B_RAD Posted June 24, 2018 Share Posted June 24, 2018 (edited) I switched to blue bullets a few weeks ago. On bullets that have been chambered I've noticed an indention. When switching to these bullets I did not adjust my seating die. These rounds have been 100 percent reliable and the accuracy does not seem to be affected by this. The blue bullets are longer than the Xtreme so by my math, the bullet was seated the same depth inside the case but since they worked I saw no need to seat them any deeper. This was before I noticed this issue. The OAL length of the round is 1.250". Like I said, so far these have been reliable, but the bullets are hitting and being marred. One would think the chances for a malfunction would be higher. I'm guessing here but it looks like the round is hitting the top of the feed ramp? BTW I'm using a 10# recoil spring. Thinking I should experiment with shorter OAL (and reduce the charge). Thoughts? Edited June 24, 2018 by B_RAD Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B_RAD Posted June 24, 2018 Author Share Posted June 24, 2018 Try a higher resolution pic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve RA Posted June 24, 2018 Share Posted June 24, 2018 You might check and see if your seating die has changeable seating tips. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve RA Posted June 24, 2018 Share Posted June 24, 2018 If the bullets are longer and the overall length is the same they would have to be seated deeper into the case. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hi-Power Jack Posted June 24, 2018 Share Posted June 24, 2018 Is that mark there after reloading, and before you chamber them ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B_RAD Posted June 24, 2018 Author Share Posted June 24, 2018 4 minutes ago, Hi-Power Jack said: Is that mark there after reloading, and before you chamber them ? No. It happens from being chambered. It's not there from reloading. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GrumpyOne Posted June 24, 2018 Share Posted June 24, 2018 I bet the mark is there from the bottom of the feed ramp, not the top. Slide comes forward, driving the round into the bottom of the ramp, then the round continues upwards into the chamber. 8 have seen this with my own reloads using a softer lead bullet head, and it's usually on flat points or truncated cones. I don't recall ever seeing this with a round nose (lead or jacketed). What bullets did you switch from? What bullet profile? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B_RAD Posted June 24, 2018 Author Share Posted June 24, 2018 I need to correct some info up top. My current load of 180 gr blue bullets are at 1.215". Not 1.250". I was using Xtrme 180 FP loaded to 1.185". I was also incorrect about the base of the bullet being seated to the same depth. The BB are .632" and the Xtreme .575". I must have adjusted to get the blues down to where they are now. The profiles are different between the two but I think the softer blue is why it's deforming. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Furrly Posted June 25, 2018 Share Posted June 25, 2018 1.185 and your good to go.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ssanders224 Posted June 25, 2018 Share Posted June 25, 2018 I can tell you exactly what it is.... and it is not from the loading process. This type of mark happens when the bottom of the edge of the ramp hits the top round in the mag as the barrel is traveling rearward/unlocking. Shortening your length may help some, but probably won't cure it. The main culprit is that when your barrel is at its most rearward position, the feed ramp sticks out past the frame. Most likely, this has always happened, you just notice it more on the soft lead bullet. It can be a real pain to correct. You will probably have to shorten the bottom corner of the ramp, so that it protrudes less when the barrel is against the VIS. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B_RAD Posted June 25, 2018 Author Share Posted June 25, 2018 9 minutes ago, Ssanders224 said: I can tell you exactly what it is.... and it is not from the loading process. This type of mark happens when the bottom of the edge of the ramp hits the top round in the mag as the barrel is traveling rearward/unlocking. Shortening your length may help some, but probably won't cure it. The main culprit is that when your barrel is at its most rearward position, the feed ramp sticks out past the frame. Most likely, this has always happened, you just notice it more on the soft lead bullet. It can be a real pain to correct. You will probably have to shorten the bottom corner of the ramp, so that it protrudes less when the barrel is against the VIS. Thanks man. Never would have thought of that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ssanders224 Posted June 25, 2018 Share Posted June 25, 2018 23 minutes ago, B_RAD said: Thanks man. Never would have thought of that. No problem. Make sure it is not setting your bullet back. Usually when the ramp is smacking the bullet that hard, your going to get a little setback. Probably not enough to cause any real issues, but it can make SDs look crazy across the chrono. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B_RAD Posted June 25, 2018 Author Share Posted June 25, 2018 1 hour ago, Ssanders224 said: No problem. Make sure it is not setting your bullet back. Usually when the ramp is smacking the bullet that hard, your going to get a little setback. Probably not enough to cause any real issues, but it can make SDs look crazy across the chrono. Yep. I had some dummy rounds loaded so I put one in the mag, started with the gun at slide lock and racked the slide back hard to chamber the round. No mark. I've had good SD when chrono but I'll be checking to see if it's seating the bullet deaper. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ssanders224 Posted June 25, 2018 Share Posted June 25, 2018 56 minutes ago, B_RAD said: Yep. I had some dummy rounds loaded so I put one in the mag, started with the gun at slide lock and racked the slide back hard to chamber the round. No mark. I've had good SD when chrono but I'll be checking to see if it's seating the bullet deaper. Yeah, you won't be able to recreate it by hand. When the slide chambers a round, I think it drags the top round in the mag forward a little sometimes. So the bullet is closer/against the frame, and the ramp smacks it when it comes back. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B_RAD Posted June 25, 2018 Author Share Posted June 25, 2018 1 hour ago, Ssanders224 said: Yeah, you won't be able to recreate it by hand. When the slide chambers a round, I think it drags the top round in the mag forward a little sometimes. So the bullet is closer/against the frame, and the ramp smacks it when it comes back. Good to know. Thanks again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trinimon Posted June 28, 2018 Share Posted June 28, 2018 Time to switch over to round nose pills me thinks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B_RAD Posted June 28, 2018 Author Share Posted June 28, 2018 (edited) 10 hours ago, Trinimon said: Time to switch over to round nose pills me thinks. Still wouldn't solve the issue of the feed ramp being too long. Ssanders224 correctly diagnosed the issue. My other gun has a the bottom edge of the feed ramp shortened and this doesn't happen with that gun. Edited June 28, 2018 by B_RAD Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
858 Posted June 28, 2018 Share Posted June 28, 2018 What gun? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trinimon Posted June 28, 2018 Share Posted June 28, 2018 3 hours ago, B_RAD said: Still wouldn't solve the issue of the feed ramp being too long. Ssanders224 correctly diagnosed the issue. My other gun has a the bottom edge of the feed ramp shortened and this doesn't happen with that gun. Would fine tuning the magazine's feed lips so that the rounds are slightly upward pointing resolve this problem? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B_RAD Posted June 28, 2018 Author Share Posted June 28, 2018 (edited) 12 minutes ago, Trinimon said: Would fine tuning the magazine's feed lips so that the rounds are slightly upward pointing resolve this problem? I personally think all my mags are tuned properly. They seem to hold the ammo at the right angles and stack well. I have no issues at all with feeding. Changing anything magazine related is just asking for another problem to pop up, IMO. I thought this was an issue that was due to OAL of the round. That's why I posted it here. Now it's pretty clear that it's related to the gun. Not sure if there's a problem so to speak, but I'm looking into it. Edited June 28, 2018 by B_RAD Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CHA-LEE Posted June 28, 2018 Share Posted June 28, 2018 Tuning the feed lips will make zero difference because the round is getting hit by the bottom edge of the feed ramp BEFORE the round is registered to the top of the feed lips. The "Second" round is getting hit when its still being pushed down buy the underside of the slide. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B_RAD Posted June 28, 2018 Author Share Posted June 28, 2018 I should add that I loaded up some rounds @ 1.180" and it did it to those too. Not as bad but it was still hitting them. Makes sense to me that the longer the OAL is, the more impact to the round. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CHA-LEE Posted June 28, 2018 Share Posted June 28, 2018 Check out the below thread as this exact issue has been discussed before..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B_RAD Posted June 28, 2018 Author Share Posted June 28, 2018 21 minutes ago, CHA-LEE said: Check out the below thread as this exact issue has been discussed before..... Thanks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trinimon Posted June 28, 2018 Share Posted June 28, 2018 Interesting. Learning new stuff everyday. Thanks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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