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redpillregret

Do polymer guns serve a purpose in USPSA production anymore

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Cz makes a great gun but shoot what you got and stick with it. I have switched guns to find the right on and finally just went all out and bought an sti. If you get ready to buy a cz let me know I have one I am getting ready to put out for sale since switching to limited with the STI. 

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On 6/20/2018 at 1:58 PM, redpillregret said:

Good info, thank you. The money I was going to slowly devote to a CZ I just may spend on a Dillon and reloading components/gear and perhaps a class with a GM.

 

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This is a great plan.  Some of the best shooters in my area are using relatively stock Glocks and M&Ps.  I know several guys who have switched from Glocks to CZs and guess what, they still can't touch those top guys with their plastic guns.  It really is all about the fundamentals.

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Posted (edited)
On 6/20/2018 at 12:58 PM, redpillregret said:

...The money I was going to slowly devote to a CZ I just may spend on a Dillon and reloading components/gear and perhaps a class with a GM.

 

😧😳

 

You don’t reload (so practicing much is a serious financial strain) and you were going to switch guns first?!!!

 

Order I went:

Begin with plastic gun

Buy Dillon 650

Switch platic guns (Lefty goe to an ambi one from G34)

 

<continue for 5 years>

 

Take class from Ben Stoeger

Switch to Tanfoglio

Have fun with it for 8 months

Sell M&P, Glocks, Tanfo

 

Bought a trio of Walthers. (PPQ, PPS, Q5)  Enjoying the simple life, practicing, slowly getting better.

 

Take a lesson from the besy local shooter as soon as you can - so that you learn how to practice skills RIGHT. Then Dillon it up and get to where you can load your own ammo at 50% of retail, and work on those skills.

 

(A newcomer doesn’t need a top name to show them how to draw and reload and transition quickly. Spend money on a big name instructor later on when you have that chance.)

 

You’ll be crushing the guys who say a Glock isn’t competitive pretty quickly.

 

Edited by MemphisMechanic

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Good thread for me as three years in, I too have metal gun fever despite having the perfect Limited gun for me: XDM 5.5 in .40. My problem is I’ve also caught wheelgun fever but not man enough to shoot that in USPSA. I dry fire three times a week, live fire once a week and shoot one or two matches a month. My next hurdle is figuring out reloading. I’ve saved my brass and have been cleaning and sorting getting ready to make the plunge on a press. Like suggested above, I take one class a year from a local GM. I was tempted to take a class from a national champion this summer but decided I needed more experience in order to get the benefit. 

 

Just an observation: the 2011 guys spend a lot more time in the safety area with a tool box than those who shoot Plastic Fantastics. But I think the metal gun guys are into tinkering anyway. 

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You don’t reload (so practicing much is a serious financial strain) and you were going to switch guns first?!!!

 

Order I went:

Begin with plastic gun

Buy Dillon 650

Switch platic guns (Lefty goe to an ambi one from G34)

 

 

Take class from Ben Stoeger

Switch to Tanfoglio

Have fun with it for 8 months

Sell M&P, Glocks, Tanfo

 

Bought a trio of Walthers. (PPQ, PPS, Q5)  Enjoying the simple life, practicing, slowly getting better.

 

Take a lesson from the besy local shooter as soon as you can - so that you learn how to practice skills RIGHT. Then Dillon it up and get to where you can load your own ammo at 50% of retail, and work on those skills.

 

(A newcomer doesn’t need a top name to show them how to draw and reload and transition quickly. Spend money on a big name instructor later on when you have that chance.)

 

You’ll be crushing the guys who say a Glock isn’t competitive pretty quickly.

 

 

 

I do currently reload. But upgrading to a Dillon and possibly a Mark 7 should save me time, which is a commodity for me.

 

I wouldn’t mind buying large lots of components at some point.

 

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At the danger of drifting the thread, do the Glock “dryfire mags serve any purpose or do reloads eliminate their usefulness?



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The dry fire mag will help trigger pull, transitions, draw to first shot, and any drill that of course doesn’t require a reload.  It’s really helpful but kind of pricey.  I looked at a lot of other methods but they all required disassembly of the gun.  What I do is use the mag for awhile and when I want to practice reloads just remove and change over.  Because the mag bottom is orange you know that the dry fire mag is in the gun so I will just leave it in and whenever I want to do trigger work just pick it up and start practicing.

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Cant go wrong with a glock or s&w in production or carry optics. 

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On 6/19/2018 at 11:41 AM, wtturn said:

Anyone who says the heavy steel guns are easier to shoot well is a liar.

Okay, that may be a little extreme.

I'm just salty over how much trouble it has been for me to learn this dumb CZ I'm shooting now versus my old trusty G34.

I came up on Glocks. Made GM with one, won some matches with one, beat a whole lot of CZs and tanfos on the way. Now that I'm trying to learn a CZ (had to have a legal gun for ipsc production) I realize just how good I had it with the Glock.

The gun doesn't matter. It just doesn't. Steel guns are en vogue right now because they're super pretty and heavy and they have really nice triggers, especially in SA. Glocks are cheap, the trigger can be made light, and it's the same pull every time. You can also draw and throw them around in transitions with less effort.

In the end, just pick something you like and commit to it. After this experience with both, I firmly believe neither one has an inherent net advantage over the other.

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Reading thru this thread and I came across your post. I guess us Americans like 5" plus guns and the rest if the world doesn't. I'm surprised. 

 

Question, why not just go with the 17 instead of the switch to the CZ?  

 

 

 

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Definitely.  I know shooters who do very well with Glocks and the other polymer-framed guns.  I recently set up a G22 for competition and will be shooting it on Thursday nights once in a while.  I'm a 1911 man to the core but I like Glocks for what they are.

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I thought about switching to a Tangfo or CZ from my G17 because it’s what all the cool guys seem to be doing, but I recently started to dy fire consistently and practice specific drills in live fire (instead of just running and gunning) and the difference in 2mo is very noticeable.  

 

I’ll stick with the  plastic gun and spend that money on training.  

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I'm a novice as many of you.
I took Mike Seeklander's class and here is his recommendation: ".. don't fight your equipment. Find something that is comfortable and works for you and practice. The secret is in the reps :)"

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some people still run glocks in the open devision. Although they are heavily customized, they still have theyre polymer frame. In the carry optics devision the #1 gun is the M&P C.O.R.E. which is a polymer framed pistol. I dont think they are going anywhere anytime soon.

 

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I started with 1911s and then got a 17L Glock when they first came out to use in Open and the only problem I encountered with it was the different grip angle between Glocks and 1911s.  Then I got one of the first STIs that had CMC on the grips.  Chip sold them for awhile when they first came out.  Practice with what you shoot is, as mentioned numerous times above, the most important part.

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I started with a Glock 17. 

Using CZ Shadow 2 now. 

I'm not saying it's better because it's metal, or has a better trigger in SA, I'm saying it's better to find a gun that fits you, and you have confidence in. As stated above don't fight your equipment. 

That being said I just bought a G34 MOS to play in carry optics with 🤷‍♂️

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Interesting thread. I've done three matches now, all with my P226.

 

This coming Sunday I'm going to run my G19 for the first time just to see how it goes. I've been using it for dryfire and practice for a few weeks now.

I wish it was a 17 or 34, but I'm not willing to shell out to find out it might not work the best for me.

 

I've had my eye on a CZ before I even started USPSA; there's a good chance it's in my future but I don't think at my current skill level there is enough to make it worth it when I can spend that time on ammo and training materials.

 

I'd say about 40% of the people in production at my local matches use Glocks, and I've definitely seen M&Ps and the like.

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On 6/19/2018 at 5:57 PM, Rez805 said:

...

As a sidenote: There are some pretty competitive guys who stood on the podium at Iron Sights Nationals in the Limited Division last year.

1) Glock

2) Custom 2011

3) Glock

 

I know, I know, you asked about production. But when you think about it Limited seems like an even tougher place to find success with a Polymer Framed Pistol. It would have been interesting to see where Sevigny would have ended up (in either division).

 

 

Their Glocks though are custom though and cost $1,500+ for customization on top of a factory Glock. About the same as an STI Edge with a trigger job.

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my .02$

 

The differences between X and Y pistol are going to be incremental at best, arguably non-existent based on top match finishes. Now, there is a good point to make about personal wants in regards to pistols. If you think glocks are ugly and CZ's are sweet, you'll like the CZ more and want to shoot it, practice, dry fire. 

 

Personally I think there's a cool factor to running "duty" guns in production. I shoot a G34 and started with a G19. I also don't mind at all competing against Tanfo, CZ, etc. because I truly don't think there's a competitive advantage (if both guns have attention payed to their modifications), just shooter's preference. 

 

Another thing is that I carry a G26 and a G19. I put most of my reps in with my competition G34 but I can pull out my 26 any day of the week and be totally tuned in. I would not want to put most reps and rounds through a completely different platform than what I carry, so that's something to consider. 

Edited by SweetToof

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Shoot for a while first before spending money on much of anything.  Good belt, good kydex holster for that Glock, functional mag pouches, and ammo.  Go shoot.  The Glock will take you as far as you want to go. Your wants may change as you progress.  Wait to see how you progress.  There are countless guys with several thousand dollar guns sitting in safes that bought something they weren’t ready for, or wound up not liking.  Well built guns absolutely make a huge difference.....at the top levels.  This discussion is like the D level shooters obsessing over weight and such....the current skills don’t benefit.  Entry level competitors have far more to worry about than how the gun runs or shoots comparatively, as long as it runs.  Glocks are amazing guns to practice with. Beat it up, wear out the finish, drop it, hit it, whatever, and it still goes.  If you are beginning, as you say, you are at least a year from any real decisions.

 

on the VP9 subject, tried one out cause I loved the gun.  As is the case in both competition and training, the gun you love may not fit.  I would absolutely focus on the Glock.  You mentioned accuracy, well, in this sport, in the early stages, expect that to go right out the window no matter what you shoot as soon as you hear....BEEEEEP!

 

 

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Yes I think so. All about  griping the gun

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I really don't see that big of a difference.  My friend Hawansik Kim is killing it with a PPQ.  At the end of the day shooting is just a good sight picture and trigger pull.  

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For the record, my match last weekend had three GMs and the two who I observed were both running P320s, so polymer striker guns still seem to have a place.

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My striker fired pick is the Plastic M&P; but I don't consider it operationally different from or better than Glock, HK, Walther, XD, etc.

 

I have the perception that the swing to CZ and TZ is driven by their success in IPSC Production which has a first shot minimum 5 lb trigger.  The DA/SA guns can follow that with a 2 lb trigger for the rest of the stage, the Glock types cannot. 

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I run both an STI and iM& P. I shoot well with either or at least well for myself but I do like the heavier gun better feel like follow-up shots are quicker that being said I lose a lot of times to glocks and other plastic guns LOL. Just practice with what you have


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