, I'm just saying what I have figured out over years of trial and error. Processing 9mm (or any pistol brass) is a total waste of the time you are spending processing it. Clean the brass, and load it. Pistol primer pockets do not need to be cleaned after decapping. One pass is all you need to produce excellent ammo. 1.Decap/size 2. Swage/expand 3. Primer 4. Powder. 5. Empty or bullet feeder 6. Seat 7. Crimp. You can run over 1k rounds an hour just coasting on pistol ammo this way.

 

For 223, you will need to process, and end up cleaning the primer pockets after processing, but that is not the porpose of processing. It's actually because you will need to trim, and the head won't allow for enough dies because the size of the trimmer will not allow dies to be placed in the positions next to it. Also, you MUST lube rifle brass, and you will need to remove the lube after processing. As I indicated before, glock023 has the right idea for the 2 different heads used to end up with loaded 223 ammo, everyone has their own tweeks they do. For example, I use the swage hold down die for case mouth expansion instead of a Mdie.

jmho...enjoy

jj

Edited September 15, 2018 by RiggerJJ

[LowBoost]

RJJ:

 

Understood. So one tool head for processing as the RT1500 will not allow space to install dies next to it.

I assume for 5.56 I will wet tumble twice. Before and after processing.

 

LB

[RiggerJJ]

I don't wet tumble, again, I find the time involved is too great.

I clean (by dry tumble) 223 prior to each head. Once to get it all cleaned up before running it. And again after processing so it's not all slimy from the lube after loading...

 

I also clean pistol brass twice, because I use lube. (I like the reduction in effort and the consistent ammo I get, it's another controversy like wet vs dry tumbling)

Once before running it to clean it, and again after loading to remove the lube. (tumbling loaded ammo causes no problems)

jj

[dlightning]

Do you dry tumble loaded ammo?  

[RiggerJJ]

I dry tumble loaded pistol ammo because I use Dillon lube and only one pass on one head.

 

With rifle ammo, I tumble to clean it before processing the brass, lube it for sizing, then tumble it again to remove the lube before running the brass thru the loading head. No need to tumble it after loading cause it's already clean and no lube is needed just to put primer powder and bullet in the sized and prepped brass.

[rustychev]

only thing I do different that what you list is on the load head first stage I use a Lee universal decap die to make sure teh flash hole is clear.