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4 hours ago, Blurryvisions said:

There is no other PCC that rivals the JP GMR-13/15?. Change my mind 

 

I couldn't agree more!  The quality of the parts and machining in this carbine are second to none.  JP makes one darn fine PCC 

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Just ordered mine yesterday, ran across this thread while researching ammo, so this is my first post here.  My pistol load is just shy of 128pf, looking to bump it up a bit for PCC.

 

MB

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Negative Ravage.  128 in your pistol load will be more in the JP.  Chrono to see but I would guess that will be 140ish PF in the JP.

 

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3 hours ago, Neomet said:

Negative Ravage.  128 in your pistol load will be more in the JP.  Chrono to see but I would guess that will be 140ish PF in the JP.

 

 

may depend on your load and how tight the barrel is, our zero 147 fmj load at 130 pf, chronoed 123, the 135 pf 124 montana gold chronoed 130 in one of our gmr15s, when it had around 300 rounds through the barrel.

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Interesting.  I picked up over 10 PF with 121s and E3.  You are correct though, different barrels, different results.  The chrono is the only way to know for sure.  

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Copy Neomet and Fastarget, will definitely chrono the 128pf stuff in the JP to see if it differs. Based on your comments, I'm of the mind that I should see an increase, but will gather data. Appreciate the input and looking forward to getting started in PCC.

 

MB

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On ‎7‎/‎13‎/‎2018 at 8:51 AM, Blurryvisions said:

There is no other PCC that rivals the JP GMR-13/15?. Change my mind 

 

There is ALWAYS something out there that will rival anything, it just depends on how much you want to spend.

 

I built mine, so far the functioning has been flawless. Only issue has been a +10 base pad on a Glock 31rd mag, that should be in the rear view now?

 

Every bullet weight, every different powder, it eats them all.

 

Base price when first built( I used a dot I had to get a feel for what I want) was a touch under $700, or maybe just a touch over, I don't remember. I spent $40 on a Battlelink Minimalist stock and it was worth every penny! Sub a Magpul MOE and I was definitely under $700. It is basic black with just a touch of shiny in strategic places.

 

I have since bought a dot for this gun, a Bushnell TR25 with a low riser. Not close to high end stuff, but works great. I also spent $75 on an Armaspec buffer that I don't need but think it may help with the big picture ?

 

I will also add if I were to buy an off the shelf gun, there is a very good chance it would be a JP, or maybe a Theuron Defense. The guy that owns the company used to work for a friend of mine.  If it was a JP, it would of course be the one that costs three grand! Why, "Merica!!!!

 

My point being this thing is getting big fast and also expensive fast. The base JP GMR15 is $1700. The bad ass one that was on the Dillon catalog a few months ago is three grand ! The difference being the side charging billet upper and a lot of eye candy. Granted, it is some VERY sweet eye candy, but still eye candy.

 

Most other buy and shoot guns seem to be right around the $1700 range, and as far as I have seen, they all still need an optic or two. I have seen ads for PCC guns with Leupold dot scopes that cost a grand! To shoot a human size paper target that is 30" feet away, not an elk that is 500yds away, or a steel target that is 1500yds away.( think PRS shooting)

 

Don't get me wrong, I build and alter and change in some way just about every gun I have ever owned. Maybe it's the tool and die maker in me, maybe my wife is right and I am never happy?

 

I love the stuff other people build for the individuality and personality they all possess,  I just question the cost. Especially since this game is getting bigger by the day and marketing is usurping performance and function.

 

At the end of the day, PCC seems to be great for the economy, and that is good for everyone! Make sure you mention that to an anti gunner!

Edited by SJMPCC022
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23 hours ago, SJMPCC022 said:

 

There is ALWAYS something out there that will rival anything, it just depends on how much you want to spend.

 

I built mine, so far the functioning has been flawless. Only issue has been a +10 base pad on a Glock 31rd mag, that should be in the rear view now?

 

Every bullet weight, every different powder, it eats them all.

 

Base price when first built( I used a dot I had to get a feel for what I want) was a touch under $700, or maybe just a touch over, I don't remember. I spent $40 on a Battlelink Minimalist stock and it was worth every penny! Sub a Magpul MOE and I was definitely under $700. It is basic black with just a touch of shiny in strategic places.

 

I have since bought a dot for this gun, a Bushnell TR25 with a low riser. Not close to high end stuff, but works great. I also spent $75 on an Armaspec buffer that I don't need but think it may help with the big picture ?

 

I will also add if I were to buy an off the shelf gun, there is a very good chance it would be a JP, or maybe a Theuron Defense. The guy that owns the company used to work for a friend of mine.  If it was a JP, it would of course be the one that costs three grand! Why, "Merica!!!!

 

My point being this thing is getting big fast and also expensive fast. The base JP GMR15 is $1700. The bad ass one that was on the Dillon catalog a few months ago is three grand ! The difference being the side charging billet upper and a lot of eye candy. Granted, it is some VERY sweet eye candy, but still eye candy.

 

Most other buy and shoot guns seem to be right around the $1700 range, and as far as I have seen, they all still need an optic or two. I have seen ads for PCC guns with Leupold dot scopes that cost a grand! To shoot a human size paper target that is 30" feet away, not an elk that is 500yds away, or a steel target that is 1500yds away.( think PRS shooting)

 

Don't get me wrong, I build and alter and change in some way just about every gun I have ever owned. Maybe it's the tool and die maker in me, maybe my wife is right and I am never happy?

 

I love the stuff other people build for the individuality and personality they all possess,  I just question the cost. Especially since this game is getting bigger by the day and marketing is usurping performance and function.

 

At the end of the day, PCC seems to be great for the economy, and that is good for everyone! Make sure you mention that to an anti gunner!

You sir did not change my mind. However I like your post haha. Thanks for the perspective ????

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I just haven’t seen another gun run more reliable then a JP and the fit finish and attention to detail is second to none 

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2 hours ago, Blurryvisions said:

You sir did not change my mind. However I like your post haha. Thanks for the perspective ????

 

2 hours ago, Blurryvisions said:

I just haven’t seen another gun run more reliable then a JP and the fit finish and attention to detail is second to none 

The fact that you called me sir makes me think you are making fun of my age !

Read that as a joke, I'm guessing you were being polite and respectful. I appreciate it, that s**t does matter!

 

I wasn't trying to change any minds, it was more or less just rambling with a strong dose of venting.( my wife gets it, if you don't call her and she will explain)

 

My main point ( albeit not laid out in a very clear and concise way) was the cost of a PCC gun ready for USPSA competition.

 

A very short history lesson....... in December of 2012, a sick and twisted , but well known to the community POS named Adam Lanza stole an AR 15 from his loser mother and walked into a grade school and murdered a dozen or more first graders. Fast forward 30 to 45 days and mil spec AR's are $1000.00 at gun shows and 5.56/.223 ammo is 1$ a round at said shows. Not to mention .22lr would be non existent for a few years at least.

 

Fast forward again to today and .22lr is still three times the cost it should be, although readily available. 5.56/.223 ammo is all over the place available, and at a gun show you have trouble giving away an AR in .223/5.56.

 

But, chamber one in 9mm and BAM! $1800 or more.

 

I'm not being negative in any way, just trying to ask  a few honest questions.

 

My last honest question.............................. specific to the GMR 15. A good guy I shoot with has one and admits it is pretty heavy, but he says it helps keep it flat when he burns down stages. ( he is an A on his way to M) When I built mine I specifically tried to keep it as light as possible, knowing the end game was USPSA. My theory was it is a 9mm in a rifle and navigating field courses and transitioning between targets quickly is more important than a heavier gun mitigating recoil ?   FYI....................... mine is just a touch over 6#. 

Edited by SJMPCC022
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It's personal preference. I have shot a 14.5" JP set up with a comp and a 16" JP set up with a SiCo Omega 9k for "standard length" guns. I've also practiced with a 10.5" SBR with a comp and with the Omega. I actually have long arms and get cramped feelings on hand guards when things get too short like a 5" barrel PCC a buddy has. As far as class, I'm an OK shooter. I suppose I am on the larger size so weight probably doesn't affect me as much but I am by no means close to "Vanilla Gorilla" status. I'm not improving my splits to the point that i'm picking up chicks with any of the "heavier" setups and I'm certainly not running faster  than some of the gazelles in fancy shirts with my 10.5" and comp setup. The only time I have found weight matters is first shots with children and extremely small framed shooters. To be honest, the 10.5" with the Omega is the best setup for that type of first timer because of the total lack of concussion from the shot. If you want I can put them on scales to get weight estimates but the point is this: 

Practice and hard work with a gun that is utterly reliable is far more important than chasing the new, latest or greatest. As a new shooter buying the JP allows you to put 50,000 rounds down range with damn near any ammo and without wasting your time fixing things.
 

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2 hours ago, Darqusoull13 said:

It's personal preference. I have shot a 14.5" JP set up with a comp and a 16" JP set up with a SiCo Omega 9k for "standard length" guns. I've also practiced with a 10.5" SBR with a comp and with the Omega. I actually have long arms and get cramped feelings on hand guards when things get too short like a 5" barrel PCC a buddy has. As far as class, I'm an OK shooter. I suppose I am on the larger size so weight probably doesn't affect me as much but I am by no means close to "Vanilla Gorilla" status. I'm not improving my splits to the point that i'm picking up chicks with any of the "heavier" setups and I'm certainly not running faster  than some of the gazelles in fancy shirts with my 10.5" and comp setup. The only time I have found weight matters is first shots with children and extremely small framed shooters. To be honest, the 10.5" with the Omega is the best setup for that type of first timer because of the total lack of concussion from the shot. If you want I can put them on scales to get weight estimates but the point is this: 

Practice and hard work with a gun that is utterly reliable is far more important than chasing the new, latest or greatest. As a new shooter buying the JP allows you to put 50,000 rounds down range with damn near any ammo and without wasting your time fixing things.
 

 

Nicely done....+++++

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20 hours ago, SJMPCC022 said:

 

 

My last honest question.............................. specific to the GMR 15. A good guy I shoot with has one and admits it is pretty heavy, but he says it helps keep it flat when he burns down stages. ( he is an A on his way to M) When I built mine I specifically tried to keep it as light as possible, knowing the end game was USPSA. My theory was it is a 9mm in a rifle and navigating field courses and transitioning between targets quickly is more important than a heavier gun mitigating recoil ?   FYI....................... mine is just a touch over 6#. 

 

 

I like a heavier PCC rifle for the same reasons I like a heavy pistol and AR, it keeps me from over swinging on target transitions.  I drive the rifle into the target much more efficiently and faster with a heavier setup and experience a much flatter shooting rifle.  But, the flatter shooting is a result of my increased grip pressure due to the weight, as opposed to the increased weight alone causing a flatter shooting rifle.

 

I shoot with a guy whose PCC setup is as light as possible.  I'm all over the place with his rifle, and he says mine is like moving a club,  Different strokes....

 

As far as recoil management goes, weight doesn't matter for me in a PCC  I can't discern a noticeable difference between a light gun and heavy one when shooting the same round.  Again just for me, recoil management in a 9mm PCC is more about proper stance and grip than rifle weight. Personally. I prefer a heavier gun.  I think finding the right round/rifle setup that is flat shooting is more important than weight. 

 

 

 

 

Edited by Mike H

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2 hours ago, Darqusoull13 said:

It's personal preference. I have shot a 14.5" JP set up with a comp and a 16" JP set up with a SiCo Omega 9k for "standard length" guns. I've also practiced with a 10.5" SBR with a comp and with the Omega. I actually have long arms and get cramped feelings on hand guards when things get too short like a 5" barrel PCC a buddy has. As far as class, I'm an OK shooter. I suppose I am on the larger size so weight probably doesn't affect me as much but I am by no means close to "Vanilla Gorilla" status. I'm not improving my splits to the point that i'm picking up chicks with any of the "heavier" setups and I'm certainly not running faster  than some of the gazelles in fancy shirts with my 10.5" and comp setup. The only time I have found weight matters is first shots with children and extremely small framed shooters. To be honest, the 10.5" with the Omega is the best setup for that type of first timer because of the total lack of concussion from the shot. If you want I can put them on scales to get weight estimates but the point is this: 

Practice and hard work with a gun that is utterly reliable is far more important than chasing the new, latest or greatest. As a new shooter buying the JP allows you to put 50,000 rounds down range with damn near any ammo and without wasting your time fixing things.
 

I just got mine on Monday and I love it. It is heavy but I'm a big guy, so I will up my workouts. It is flat shooting though. There is very little rise in this rifle. I'm using 6.6grs of HS-6 for my round and the sight lefts a little bit. I'm thinking about taking down my rounds down to 6.4grs. I wish I would have bought this rifle first instead of the MPX; which I will be selling ASAP. 

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2 hours ago, Darqusoull13 said:

Practice and hard work with a gun that is utterly reliable is far more important than chasing the new, latest or greatest. As a new shooter buying the JP allows you to put 50,000 rounds down range with damn near any ammo and without wasting your time fixing things.
 

 

If you decide to take our game seriously, the cost of the JP or whatever quality PCC should be a minor consideration.  If your gun is not reliable, it will hurt your scores even on stages where it runs 100%.  There will always be that little nagging thought in the back of your head  "will it or will it not" jam.

 

Now for the big picture (or how you will explain it to your spouse).  Many competitors will shoot 1000 rds a month in practice and matches.  That breaks down where that $1700 JP PCC cost you 14.2 cents per shot fired.  Not bad when you realize that you are spending a dime a round for ammo (my cost to reload 9mm).   Shoot the gun for another year and the cost per round continues to go down.  Or if you  discover PCC is not your game, sell it for close to what you paid for it (its a gun, not a Ford or Chevy, guns don't lose 25% of its value the first time it goes to the range).

 

If you like to tinker (I'm in this group) and can make a PCC run all the time, great.  If not, you need to buy a quality PCC that runs.

 

JMHO.

 

 

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That’s the cool thing about builds powered by JP parts. If you want to tinker, you can absolutely buy JP parts to tinker! 

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On 7/13/2018 at 7:51 AM, Blurryvisions said:

There is no other PCC that rivals the JP GMR-13/15?. Change my mind 

By the time you buy quality parts, include your valuable time, you may save a few bucks, the real advantage is that JP will take care of you if you have an issue.   

Have been shooting one since 6/27, was competitive out of the box, flawless function from the first round, have one on order for the Lady, the weight or lack of not an issue, I have no plans to win national championships, and until you get up there in the ranks you won't know the difference.   There is nothing more delightful than  having an instrument that functions flawlessly at a match, there is nothing worse than a piece  that frustrates you and wastes you time and entry fee ?

The only downside is that if you don't perform well, you can't blame that rifle ?

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1 hour ago, Mike H said:

I shoot with a guy whose PCC setup is as light as possible.  I'm all over the place with his rifle, and he says mine is like moving a club,  Different strokes....

I bought a little plastic piece that mounts on a short piece of rail out at the end of the hand guard. It works like a little handle, your finger sits in it and it allows you to really pull the gun into your shoulder. My solution to having a really light gun but also controlling recoil. I think it was $6.50 shipped on E Bay. 

54 minutes ago, Flatland Shooter said:

Now for the big picture (or how you will explain it to your spouse).  Many competitors will shoot 1000 rds a month in practice and matches.  That breaks down where that $1700 JP PCC cost you 14.2 cents per shot fired.  Not bad when you realize that you are spending a dime a round for ammo (my cost to reload 9mm).   Shoot the gun for another year and the cost per round continues to go down.  Or if you  discover PCC is not your game, sell it for close to what you paid for it (its a gun, not a Ford or Chevy, guns don't lose 25% of its value the first time it goes to the range).

That is absolute genius!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Nothing more needs to be said!

Edited by SJMPCC022
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37 minutes ago, SJMPCC022 said:

 

That is absolute genius!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Nothing more needs to be said!

 

Not genius, simple math. 

 

Genius was walking out the door with an empty gun case telling the little lady I was going to the gun show to sell off a few guns.    Then come home with the case loaded with a few new guns and complained that the sorry SOB's wouldn't give me anything for my guns so I brought them home. 

 

                      ?

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9 minutes ago, Flatland Shooter said:

 

Not genius, simple math. 

 

Genius was walking out the door with an empty gun case telling the little lady I was going to the gun show to sell off a few guns.    Then come home with the case loaded with a few new guns and complained that the sorry SOB's wouldn't give me anything for my guns so I brought them home. 

 

                      ?

 

?????????????.....................?

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12 minutes ago, Flatland Shooter said:

 

Not genius, simple math. 

 

Genius was walking out the door with an empty gun case telling the little lady I was going to the gun show to sell off a few guns.    Then come home with the case loaded with a few new guns and complained that the sorry SOB's wouldn't give me anything for my guns so I brought them home. 

 

                      ?

...and that’s when the fight started ?

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13 hours ago, Flatland Shooter said:

 

Not genius, simple math. 

 

Genius was walking out the door with an empty gun case telling the little lady I was going to the gun show to sell off a few guns.    Then come home with the case loaded with a few new guns and complained that the sorry SOB's wouldn't give me anything for my guns so I brought them home. 

 

                      ?

Nice !!!!!!!

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Not genius, simple math. 
 
Genius was walking out the door with an empty gun case telling the little lady I was going to the gun show to sell off a few guns.    Then come home with the case loaded with a few new guns and complained that the sorry SOB's wouldn't give me anything for my guns so I brought them home. 
 
                      

lol good stuff


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Mine arrived late last week and it’s everything I expected.  It runs flawlessly, it’s fast and flat.  I ordered the short stroke conversion and should have it in hand later this week.

 

MB

Edited by RAVAGE88

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